Were you following the thread a couple of days ago on brake upgrades? Walt Zettner used LeBaron disks for his '87 V8 conversion. Go ask at your local CarQuest store or look up your local scrap yard on the web.
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08:19 PM
Archie Member
Posts: 9436 From: Las Vegas, NV Registered: Dec 1999
You will need a front set of 84-87 rotors turned down to become "hubs". You will need a set of adapter brackets.. I suggest contacting sluppy123 he has supplied many forum members including me.
You will also need a few other things.. 2ea 89-94 Lebaron rear rotors w/ 15 or 16 inch wheels 2ea 83-92 Camaro front calipers w/o performance brakes 1 set of front brake pads for a 83-92 camaro 10ea m12-1.5 x 54mm wheel studs NAPA pn 641-1581 1ea 92-94 full size blazer/yukon 1.125 bore master cylinder p/n M2219 I ordered 4 braided steel front hoses from the Fiero store also
This is just for the front brakes off the top of my head. This isnt all you need.
Here are a few pics. Did I mention you need 16 inch or larger wheels to clear?
Hope this helps.
Steven
------------------ '02 Subaru WRX 14.61@91.87mph bone stock '87 Fiero GT 4.9/4T60e w/3.33 final drive, ZEX nitrous 65hp shot, 88 cradle w/ 325# coil overs, Poly everything, Upgraded sway bars, KYB's, 16X7 M11's, 11.25 "Zettner" front brakes, Complete MSD ignition w/ 6AL box, Custom 2.5" Flowmaster exhaust, Grand Sport Corvette paint, Carbon fiber interior trim, '98 T/A CD w/ ETR, Reverse Indiglo guages, Pillar mounted AutoMeter O2, Hella H4 conversion. Follow its built up here: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/027460.html Sadly... SOLD.
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06:13 PM
Razor_Wing Member
Posts: 1753 From: Blowing Rock, NC, USA Registered: Apr 2003
It's not the rotors. I pulled a couple sets (front & rear) of 11.25 Lebaron GTC to upgrade the brakes on my Shelby Charger. While the GTC did have 16" wheels, a 15" wheel fits. I have even bolted on a 15" Fiero lace wheel and it fits too. However, the Fiero brake upgrade uses a Camaro caliper in the front and (as I recall) a Cadillac caliper in the rear. These calipers are larger than those on the Chrysler products which likely causes the clearance problems with the 15" wheels.
------------------ FierOmar
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02:29 AM
BV MotorSports Member
Posts: 4821 From: Oak Hill, WV Registered: May 2001
It's not the rotors. I pulled a couple sets (front & rear) of 11.25 Lebaron GTC to upgrade the brakes on my Shelby Charger. While the GTC did have 16" wheels, a 15" wheel fits. I have even bolted on a 15" Fiero lace wheel and it fits too. However, the Fiero brake upgrade uses a Camaro caliper in the front and (as I recall) a Cadillac caliper in the rear. These calipers are larger than those on the Chrysler products which likely causes the clearance problems with the 15" wheels.
I just wanted to post a few notes on this brake upgrade.
1. I have seen one person use the front rotors from the LeBaron and it worked really well. Only different spacers were needed and the brake pads didn't hang off on the inside like with the rear LeBaron rotors.
2. A few people included myself didn't use the hockey stick shaped brackets that Zettner designed. Instead the E-brake hardware from the Cadilac is used which attaches to the caliper itself. This routes the E-brake cable under the axle just like the stock Fiero configuration. An additional benefit to this configuration is that the stock brake lines can be used.
3. The length of the parking brake cables have been an issue for more than a few people. It appears as if some of the aftermarket cables are shorter than what came from the factory. This affects you with both parking brake configurations.
4. You are required to do some grinding on both the front and rear calipers for the brake lines.
5 Don't forget about having to enlarge the hub diameter of the rear rotors or turning down the rear bearings.
6. The front steering stops are removed in this upgrade. They can be reinstalled if you cut off the arms for the stock calipers. If you don't reinstall the steering stops the calipers might come in contact with your shocks.
7. The rear knuckles need to have the support flange for the stock calipers ground/cut off.
Hope this info helps some of the potential brake swappers.
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[This message has been edited by Jefrysuko (edited 11-30-2003).]
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02:38 PM
Nov 30th, 2003
FierOmar Member
Posts: 1646 From: Glendale, California, USA Registered: Dec 2001
"...only different spacers were needed" Which spacers are you referring to? Also, I didn't realize that the inside pad would hang off the rotor. Any photos?
"...only different spacers were needed" Which spacers are you referring to? Also, I didn't realize that the inside pad would hang off the rotor. Any photos?
There are spacers which go between the adapters and the knuckles.
It is both the inner and outer pads which hang off the rotors. This occures on both the front and rear of the car and both the inner and outer diameters of the rotors.
This picture shows how the pad hangs off the inner diameter of the rotor. The outer diameter isn't as significant.
P.S. I added an item to my post above.
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09:47 PM
Dec 1st, 2003
FierOmar Member
Posts: 1646 From: Glendale, California, USA Registered: Dec 2001
The front GTC rotors have a larger surface since there is no need to leave space for the internal "drum style" parking brake. The larger surface on the rotor might allow the pads to be moved (slightly)inward on the radius... might allow for the use of 15" wheels.
4. You are required to do some grinding on both the front and rear calipers for the brake lines.
I checked brake hose fittings... The Camaro fitting will work on the Fiero caliper... If you get stainless brake hoses made, you could have them made with the Camaro caliper fitting and it will be fine.
------------------ '87 Fiero GT: Northstar, Getrag, TGP wheels, rear sway bar, rod end links, bushings, etc. '90 Pontiac 6000 SE AWD: Leaking ABS unit fixed, load levelling rear suspension fixed, still slow
Does anyone know what rotors other than the rear Lebaron will work? The drum for the parking brakes adds alot of weight. Does anyone know a PN# for the Power Stop Rotors without the parking drum?
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08:57 PM
Dec 2nd, 2003
FierOmar Member
Posts: 1646 From: Glendale, California, USA Registered: Dec 2001
Actually, the Lebaron rear rotor may be a little lighter than the front. I have a couple of each sitting around in my garage. I'll try to weigh each and snap a couple photos. They say a picture is worth a kilo of words (or something like that).
I checked brake hose fittings... The Camaro fitting will work on the Fiero caliper... If you get stainless brake hoses made, you could have them made with the Camaro caliper fitting and it will be fine.
Unfortunately not. You are right that it would mount on the caliper right and that would work on the rear of the car. On the front however that would cause the brake lines to come in contact with the steering link attachment.
Someone had some pictures of this at one time. Where is MinnGreen when you need a link?
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11:30 PM
Dec 3rd, 2003
Will Member
Posts: 14274 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
Unfortunately not. You are right that it would mount on the caliper right and that would work on the rear of the car. On the front however that would cause the brake lines to come in contact with the steering link attachment.
?? The steering link attachment is on the opposite side of knuckle from the caliper.
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09:08 AM
jeffndebrus Member
Posts: 2772 From: Jacksonville, Fl- usa Registered: Aug 2001
why beat yourself to death trying to invent something that Archie has already developed?
Because not everyone has the money to spend on stuff like this. Time is money, some people don't have the time, but they have access to materials and methods necessary for producing something like this (or other things) Others do it simply because they can, because they get satisfaction out of building something for themselves and not just simply buying something and sticking it on.
why beat yourself to death trying to invent something that Archie has already developed?
Archie didn't "develop" this brake upgrade. A man named Walt Zettner is the one who designed the brackets. Walt published his brake upgrade in a Fiero publication a long time ago and shared the drawings for the brackets. Archie simply made the brackets himself and buys/makes all the other required components and sells it as a kit.
Archie didn't "develop" this brake upgrade. A man named Walt Zettner is the one who designed the brackets. Walt published his brake upgrade in a Fiero publication a long time ago and shared the drawings for the brackets. Archie simply made the brackets himself and buys/makes all the other required components and sells it as a kit.
One thing for sure is that I didn't develope it but I think that it's one nice setup & you can't beat the price. One thing that I've done with it is put it on several (about 25) cars and I have it on almost all of my own cars.
Actually a guy named Darrel Behring at RCC would agrue that point with you. His story is that he sold WZ a brake kit that had all the part numbers machined off of them. He then took the parts to a parts store and started researching where the parts came from. No telling who is telling the story right but I remember seeing it at Darrel's place a long time before WZ had it wrote up in the old FOA newsletter.
Now as far as the pads hanging off, let me add a little to that. On the rotor in the pictures earlier in this thread the outside pad hangs off only about 1/16", the inside pad doesn't hang off. On the outside edge of the rotor both pads hang off about 1/16". If that bothers you then gring a little off the pad before installation. Or use the rotors that are U.S. made and they don't have that area where they hang off on the inside.
quote
Originally posted by Will:
Gotta grind on the caliper to get the fittings to fit... The edges of the pads hang off the edges of the rotor friction surface...
Just how developed is this upgrade, really?
Well Will,
IMHO, this combination of parts from different manufacturers couldn't fit or work better on a non-stock application.
I know you'd like to put a slam on me, but you missed this time.
Archie
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08:06 PM
Dec 4th, 2003
Will Member
Posts: 14274 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
Archie, you are far from being the only entity who markets this kit. WCF has a version, RCC has a version, Held has a version, and Sluppy sells the brackets.
They all have the same problems: need to grind the caliper, brackets bolt to unmachined surface on knuckle, lack of steering stop, etc. Yours seems to have a couple of more small problems because you insist on using the LeBaron rear rotors. As noted above, the fronts have more friction surface and match the Camaro pads better.
Stop being so self centered.
------------------ '87 Fiero GT: Northstar, Getrag, TGP wheels, rear sway bar, rod end links, bushings, etc. '90 Pontiac 6000 SE AWD: Leaking ABS unit fixed, load levelling rear suspension fixed, still slow
[This message has been edited by Will (edited 12-05-2003).]
Archie, I have heard the rumor that RCC actually was the first with the upgrade and your version is about the 3rd variation. I guess since WZ published something on it he has gotten most of the credit even if not deserved.
The only thing that bothers me about the pads hanging off is that I did not know about it before I started. If I would have known about it I would have either used the front rotors like I stated before or the U.S. made ones like you mentioned.
Even with the "problems" you are right it is one heck of a brake upgrade. So far it is the best thing I have done to any of the Fieros I have owned over the years. Hopefully I can surpass it with an engine upgrade in the future.
what he said
