My ZZ4 spec SBC with vortec heads was installed with a carb with every intention of fuel injecting it later... and later is finally here.

I was planning on going the TBI route first, but then I got an LT4 intake that was already converted to Vortec heads. However my custom waterpump setup had 1 leg in the middle of the throttle body opening and there is little I can do with the waterpump to make it clear the intake. The waterpump is more inportant than the intake. So I sold off the majority of my TBi, TPI and LT1/4 stuff and dropped $1500 for the Jam Jet EFI setup - complete with everything except harness and ECM.

This is probably the 2nd best looking EFI Intake I have owned. The TPIS Miniram I had on my vette is #1 IMO.

The intake ia 9 1/2" tall from the base, so it is rather tall.

Here is the engine test fitted in the engine bay:

A portion of the hinge and the decklid brace needed to be removed to clear the top of the intake. I will probably bend a piece fo 3/16" steel to follow the cut hole contour and install the 2nd hinge bolt to the rear of the intake.

It fits without cutting to the chassis sheet metal, but there is only about 1/8" between the throttle body cable bracket and the strut tower (88) - good thing I have switched to solid mounts!

I am still undecided if I will leave the air filter there (exposed to rain) or if I will use some stainless tube and move the filter to the wheel well (requires relocating the expansion chamber to the DS).

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 04-03-2005).]

My engine was originally installed with poly mounts for the engine and transmission. I bent the upper transmission mount breackets (stock), then redesigned them out of 3/16" steel to eliminate the bending and then I cracked my cradle (88):

I welded up the cradle, but figured I would just break it again (maybe in a different spot). So I decided to run with solid mounts and beef up the cradle crossmembers as well.

Both cross members were cut out and replaced with 2x3x1/8" square tube. While I had them out, I also relocated them 1" further to the front to give more room for the oil pan drain plug and to get the rear cross member closer to the engine. The rear crossmember was also raised up quite a bit. This was done to allow the use of a camaro type cross flow muffler to lay flat so I can keep my trunk. I will probably just keep my dual setup for now, but when I change it I will run a single 3" camaro type muffler.

The rear sway bar is getting shifted up 1 set of holes (lower hole in backet is now upper hole in cradle) and a new hole drilled. It does fit with the raised crossmember!

Here is a better view of the solid mounts:

The engine mount is a piece of 3/16" angle. I am using 4 bolts on the front mount just to help spread the load out as much as possible. The front transmission bracket (for Getrag) is 1/8" steel that is contoured to wrap around the gretrag and pick up the 3 bolts that are on the bellhousing case. The rear transmission bracket is mainly a shelf The engine portion of the bracket will rest on top of this, so all torque loads will be transferred directly by the bracket, not the bolts that just keep the two pieces together.

Here is the engine bracket:

Again 3/16" angle was used. It bolts to the stock starter holes in the SBC and is notched to clear the flywheel, half shaft and oil pan. The bolt heads clear the half shaft by about 1/8". The upper square tube bolts to the head and this mount just sits on the cradle shelf. There are 4 3/8" bolts that will hold the bracket to the shelf, but this is just massive overkill. I have not installed a crush sleeve in the square tube yet, but will be doing that soon. I will get some pics of the mounts with the engine installed later.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 04-03-2005).]

Looks good! I've always liked the GM Ram Jet intake, but was skeptical that it would fit. Looking forward to watching this swap take place.

What ECM are you using?

Nice job you did on the cradle, looks good.

What are the reasons you are going with solid mounts?

Archie

Formula88 - I haven't decided on ECM's yet but I have the TBI 747 and the TPI 727 (3 of them) to choose from. I already have my harness done for the 747 for the TBI setup (and custom chip), so it may get the nod, but we will have to wait and see.

Archie - Thanks for the compliment. My orginal front mount was poly:

I think the poly front mount does not allow the engine mount to take its portion of the engine torque, and causes the transmission mounts and strut rod to take a much greater portion. I have bent both trans mount brackets and cracked the cradle in the rear - so it was time to solid mount everything.

quote Originally posted by fieroguru: I think the poly front mount does not allow the engine mount to take its portion of the engine torque, and causes the transmission mounts and strut rod to take a much greater portion. I have bent both trans mount brackets and cracked the cradle in the rear - so it was time to solid mount everything.

100% agree.

Archie

Here are some pics of the solid mounts with the engine installed:

I will be having the cradle (and all suspension pieces and front crossmember) sand blasted and then black oxide treated (liquid bath chemical process so it will get inside all the nooks and crannies) to prevent rust and to prep the parts I will be painting.

Looks great!

I have been making progress, but slacking on updates... Oh well...

I built my harness from scratch for the 730 ECM and Darth Fiero should have my chip done this week. Every wire was cut to desired length and soldered. I tore apart numerous other harnesses for the connectors and proper wire colors (yes I am finicky about that), but it is now done!!!

I hope to make some noise by Wednesday!

Here is the pretty side:

I dislike wires... but they are an absolute necessity and EFI just means there are more. However, I have taken great measures to obscure as many wires as possible. This engine is completely wired but for the most part you don't see any wires. This makes me happy!

Here is the business side:

You can see the whole harness from this side, but this side is hard to see when the engine is in the car. Still the wires are ran to be as inconspicuous as possible.

Savvy people will notice there are not wires going to the 500 connector on the PS wheel well. That's because the 500 connector is now inside the passenger compartment!

The rear light/cruise harness was cut and lengthened about 4 feet and ran through the firewall tube (place people put subs) and then up through a new hole in the tunnel to the 500 connector. The fuel and AC relays along with the +12 bulkead are also in the center console area.

Now I will only have 1 bulhead connector through the firewall and it has been relocated along side the shift cable location. The two holes from the original connectors will be capped with a brushed aluminum plate with some test on it.

Here is the new offset housing for my belt driven water pump:

It had to be redone to clear the end of the Ram Jet maifold since it stick out way further than needed. The water fill will be with an inline unit. There is just enough room for a swivel 90 degree water neck with a hose on it (and this took clearancing the throttle body and removing about 1/8" from the base of the swivel water neck. This essentially removed the groove for the o ring, so I will run a gasket.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 05-08-2005).]

I hate you soooo much for showing me your rear suspension. DANGIT!! Now Im gonna hafta tear mine all back apart again and have it powder coated red. It just looks too cool not to!!! Thats okay, I need rear struts.

quote Originally posted by fieroguru:

You know what, after looking at this intake installed on an engine, I bet you could get the LT1/LT4 vette fuel rail covers to work with this intake setup. However, you might not need them to hide any of your wiring, but it could be an option for someone who wants to do just that.

Mondays are always bad for me, but I did manage to get some needed things done.

I added AC again (last time I had it the compressor and clutch locked up and smoked the belt!) and needed a new belt. So I mounted the waterpump and found a belt that was too long and cut it the length needed. Then made a trip to Autozone to get the right belt. Measured my mock up belt and got it and 1 size above and below. The one in the center was the right one. It is snug when installed, but I have to install the waterpump last and the waterpump housings cut my alternator adjustment in half, so snug is best. I can easily pull the water pump up (pivoting on the upper lower bolt) and get all the bolts started.

I also spent about 30 minutes in front of the belt sander with welding gloves on removing about 1/8" from the waterneck. Mission accomplished and here is the water neck and the hose fill.

I will keep the recessed allen bolt for the hole on the left, but for the one on the right I will have to use an standard hex head shimmed up above the base or I will never be able to get it tight! The good this is that once it is on, I should not have to take it off often.
Belt sanders are also good at cleaning up the cut ends of hose!

I also sanded down and repainted my firewall coolant tube that transfers the water to the DS coolant tube.

Tuesday I should finish up the hard aluminum fuel lines, install the coolant tube and get the engine in the car and make headway on hooking everything back up.

Here is the last pic for today:

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 05-09-2005).]

Very nice work A lot of custom work but worthwhile. Once we do it one time we see all the areas that can be improved on these V8 swaps. At the end we have a better installation. GReat work

quote Originally posted by Alex4mula: ... Once we do it one time we see all the areas that can be improved on these V8 swaps. ... Great work

To borrow from the '80s hip-hop vernacular, "Word!" I'm already working on the wife to let me pull mine and clean it up some.

Awesome work, fieroguru!

Looks awsome, man!

Is that a Powermaster starter I see? Are you having any trouble with it?

------------------
1986 SE 350 V8

Thanks for the compliments!

The starter is a Summit Racing Equipment heavy duty mini starter (but it is still a hitachi based starter). This is the 2nd one, the first was the lighter duty version and stopped fully engaging. I took it to a starter/alternator rebuilder and they tore it apart twice and verified that everything worked at the component level, but they could not get them to work together at the assembly level. So far the 2nd one has been issue free.

WOW! Great job. I love the ultra-clean engine compartment. I can't imagine how much extra time you've spent to get this far. Just beautiful.

------------------
Roy

double-click on this link to follow my interior build-up https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/023174.html

Blue 87 GT w/ 4th generation Firebird interior.
Suncoast Fieros

Judged "Best Custom Interior" at the 20th Anniversary Show @ Pontiac, Mich - 7/2003
Judged "Best Custom Interior" at the 8th Annual Fiero Fun Weekend @ Daytona - 3/2004
Judged "Best Custom Interior" at the 9th Annual Fiero Fun Weekend @ Daytona - 3/2005

Work has been supper hectic and cutting into my fiero time...

However, I am still making some progress. I got the rear supension assembled and installed. Most of the bolts are still loose, but it is atleast hanging there. The rear got poly bushings and KYB Gr2 shocks and it already had stock springs with 1 coil removed. The rotors and calipers are blue just like the front, but not installed yet..

I also go the engine up in the car and all the stuff on the PS of the engine installed except for the coolant supply hose to the pump:

Here is a side view of the new throttle bracket.

The ram jet unit comes with a bracket, but there is absolutely no way a fiero cable (V6 or 4cyl) will work with it. It just requires too much exposed cable. So I took the 4cyl cable and removed the rubber grommet and cut the sleave back to about 1/2" from the mounting boss. Then I removed the plastic wire cover because it was too short and would catch. This gave me enought cable to wrap the cable wheel (for lack of a better term), but now the cable bracket had to move about 5-6 inches forward. Also in this new location, the cable wheel actually hit the cable. I clearanced the build up sides of the wheel so clear the cable housing and the new bracket.

You can also see that I have a major sickness for stainless steel button heads.
I did the strut washer mod a couple years ago when I lowered the car. Remove the studs, drill everything for 3/8", weld grade 8 nuts to the underside of the strut cap, install studs to keep everything lined up. Once up in the car, remove 1 stud at a time and thread in the 3/8" stainless button head. The washers were cut to remove the brackets that supported the vents, but the vents stay put and don't vibrate without them and it makes it super quick to remove them.

The nut for the strut is still way loose - I plan to remove the cup washer just under the nut and paint it blue as soon as the car is sitting on its wheels.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 05-12-2005).]

Nice work!
So many things to oooh and aaah over.
You're an artist.

What are you expecting for power after this installation? Are there any dyno charts on the net?

------------------
Christian Thomas
87 Pontiac Fiero GT Burgandy/Silver 5.7L ZZ4 5spd
301rwhp/345rwtq

Next Mod: Not sure yet

My engine is closer to the Fast Burn crate engine (vs ZZ4) with the exception of Vortec heads (cast iron) vs the Aluminum Fast Burn heads. The Fast Burn engine is rated at 385 hp. The ZZ4 engine has the vette style aluminum heads and are they are more restrictive and limit the ZZ4 crate engine to 350 hp with the same cam in the Fast Burn engine. My engine is somewhere in the middle.

The Ram Jet intake may help more on the upper end since it is pretty much a tunnel ram with short runners. The only dyno sheets I know of are for the RamJet Crate engine with its smaller cam. It makes 350 hp.

The vortec heads and the GM Hot cam will make 420 hp and long term that is the cam I want to run!

The intake is very tall, but the runners inside start about the level of the fuel rails, the rest of the intake is just open plenum. On the power tour I am planning on putting it on the dyno and running it down the dragstrip at IRP. If I break anything, atleast I will only be 2 hrs from home!

The engine should come to life today! I will post more pictures once it does.

If anything could have gone wrong in the last week or two... it did and then some. Time fixes everything, but I am short on time, so then came the long, long days.

My old exhaust did not fit. Close, but wouldn't fit, so I had to make a new one (which I had planned on, just not this soon!). I ordered an Afterburner cross flow camaro muffler with a 3" in and dual 2 1/5" outs along with new reducers and the needed mandrel bent tubing.

Pile of parts:

8 hrs of fitting, cutting, grinding, welding...

Here is an installed view:

I retained the stock Fiero tips (like I always do), but this time the 2" mandel bend that comes with them just wasn't going to cut it. So I cut the tips where they start to flare out to match the 2 1/2" mandrel bent pipe.

Then when I had the car running I noticed the clutch didn't feel like it did before I started it, sure enough leaking hydraulic fluid out the bellhousing. Many, many cusswords later, then I stopped work on the car that day. I am using a hydraulic throw out bearing (stock 93 getrag) and it got overextended and self distructed. Now not only did I have to buy an new one (the one in there was brand new) for $150 I also got the joy of tearing everything back apart. My new personal record - 1 hr 45 minutes from running to engine/tranny rolling on the dolly.

Once I got the car to run again it was time to start on the body work. I HATE bodywork.

Panels off the car and sanded:

Now everything is a shade of my signature blue!

I wrapped the chassis in plastic and put the fascias back on so they would keep their shape and give me an easy way to paint them. The top panel remained on the car to avoid breakage.

Wednesday morning starts the reassembly!

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 06-01-2005).]

Lookin' awesome, keep it up! I'm really interested to see how the Ram Jet dyno curves look like.

What a great job. Saaaaaalute !

Nice work and engine Is your car a pre 88? I remember seeing a RamJet engine in a a Fiero at Daytona but the TB was modified with an angle piece to clear the shock tower. You don't seem to have that problem at all.

------------------
Palm Beach Fieros
http://pbfieros.tripod.com

Sorry for the delay, but my car is an 88 and will be in Kissimmee FL till next Friday.

So far it has gone from Mattoon, IL to Chicago, Milwalkee, Springfield, Mattoon, Indy, Nashville, and Birmingham. The engine and fuel injection have been issue free. This tour has really challanged many vehicles cooling systems with the heat and the hour long stop and go at the venues. I am glad to say that my car never got to the 220 mark and always stayed about 1/8" below it even pulling the trailer fully of tools and other stuff.

But unfortunately my tranny has continued to be a pain. It is a 93 Cavalier Getrag 5 speed with the hudraulic bearing slave. It was leaking fluid from day one and progressively got worse. We stopped off at Fiero Factory to change the axle seals, but that did not help much and buy the time we got to birmingham it was going through a quart in 50 miles, leaving a smoke cloud from the oil on the exhaust, and my spec stage 3 clutch started to slip going up an I-65 hill. We got it in a tranny shop yesterday and pulled the tranny - the input bearing had walked itself out making a nice 1/8" gap between the seal and the shaft!

The worst part is the bearing had spun and did not fit as tight as it should. The wear looked isolated to the bearing and not the case, but the shop could not locate one within 2 states of AL. This tranny was only made from 92 to 94 and not as common as I thought it would be. The bearing is also unique to the tranny with the hydraulic bearing. So we over nighted one from Minnisota and paid 3 times the cost of the bearing for the shipping!!! It should be here at noon and then we have a 600 mile trec to Kissimee to catch up with the power tour.

Spec clutch just happened to be at the Birmingham venue and is local. We rented a car and took my old clutch pressure plate and flywheel to their shop and an hour later had a resurfaced flywheel and a stage 3 hybrid (the stage 3 is a bit too chattery for a daily driver). I will let you all know how it compares to the stage 3 on drivability.

The oil leak (and lack of long pants) kept me from putting the car on the dyno or running down the strip at IRP, but I plan to go to the GM small car show next month in IRP and run it then.

So far the trip has been great other than the tranny issues. I have gotten to meet several other Fiero enthusiasts who have been very helpful!