My Fiero's suspension is a mess, it needs one rear strut, one rear ball joint, one upper front ball joint, an alignment. Right now the word handling cannot be used in a sentence about my car. My plan is to replace the offending parts (in proper pairs, unlike the previous owner) and do some simple upgrades to the handling.

I am about to gather together the parts and do the following suspension upgrade, since I haven't actually ordered any parts yet there is still time to make changes.

1985 Fiero base coupe (4 cylinder 5 speed) with complete 1984 front and rear suspensions.

Keeping, front shocks (Monroe), rubber front bushings, rubber cradle mounts (for now).

Adding
1) Definite A-body struts at the rear NIB given to me free so I though I would try them (gas filled Monroe). Let me know if you have tried this. Can't afford not to try it, are there any intereference problems with the 15X7 wheels and 215 to 235/60 tires?

2) Definite Moog problem solver upper front ball joints. (so I can dial in some negative camber)

3) Definite Moog caster kit (bolt and shims (washers)) so I can adjust for more caster. Also replaces 19 year old hardware.

4) Definite Gerald Storvik's, uhmw rear control arm bushings, or polyurethene. The 8shark bushings are adjustable and should not squek, who has tried them, report in please.

5) Maybe Fiero store sway bars 1" front and 7/8" rear. I realize that Will will probably chime in on this one, Will, if you can suggest a tire and alignment package for the 15X7 GT wheels which will allow me to use a front bar on the rear without any nasty effects like increasing the trailing throttle oversteer I will do it (save $300US at the same time). Gerald, how do you feel I could best spend my money for a good handling daily driver?

6) Definite No lowering, too many variables and not good for the frost heaved roads around here.

7) Alignment specs, open to suggestion, for now close to stock but with more caster, negative camber, and a little toe-in front and rear.

I will be using the GT wheels and I am on a very tight budget so please, no suggestions for radical changes. I want a good handling daily driver which may see a little autocross (very little probably so it is not a priority). My biggest concerns are control and handling feel, with good highway stability, not a twitchy, high-g autocross car.

I realize that this topic has come up many times and I was usually involved in the discussion, but now I want to put together the right components to make the most of what I have learned.

Ira

Also, I plan to use the Fiero Store braided steel brake flex hoses insted of OEM rubber (price difference is not that much and I suspect it will give me a firmer brake feel)

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The Iron Duke Resource Site

Sig design by MinnGreenGT

[This message has been edited by Monza76 (edited 08-23-2003).]

The A-body struts I looked at in the junk yard had splash guards or something next to the spring perch. Big tires may interfere with these an necessitate their removal.

I've used as big as 245/60-15 Dunlop GT Qualifiers ($CHEAP) on the 15x7 wheels. With that much sidewall, they needed about 40 psi to keep from rolling over. If you want to stay closer to stock diameter and give your duke a little better gearing, you might try 245/50-15. I've never tried that size on those wheels, but I think a couple of people here on the forum have. That gives you room to play in the 195-205 range on your front tires while still keeping a good front/rear tire split. This should also let you use a stock front bar on the rear.

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'87 Fiero GT: Northstar, Getrag, TGP wheels, rear sway bar, rod end links, bushings, etc.

'90 Pontiac 6000 SE AWD: Leaking ABS unit fixed, load levelling rear suspension fixed, still slow

Will, sounds good, I may use 195/60 front but 245 sounds a little wide for a 7" wheel, that is over 2 1/2" wider than the wheel. How about a 225/55 or 60, is that too narrow with the 195 front?

I could also go a little taller (at the loss of some crispness) and use 185/70 front and 215/60 rear, any comments on that combination? BTW these were the original tire sizes for the Porsche 911 Turbo

I take it from your comments that the rest of my plan should be OK. Am I reading that correctly?

Ira

[This message has been edited by Monza76 (edited 08-23-2003).]

I have 225/50/15's all the way around on my daily driver 86 GT and they are great!

Tyler

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85 LT4 GT
Custom Everything

quote Originally posted by Monza76: 6) Definite No lowering, too many variables and not good for the frost heaved roads around here.

Ira, since your website has been such a huge help to me I'd be happppy to share some of my most significant suspension changes with you.

I won't address basic things. A-a's, b-joints etc. I can tell you that a slight decrease in ride height will add SIGNIFICANT improvement to handling and reduce rear bumpsteer noticably. Eibach's less than an inch drop, with only a slight rate increase are variable rate and will actually feel more comfortable than stock springs even on rough roads. And although slightly stiffer than stock I would consider it soft compared to what I like.

I've been running 8sharks rear a-arm UHMW's (no offset) for more than a year and love them and they did help considerably along with aluminum e.-cradle bushings from WCF to bring the rear into submission (struts,springs, ty-rod ends need to be perfect). A BIG herb Adams front bar bolted to the frame by 8sharks aluminum pillow blocks was balanced by a Fiero store rear bar with 8shark solid end link bushings.

I will end here with much more I could share but will add that with the solid bushings in the rear I lost no ride comfort at all nor did it increase noise or have any down-side whatsoever.

BTW, after all this I went with Koni's replacing kyb's. Talk about takin' it up a notch. I've driven an 89' 911 turbo that did'nt have near the cornering power or control...or the fun.

The number one complement I get after disbelief that a car can corner that fast is how smoooth my car is.

Ira, you mentioned toe-in at the front. You want slight if any, 0-16th toe-OUT @ the front. Toe in in front can be destabilizing.

More later, John

87'gt3.4
ST300lb 1.5" drop
gt wheels w/SO-3's/225/50 rear, 205/55 frt
-1.5 camber w/16th-8th" toe-in rear
-1.0 camber,6+ caster, 0-16th toe-out frt

[This message has been edited by 2fn4wrds (edited 08-24-2003).]

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[This message has been edited by 2fn4wrds (edited 08-24-2003).]

2fn4wrds Thanks for the info, gives me more to consider.

Ira

You got a very good plan started. But if I may, I'd like to suggest an item that could stand to be replaced ... especially after so many years of road duty. Replace the A-arm bushings ... front upper & lower .... rear lower (there is no rear upper, of course). You do not need to go with the polyurethane parts. I installed rubber bushings of a higher durometer rating than the originals. But if you want the poly's, go with it. This replacement alone made my car "feel" new again.

Pressing the bushings out & in can be a pain. I cut some 180-degree segments of exhaust tubing, and tackwelded them in the A-arms to prevent them from being crushed while pressing (the A-arms are nothing more than sheet metal stampings) ... then left them there (with a coat of paint).

I also used a variety of wrench sockets of various diameters as spacers while pressing.

[This message has been edited by WAWUZAT (edited 08-24-2003).]

[This message has been edited by WAWUZAT (edited 08-24-2003).]

I didn't see sway bar bushings or end links on your list - or the steering stabilizer. Personally, I like factory rubber for both bushings and end links on the front sway bar; a little bit of "give" here seems to help out when cornering on uneven surfaces. If you want a bit "crisper" response, then poly end links are good - but I'd stick with rubber for the bar bushings unless you like the squeaking sounds; they're low and exposed and they'll sing like birds in no time if you use poly here...

The steering stabilizer - what it does is hard to describe adequately. The one you have is probably shot and you may want to replace it. A good stabilizer will suppress that twitchy kick-back you may notice on rough surfaces - but it will also slow the steering down. You might not want the stabilizer for autocross, but I think you'll definitely want a good one for the street - it'll make the car "easier" to drive and reduce driver fatigue on long trips.

No need to lower the suspension if you don't want to. But, I would go with lower profile tires. Looks like you have 15" wheels, so go with 225-50-15 on the back and 205-50-15 on the front. I'd replace all ball joints, tie rod ends, and steering stabilizer with Moog parts. Definitely replace the control arm bushings, preferably with poly. Good tires can make a world of difference with handling. Good luck.

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[This message has been edited by USFiero (edited 11-22-2003).]