what would it do for me?
How much would it cost?
How much more horse power would it give me?
What would be the difference?
Can I make my 2.8 look nice with after market chrome and vavle covers?

Where do I buy this stuff from?

Anyone done this already? and if so what does your motor look like? Mileage?

Read this thread: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/054235.html

But they are talking about a 3.4 not a standard 2.8

Same application. Different engine volume.

Here is a basic list. I hope it helps. Run a couple searchs in Technical on Carb

1. ported exhaust manifolds
2. I re-worked my crossover into 2.5" pipe with no restrictions
3. Then 2.5" mandrell bent exhaust, no CAT, Moroso racing muffler
4. MSD ignition and coil
5. Vacuum advance distributor (tunable)
6. Edelbrock dual plane intake - Torker II or Performer Plus
7. Holley 390 cfm carb (spring kits to fine tune) - #49 jets or Holley 2300 2 barrel
8. Moroso 14" racing air cleaner (really high flow) with 1.5" cleaner spacer to clear the distributor. You can also use a plain 9" cleaner with 1/5" fillament
9. Mallory racing regulator (60 psi handling, down to 3 psi)
10. New 3/8" fuel lines and new filter
11. 8mm Taylor wires
12 AC delco sparks

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Arn

quote Originally posted by rverhalen: Where do I buy this stuff from?

Buy it from Donk as he won't be needing his anymore...

Where is Orief on this, he has a carbed 3.4. The 2.8 and the 3.4 are primarily the same block besides the displacement and a few other small details. You can almost put any 2.8 part onto a 3.4 and vise-versa. Oh, and to answere your question about all the extra Chrome goodies, heres a pic of Oriefs engine I took, it is VERY clean

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[This message has been edited by Golden86 (edited 08-14-2004).]

I love my 2.8 since it only has 63K on her and it is as clean as they come. but I want to put a carb on it and chrome things...
Anyone else out there have carbs and what did you do to make it carb'ed?

Nice picture of a carb engine!! very very nice!

quote Originally posted by rverhalen: Anyone else out there have carbs and what did you do to make it carb'ed?

When I got my car it had been partially converted to a carb but did not run and was a hack job though all the parts were there.
I was able to get the 2.8 to run but it had bearings knocking so I swapped in a 3.4.
The carb set-up for a 2.8 though is the same.
I swapped on the Edlebrock intake, a holley 390 cfm carb and a vacuum advance distributor from an early 80's S10 truck. I am running a holley external fuel pump, but you can run a 4 cylinder in tank pump with a regulator to achieve the 5-6 psi needed to supply the carb. I am also running aftermarket guages and senders but you can use the factory temp, oil pressure and voltage guages. You will need to run a 12 volt power source for the choke that comes on with the key. (I am using one of the 12 volt injector circuit wires) You will want to run smaller main jets if you use the 390, on my car for my locale I have found that #48 mains work the best (#51 jets are stock)
I am running a Mustang style scoop for clearance on my hood but if you use a 6" type filter the set-up will fit under the stock hood, though you will want to make sure your mounts are in good shape and may want to run a poly dog bone to limit engine movement as much as possible to keep the air filter from hitting.

Hope this answers some questions.
Here are some older pictures of mine, it is a much cleaner install now but I do not have a recent pic.


Richey

[This message has been edited by STRATOHACKER (edited 08-14-2004).]

what would it do for me?

It will open up the flow of the intake. This will increase the engines ability to breath better at the higher RPM's. It will also allow you to make changes/mods to the engine and tune for them easily

How much would it cost?

About $600 if you use new parts. About $200-$300 if you find the parts used.

How much more horse power would it give me?

Hooking it up to a stock 2.8L will gain you about 8-10hp, The advantage comes into play when going to a large cam and porting the heads. This is where the intake flow becomes important and your gains increase alot.

What would be the difference?

It all comes down to flow. The stock Fiero intake is great for a stock engine, but once the need to increase flow from mods, it starts becoming a restriction. Hence the Edelbrock intake will flow very well for even a 3.4L engine. At present there is not an aftermarket fuel injected intake that has the flow required. There are a few who have modified intakes and there is a thread where they are building a hi-flow intake, But it has not been tested/verified.

Can I make my 2.8 look nice with after market chrome and vavle covers?

Look at the pic of my engine posted by Golden86

Where do I buy this stuff from?

I bought all my stuff new thru Jegs, I also had Edelbrock custom grind a cam for me.

Anyone done this already?

Yes a few have done it. Stratohacker and I have 3.4L engines, Tajiguy and Arn have a 2.8L with a carb. Tajiguy is using a cam and a 4-bbl and Arn is using a stock 2.8L with a large 2-bbl. There are others and a few in the process of building a carb'd engine.
and if so what does your motor look like?

Look at the pic of my engine posted by Golden86

Mileage?

I am getting about 18mpg city and 22-24mpg highway, Which is about the same as I was getting with my stock original 2.8L.

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Happiness isn't around the corner...
Happiness IS the corner.

[This message has been edited by Oreif (edited 08-14-2004).]

Oreif,

I like what that looks like, my motor not having been hammered and low on miles, I did not think that an engine swap at this time would be worth it. I wanted to get more life out of her and still have something that shocks the world and I can work on easier... I would like to talk to you more in detail about this project since the gauges are my main concern.. Wanting to have everything work without much problems... later in life then a v-8 but just not right now..

shoot me an email with your number and I will give you a call...

rverhalen@triad.rr.com

You want to change from EFI to a carb??? Why swap old technology for new?. I do not beleive that a carburetor will give you any more power than EFI on a 2.8L. IMO, the reason that Orief is getting more power on his 3.4L is not from the carb but from the improved flow from the manifold he is using. I would guess Orief is using the old Edelbrock high rise design and the smallest Holly 4bbl. That Edelbrock has much larger runners than does the Fiero plenum. MY son had that setip on the 2.8L in his S-10 and in that application no additional power was observed. It would probably make a difference on a 3.4L though.
There is nothing wrong with a carburetor on a race only vehicle where the engine will be used in a narrow power band and RPM range. Assuming everything else is equal you should be able to make the same peak power with both fueling methods Starting from scratch the carburetor is usually less expensive. .
For the track I would consider running a carbureted engine. However, for street/ strip applications where you will drive in different climates, under a variety of different road conditions, EFI provides far more versatility, driveability and gas mileage. No flames to the carb guys but give me EFI and I'll tune it to perfection.

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87GT 3.4 Turbo Best 0-60 5.2 seconds
http://www.turbochargerpower.com/turbo.htm

quote Originally posted by rverhalen: Oreif, I like what that looks like, my motor not having been hammered and low on miles, I did not think that an engine swap at this time would be worth it. I wanted to get more life out of her and still have something that shocks the world and I can work on easier... I would like to talk to you more in detail about this project since the gauges are my main concern.. Wanting to have everything work without much problems... later in life then a v-8 but just not right now.. shoot me an email with your number and I will give you a call... rverhalen@triad.rr.com

You don't need to swap to a 3.4L to have it look exactly like mine. A 2.8L, 3.1L or a 3.4L are basically the same engine block in terms of mounting and swapping parts. The heads on a 3.4L are the exact same heads that are used on the Fiero 2.8L. If you want, You can swap the carb set-up, the chrome valve covers and Darrell Morse's powder-coated silver brackets and thermostat housing onto your 2.8L and it would look identical to mine. I am using all stock gauges. There is no mods to the gauges or the sensors for the gauges. The only sensors that are removed are specific to the fuel injection. You don't even have to remove the ECM, Just remove the "check engine" light bulb from the dash.
I'll send you an Email in a little bit.

Here are some close up's:

Oreif I never cease to admire your engine bay. It is really well thought out and looks great.

I was watching Speed TV lately and saw a buildup of a SBC 350 which was bored and stroked to 427 ci. The guys put a Demon carb on it and the Dyno'd it to 700+ streetable hp. Yeah that's right. Streetable.

I'd love that particular SBC in my Fiero.

I'm having some problems getting mine dialed in. I have to play with some stuff like the power valve, jet sizes, and vacuum advance to make it happen, but, it is no different really that having to play with an EFI system or Turbo except it is all mechanical not electronic, and there is no computer or chip to consider.

Anyway, if you like a well mannered, easy to tune, throaty sounding car, that goes good, the carb conversion is ok. BTW they are also really reliable.

Arn

I have to admit that I am leaning to the carb setup more and more, just the idea of working on them again makes me smile.
That (carb) is the first type of engine I worked on and I am very happy with the style and performance. Besides, I can tune to my hearts content. It gives you the look of the V-8 without all of the mess of EFI....

Will be checking into the manufactures in the morning to see what they have for performance items.

OK, one pic then....

bump

wow, looks good joe =)

Basically I used the following parts, no strokerkit, so it's still mostly the original 2.8:
Crane H-272-2 Camshaft & Lifter Kit
Comp Cams Roler Tip Rocker Arms - 1.52:1
Double-Roller Timing Chain
High Volume Oil Pump
Fel-Pro Complete Gasket Set
Performance Valve Spring Set
Custom Ross Pistons 10.5:1 C.R. 020 oversize
Moly Rings 020 oversize
Holley 390 cfm 4150 series 80507-1
Holley fuelpressure regulator (not the right choice, get one with a return if you use the original fuelpump)
Edelbrock intake+ spacer to make up for the angle
Mr gasket airfilter (for now, want to go to a cold-air intake)
Distributor from www.performancedistributors.com
I used the KFG stainless steel exhaust "headers" , I had no knowledge of the problems (cracks) with them at the time I ordered, so far so good though...
I had the flywheel lightened, everything balanced and the heads flowed and that's it!
Aim is to get close to 200 hp, will have to run it in and then dynoed to see if it did....

I'm still waiting for the distributor, but had it already running with an old one and was TOTALLY AMAZED with the sound of this set-up.
It's very loud and dark, vibrating your guts out!
Here's another pic:

I had my distributor re-curved at a pro shop. Very necessary.

Also, the small stuff on the carb will need experimenting. Jets, pump shooter, vac spring.

I noticed the center hung float chambers on JoeFormula's rig.

Really important too. The car will starve on right turns if you use side hungs.

The thing to remember when you get it running is that it is not like a plug and play setup. Each engine is a little different and it will likely not run its best the first time out. You will likely have to play with things like the shooter, accerator pump cam, jets. etc. to get it really perking.

The sound is much better (subjectively) than stock and with the right exhaust you'll intimidate the ricers at stop lights just with the sound, except the guys with the real expensive engine mods.

You're going to have a challenge to get it percolating, but also alot of fun.

Arn

Joeformula, why did you use another fuel pump....?
Can I still use the stock fuel pump and make it run, what would you suggest and where did you buy it from?
How much and how did you make the thing work?

I know, I am being blonde here but I want to make sure I get this all right the first time. I can not wait to hear the changes that this motor will make...

PM me your number and we can talk about some of the issues that you may have had with the install of the carb setup...

Orief has been very helpful so far!

rverhalen@triad.rr.com

I did use the original fuelpump,
Just saying that if you do, you must use a (restricted) return to avoid pressurecreep.
e-mail sent to rverhalen
Good luck, I'll let you know how it runs as soon as I get the distributor in.

I had a side hung float carb on my setup. She sloshed ONCE over a year of autocross. Then again, my FP and float height was dialed in.

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[This message has been edited by donk316 (edited 08-23-2004).]

quote Originally posted by donk316: I had a side hung float carb on my setup. She sloshed ONCE over a year of autocross. Then again, my FP and float height was dialed in.

I have to agree with Donk on this, my carb is side hung and I have not been able to get it to fuel starve when hammering turns. Switching to center hung bowls will not hurt anything but I have not found a need for them personally.
Fuel pressure and float level are very important to having the set-up work properly

Richey

[This message has been edited by STRATOHACKER (edited 08-23-2004).]

Updated pic of my engine. Car is a daily driver so ignore the dirt.

Richey