I am new to the area and was wondering how many members are here. I just bought an 86GT with a 4.9 swap but it need some TLC to make it right. Pulls good from a stop! The old owner did as far as I can tell, a good job with the install. I drove it 180 miles home from where I bought it with minor problems. Does anyone out this way have any experience with this swap. I could really use the help. I dont think the piror owner wants to be bothered with my questions and I understand. I have searched and read the forums but it doesnt really help me out. So any members here from my area please jump in!
I am just south of Houston. But I only have experience with 3800SC swaps. There are quite a few people in the Houston area on here. Just post up your problems and someone will most likely be able to help you. Welcome to the Club!
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08:00 AM
josef644 Member
Posts: 6939 From: Dickinson, Texas USA Registered: Nov 2006
Quite a few of us South Texas boys here on PFF. I am up between Huntsville and Livingston. jscott1 lives somewhere in Houston and has a 4.9 with a 6 speed. Joe Crawford
I am new to the area and was wondering how many members are here. I just bought an 86GT with a 4.9 swap but it need some TLC to make it right. Pulls good from a stop! The old owner did as far as I can tell, a good job with the install. I drove it 180 miles home from where I bought it with minor problems. Does anyone out this way have any experience with this swap. I could really use the help. I dont think the piror owner wants to be bothered with my questions and I understand. I have searched and read the forums but it doesnt really help me out. So any members here from my area please jump in!
Thank you WB
.
I guess you bought the one from Austin--Looked like a good deal but the guy selling it has known to be an azz with others.
There are plenty on here with the swap so sure your questions will be answered.
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10:25 AM
sanderson Member
Posts: 2203 From: corpus christi, texas, usa Registered: Sep 2001
I'm in Corpus Christi and am just completing a 4.9/4T60E swap into an 88 coupe. There's another 4.9/4T60E swap in San Antonio and another in progress there.
The Alamo Area Fiero Owners (AAFO) is having their annual Round-up in San Antonio. It typically draws 20-30 cars. Here's a link to the thread in the General Fiero Chat:
Originally posted by MstangsBware: I guess you bought the one from Austin--Looked like a good deal but the guy selling it has known to be an azz with others.
There are plenty on here with the swap so sure your questions will be answered.
Wow steven, how did you know?!? did you see the el camino??lol Yeah look it over better, there may be some "rigging" done....
[This message has been edited by revin (edited 02-26-2009).]
He was nice to me. I don't know him well enough to call him an ass.
I will get my camera out and shoot some pics of what I have questions with. I see a few unplugged wires. I think I know what they are but i'd like a second look to be sure. The temp guage doesn't work and the gas gauge is wacky. I see the second O2 isn't hooked up but the first one is. There are other things I can see needs to be fixed like some hacked up looking idler pully that's bent to the right and rubbing on the belt and lot of other little things. But the harness is really done right.
nah, not TOO screwed as you may think. he is just out for the money. At worst you may have paid a bit too much. I would not trust his brackets, and welds though, keep an eye on them yeah he is NO wiring kind of guy!
hope you make it to the roundup in April!! we'll talk more then...
[This message has been edited by revin (edited 02-26-2009).]
Also...move that air cleaner OUT of the engine bay!!! all you are doing is sucking HOT air = not good. Outside air is better!
In the picture from Craig's list I see a hose off the vent on the in-line coolant fill. This connection should have a plug in it. You want all venting to occur at the radiator to the coolant reservior. If it's like my in-line fill it takes a 1/8 NPT plug.
The Cadillac coolant temperature sensor contains a sending unit (variable resistor) for the PCM and a switch for the dash idiot light. This sensor should be replaced with one with two sending units. The second sending unit is for the Fiero temperaure gauge. It's possible the previous owner did not realize this and that is why the temperature doesn't work. The thread below contains the part numbers for the correct temperaure sensors:
Ohh yeah! Bend (Scott)Sanderson's ear on ALL the 4.9 stuff! he is getting to be a "master" of it ... Or (Jonathan) Jscott ( also 4.9) great with wires.
Ohh yeah! Bend (Scott)Sanderson's ear on ALL the 4.9 stuff! he is getting to be a "master" of it ... Or (Jonathan) Jscott ( also 4.9) great with wires.
Now if you need help with style points then revin is your man
[This message has been edited by sanderson (edited 02-27-2009).]
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12:31 PM
cardealer Member
Posts: 511 From: austin tx usa Registered: Jan 2001
nah, not TOO screwed as you may think. he is just out for the money. At worst you may have paid a bit too much. I would not trust his brackets, and welds though, keep an eye on them yeah he is NO wiring kind of guy!
hope you make it to the roundup in April!! we'll talk more then...
Well I guess Im the azz that sold him that car, and Kevin I can see your just as big as back stabbin looser as ever. When have you ever had me do any brackets or welding for you? You dont know jack about welding in the first place nor building anything fast or anything that will stay together. Your a complete wannabe...... 1st im not out for the money. I have plently of money, I do not need to sell a $3000.00 fiero to get money, my busines is producing an extreme amout of money. Like I said you dont know jack- this guy didnt pay too much for that car you dont even know how much the car sold for nor do you know how much money is in the car. Face it your not very good with money or figures anyway or you wouldnt have filed bankrupancy or be broke all the time. You havnt seen me in a long time or any of my cars so how do you know if I cant wire?? There again your just running your mouth, trying to act like you know something, trying to be someone your not. As far as the elcamino- get your little fiero and line it up with the el camino. Oh wait you cant build anything thats remotely fast or stays together, but if you want I will put the elcamino up against your fiero for any amout of money you can come up with. Or you still broke all the time? Or if your scared of the el camino- I will run you in my BMW, my supra, my trans am, or my vw powered sandrail. If your fiero can beat any of these cars well you might, just might have a little more room to run your mouth. I buildt that fiero more than year and half ago and it has been sitting ever since. And you Kevin have never even seen the car so how can you make the statements you did? I never even titled into my name, I just lost complete interest in it and didnt want to finsh it then. I will be more than happy to answer any questions about the car to the new owner but I have had about 11 other cars since then and cant recall alot of details about the car. He knew that he was purchasing a project nothing more. Never did I sugar coat the car. Yes it needs finishing, yes its been sitting a while but Kevin you have no business jumping into this thread unless your from the Houston area and can help him with 4.9 swap questions. Unless you have nothing better to do and it makes you feel so much more of a man trying to bash another person and his cars and his ethics, trying to make yourself look better so you are the "wack" job. As far a me being an azz to anyone else Im sorry. I dont ever recall speaking to any of you before, but if I did Im sorry and please tell when and were I did this. Im a really nice guy but when I get 20 emails a day asking if I trade the fiero for a playstation and set of drums or if you can make payments of $150.00 a month, well yes I get a little tired of it. But again if I have been a azz to someone please tell me who and when be ause I would like to say Im sorry directly. Untill then Kevin get a life and stay out of mine.........
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12:34 PM
v8fiero400 Member
Posts: 963 From: Houston,TX,USA Registered: Jan 2004
Like I said guys, Cardealer was nice with me. He even called the next day to make sure I got home ok. I have looked the car over well. I am not a swap guy but I have built 2 Supras so I know what I am looking for. Well not on a caddy motor yet LOL. His workmanship looks good and there is only minor thigs to do. Tank it easy on him. The got me home 180 miles with minor problems. So like I said take it easy. This is about me getting answers from the pro here.
P.S. I will say this. He had a bad ass 850i sitting at his house and that was a good looking car!
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01:56 PM
FieroReinke Member
Posts: 1065 From: St James, MO Registered: Feb 2003
I am in Pearland on the south side. If you need any help let me know. I have only done a 3.4 dohc swap and dont have any experience with the 4.9, but I will help in any way I can.
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02:21 PM
cardealer Member
Posts: 511 From: austin tx usa Registered: Jan 2001
I live in Magnolia TX... northwest of Houston. I have a 4.9 with a 5 speed daily driver
TEXASGT- This is the guy I was telling you to try to contact, I just couldnt remember his contact. And thanks for the kind words. There are many, many great people on this forum but a few think they know everything but dont really have a clue.
Im sorry I had to let you go on the phone I had another call coming in. I think the extra plug around the throttle body thats not hooked up is for the cruise control if I remember correctly. You dont need both o2 sensors hooked up with that wiring harness thats in there. I have the other ecm chip to run both o2's somewhere. I can look for it if you want. As mentioned in a prior responce in this thread about the line that needs to be pluged, dont worry about that untill you hook up the heater core water lines. If you have any more questions let me know, I will always try to help you, I might just not remember. Oh by the way is there a lug key for the rims in the drivers side map pocket? -Tony
Still running your ****ing mouth I did not say a thing that was not true. even that the ass part <<< seems still true!
If the guy like the car fine! I don't give a **** either way! just letting him know what to look out for! and there WILL be more to fix!
Oh and nowhere did I say I was faster than you. Who ****ing cares? You run big motors like your mouth!
So shut your mouth and crawl back to whatever it is you troll on. piss off.
there you go again running your mouth about nothing you know about....... im not trolling, simpling defending statements out of your mouth. It seems you can take stabs at other peoples cars and act you know everything, done everything and seen everything. I dont know what crawled up your a$$ to provoke you into basically trashing me and this car. Is your just a looser and have nothing else in your miserable sad life that you have to attack me. I dont sit around waiting for you do or say something and then just attack and make false statements about you. I never said anything bad about you, in fact I took up for you one night when everyone in the parking lot was making fun of your car. Im sorry I wasted my time helping you put the motor in your car. I spent all that time helping you cause I thought you were pretty cool. If I had know you were going to act like this to me I never would have done nothing for you. facts are: you never seen the car. you know nothing about the car. nothing about my welding on the car. nothing about my wiring on the car. not how much money I spent on the car. nothing on how much I sold the car for. so it goes without saying--- you dont know nothing...... you should have not even started to troll this thread because you dont know about anything about anything. The guy who bought this car is by far smarter than you on cars so I doubt he needs your expert advice on what to look for. In fact he didnt ask for your opinion, if he had made a post about wanting someone who knows nothing about nothing, well then you could have replied and given your vast knowledge about nothing..... Im sure he would rather get info from someone who has actually done this type of swap and not someone who cant build or weld anything themselves. I still remember that day you were at my house and you tried to weld! ha- now thats something to beware of. Try fixing your own little car by yourself (doubtful) and leave alone the topics you dont know nothing about...... All statements you said are false. I know far more than you about the welding, wiring,swaping this engine into this car. So stop acting like your a big shot and know everything. Your nothing more than a back stabbing looser. So go troll someone else's thread and pretend you know something about everything and attack them cause you have no life. This guy that purchased this car doesnt need you or your opinon.
Is the harness the Ed Parks/Fuel Injection Technologies harness or DIY. If it's DIY, what was the basis for wiring and PCM - 91 Deville? Sounds like the engine is a '94 if it had two O2 sensors.
Do you remember if the Caddy temperaure sensor was replaced?
TexasGT,
On your gas gauge problem fill the tank up and then disconnect the plug for the fuel pump and gas gauge sending unit. I don't have a Fiero manual here at home so can't tell you which color wires are the sending unit. The sending unit is a variable resistor. Check the reistance on the gas gauge sending unit wires. It should read around 90 ohms. Then put it back together and run the tank down near empty based on tripmeter. For highway you should get high 20's for mileage. Probably low 20's for mixed city highway driving. I'd keep a gas can in the car in case your mileage is different. Then recheck the resistance on the sending unit. It should be around 0 ohms. If the sending unit checks out by this test then your problem is in the wiring or dash gauge unit. Most of the time the problem is with the sending unit in the tank but I've been bit by assuming that and dropping the tank only to find the dash gauge was bad,
If you've narrowed it down to the sending unit this thread tells you how to rehab one:
Man this temp sensor thing has really got me. I looked at the other thread and I still dont get it. Let me go back and read it again.
quote
In the picture from Craig's list I see a hose off the vent on the in-line coolant fill. This connection should have a plug in it. You want all venting to occur at the radiator to the coolant reservior. If it's like my in-line fill it takes a 1/8 NPT plug.
May sound dumb but what is NPT???
[This message has been edited by TEXASGT (edited 03-01-2009).]
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02:54 PM
sanderson Member
Posts: 2203 From: corpus christi, texas, usa Registered: Sep 2001
Originally posted by TEXASGT: Man this temp sensor thing has really got me. I looked at the other thread and I still dont get it. Let me go back and read it again.
You want one of these temperature sensors:
GM 10096181 AC-Delco 213-815 Borg Warner WT3024 CarQuest TX66 Filko CS-43 GP Sorensen 38-5124 Niehoff DR134TA Napa/Echlin ECHTS4020
So check to see what brand and part number is on the one in the car. It's located on the thermostat housing.
It should be wired as follows:
pin "A" BLK wire on the sensor goes to ecm "E11" pin "B" YEL wire on the sensor goes to ecm "E16" pin "C" GRN wire on the sensor goes to C500 - C2
To check the sensor:
If you unplug the temerature sensor you can check the resistance on pin that goes to the green wire to ground. It should read 1355 ohms at 100 'f and 55 ohms at 260'F. I believe the response is linear so at 190 'F it should read about 600 ohms
quote
Originally posted by TEXASGT:
May sound dumb but what is NPT???
National Pipe Thread - it's the standard plumbing tapered pipe thread
[This message has been edited by sanderson (edited 03-01-2009).]
I just picked up the WT3024 from O'reilys, found the temp ensor in the thermostat housing, but it two wires not three???
I took some pic and will put them here. There is a number of wires not hooked up to anything so I hope some of you can see what isnt hooked up. Also the car is running rich, not real bad but you can smell it...
Sanderson, thank you for your help. People are a lot nicer here than the Supra forums!!!
[This message has been edited by TEXASGT (edited 03-01-2009).]
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06:59 PM
sanderson Member
Posts: 2203 From: corpus christi, texas, usa Registered: Sep 2001
Originally posted by TEXASGT: I just picked up the WT3024 from O'reilys, found the temp ensor in the thermostat housing, but it two wires not three???
Based on the two oxygen sensors I believe your engine is a '94. I've got a '94 factory service manual. I looks like in '94 there was only two wires going to a single sending unit. It was wired back to E11 and E16 on the PCM. This provided the information for the engine management. A temperaure signal was also passed from the PCM to the instrument panel cluster (IPC) over a data line. The IPC had a solid state switch that turned on the idiot light when the coolant was too hot.
Your are going to have to find a new three wire connector for your new sensor from a Fiero parts car or buy a new connector. I'll browse around and see if I can find out where. Then your going to have to find or run the third wire from the connector to C500-C2. C500 is the big plug just to rear of the battery. There's a bolt in the middle of it with a 1/4" head that has to be removed to unplug the connector. Once it's disconnected you should be able to find letters and number that designate the pins. If there's a wire on C2 it may be one of your unconnected wires. I'd continuity test all the unconnected wires back to C500-C2 . If that doesn't find it, you'll have to unravel the wiring harness.
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10:58 PM
Mar 2nd, 2009
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
Or (Jonathan) Jscott ( also 4.9) great with wires.
Somehow I missed this thread until now... I do have a 4.9 with a 6 speed. I'm in the process of fine tuning it, and making a few wiring changes to account for the 6 speed. I' didn't do the harness, but I've reverse engineered it to where I can understand how it was done.
I'm trying to help out one of our new members with a temperature gauge problem. He bought a car with the 4.9 swap already done. The PO did not change out the temperature sensor. The car has a two wire sensor in it. The new owner has acquired the correct temperature sensor. Where do you get the connector for the new three wire sensor? I seem to remember I salvaged it off of an '88 Fiero harness.
The connector comes from a 4 cylinder 92 (or there abouts) Cavalier that has a temp gage. You may also want to check locally for anyplace that sells pigtails as they would have it as well. The sensor fits said Cavalier or you can use the one from a 3800SC (which comes in the GTP and other cars).
If you are into roaming junkyards, the pigtail from just about any TPS sender off most early 90's GM products is the same (wire coloring is different).
O2 - dual sensor could be from a Seville as well - you really only need the 1 O2, however if you wish to use both you have to use the correct ECM programming for the 2 sensor one - ALSO, if you want this, there are some changes to the wiring as well to convert over the the Seville programming.
Fuel gage - has nothing to do with the 4.9, the fuel sender feeds the gage directly (the fuel pump, however is controller via the 4.9 ECM).
quote
Originally posted by jscott1: Somehow I missed this thread until now... I do have a 4.9 with a 6 speed. I'm in the process of fine tuning it, and making a few wiring changes to account for the 6 speed. I' didn't do the harness, but I've reverse engineered it to where I can understand how it was done.
If I can help any way I will.
Johnathan - I would be interested in hearing what you come up with for wiring changes. I assume you are going after the sail on condition? I am also sort of looking into this myself, but have not figured anything out just yet.
[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 03-02-2009).]
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08:54 AM
PFF
System Bot
sanderson Member
Posts: 2203 From: corpus christi, texas, usa Registered: Sep 2001
Originally posted by jscott1: Somehow I missed this thread until now... I do have a 4.9 with a 6 speed. I'm in the process of fine tuning it, and making a few wiring changes to account for the 6 speed. I' didn't do the harness, but I've reverse engineered it to where I can understand how it was done. If I can help any way I will.
Jonathon, Do you have a scan tool? Based on the loose wire and incorrect temperaure I'm not if I'd trust the SES light to work. Plus TexasGT says the car smells like it is running rich
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09:54 AM
sanderson Member
Posts: 2203 From: corpus christi, texas, usa Registered: Sep 2001
yes I do have a scantool and I can read the 4.9 ecm.
I have the 6 speed from the old G6. it's a bolt up to most GM FWD engines.
Yes, Tim I'm going after the sail-on condition. I,ve been lurking Caddy forums and the stock 4.9s are prone to sail on. In the Fiero mated to a manual they all seem to have this problem. I have a few ideas that I want to try as it's tricky to drive it like it is. Yesterday my girlfriend asked "is it supposed to do that?" Since this is a unique application of the 4.9 it's hard to say what it's suppoed to do.
O2 - dual sensor could be from a Seville as well - you really only need the 1 O2, however if you wish to use both you have to use the correct ECM programming for the 2 sensor one - ALSO, if you want this, there are some changes to the wiring as well to convert over the the Seville programming.
Fuel gage - has nothing to do with the 4.9, the fuel sender feeds the gage directly (the fuel pump, however is controller via the 4.9 ECM).
I am only going to run the one O2, I dont see the advantage of 2. Does the stock pump work? Should I go to a 255?
Originally posted by jscott1: Yes, Tim I'm going after the sail-on condition. I,ve been lurking Caddy forums and the stock 4.9s are prone to sail on. In the Fiero mated to a manual they all seem to have this problem. I have a few ideas that I want to try as it's tricky to drive it like it is. Yesterday my girlfriend asked "is it supposed to do that?" Since this is a unique application of the 4.9 it's hard to say what it's suppoed to do.
Yes, it is an issue with auto cars as well, it's just not as pronounced as it is in a manual car, I also personally would like to know exactly what the purpose is for the resistor pack (if that is what it is) that is connected to E10 and E4.
You can follow this procedure till the cows have all come home and have all died from old age and it still does not really solve the problem in a manual car. There has even been a tech bulletin released from GM about the problem (setting the base idle lower), but again this does not solve the problem in a manual car - you can reduce it somewhat, but it nevers really goes away.
[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 03-02-2009).]
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