Have looked at many Fiero sites & Kitcar forums many people say that a V12 can't be installed transversly. So i wanted to give it a try. This one is a BMW V12 out of a 88 750il.
IP: Logged
09:16 PM
PFF
System Bot
Mike Gonzalez Member
Posts: 5093 From: Colorado Springs, CO. USA Registered: Jul 2001
The throttle bodies were moved to the rear of the intake manifolds with a 90 degree adapter. The frame rails were cut off and new ones made 2 inches wider. The engine trans is moved so far over the trans is under the frame rail.
IP: Logged
09:24 PM
Synthesis Member
Posts: 12207 From: Jordan, MN Registered: Feb 2002
I had 2 possibilities on starter positions the original spot or a back side starter on the trans. This is the Ford starter off the Taurus. This is a picture of the flywheel it's a redrilled 2.5 flywheel.
IP: Logged
09:37 PM
Synthesis Member
Posts: 12207 From: Jordan, MN Registered: Feb 2002
In this picture there is a halfshaft and redrilled front wheel hub. Drilled to 4 3/4 to match the BMW so to use it's rims. Other views of the halfshaft. And a view of the carrier bearing.
IP: Logged
09:45 PM
Mike Gonzalez Member
Posts: 5093 From: Colorado Springs, CO. USA Registered: Jul 2001
OMG!!! the lambo guys are gonna go nuts when they see this!! Dude keep this going! I want to see this baby running. Way to think outside of the box. I do know one guy that has one in north & south, but this would open up a few doors for us when you get this baby done.
Oh yea forgot to ask, have you put the dist caps with wires on yet?
[This message has been edited by RUNDLC (edited 05-24-2009).]
IP: Logged
11:01 PM
BlackGT Codde Member
Posts: 1107 From: Gallup, New Mexico Registered: Mar 2008
Russ, it is about time you started posting pics of this thing so I do not have to keep it a secret any longer!!
You should post the details of your tranny mounted starter in the LS4/F40 thread since you are using a stock fiero ring gear, your starter solution might work for the F40 as well.
IP: Logged
08:27 AM
Dennis LaGrua Member
Posts: 15527 From: Hillsborough, NJ U.S.A. Registered: May 2000
I'll give you an A+ for creativity but I am not so sure that the design will work. The first question is strut tower strength and rigidity. You've narrowed the strut towers and did you shave the brace beam that goes across? The other area of concern is the exhaust manifold to firewall clearance. While you may get this to work, there's got to be an easier way to get you the 300+ horsepower that you crave. I guess that its uniqueness that you are looking to acheive as some Fieros have already run in the 10's and 11's. I doubt if you will get anywhere close to these ET's.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
C'mon Dennis, be kind. Give him a chance to show us how he's planning to solve the challenges that all of us including Russ Fiero no doubt can foresee. I'd say by the looks of his cradle that there aren't too many mechanical challenges Russ won't be able to overcome. As for horsepower, ultimate top end, 0 - 60 and 1/4 mile times, the sheer gee-whiz factor of this swap over-shadows the importance of any of those measures. I'm sure they'll be impressive just the same.
Keep it up Russ, and don't forget to shine a brighter light on those parts!
IP: Logged
01:15 PM
Erik Member
Posts: 5625 From: Des Moines, Iowa Registered: Jul 2002
I'll give you an A+ for creativity but I am not so sure that the design will work. The first question is strut tower strength and rigidity. You've narrowed the strut towers and did you shave the brace beam that goes across? The other area of concern is the exhaust manifold to firewall clearance. While you may get this to work, there's got to be an easier way to get you the 300+ horsepower that you crave. I guess that its uniqueness that you are looking to acheive as some Fieros have already run in the 10's and 11's. I doubt if you will get anywhere close to these ET's.
Not everyone wants a 3800SC While you may get this to work?? Looks like he IS getting it to work And you're right, the uniqueness plays a big factor A V12 in a Fiero is wow!!
C'mon Dennis, be kind. Give him a chance to show us how he's planning to solve the challenges that all of us including Russ Fiero no doubt can foresee. I'd say by the looks of his cradle that there aren't too many mechanical challenges Russ won't be able to overcome. As for horsepower, ultimate top end, 0 - 60 and 1/4 mile times, the sheer gee-whiz factor of this swap over-shadows the importance of any of those measures. I'm sure they'll be impressive just the same.
Keep it up Russ, and don't forget to shine a brighter light on those parts!
I'm all for the project and not ragging on the guy, just raising concerns, and trying to apply some logic. This is without a doubt a very ingenious an aggressive project that most of us would not even entertain but if Russ is doing it for uniqueness and to prove a point then he certainly has my support and well wishes. BTW I rated Russ a positive for this project.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 05-25-2009).]
IP: Logged
05:01 PM
exoticse Member
Posts: 8654 From: Orlando, Fl Registered: Jun 2003
Worked on the top frame rails today. The old ones were rusted on the bottom. The rear trunk section is a removeable bolt in section now. Have had the RS dist cap on and off to see if it can be removed in car. The strut tower angles out at the bottom so the cap comes off and goes down. The strut towers are in the original position only the inner rounded section is cut off. The strut cross brace only hooks to the rear flat section. The holes in the rear of the strut towers are where the spot welds used to be.
IP: Logged
08:32 PM
americasfuture2k Member
Posts: 7131 From: Edmond, Oklahoma Registered: Jan 2006
Love it man thats awesome!!! Great i like when pply say it can't be done!!! BUT PLEASE GET MORE LIGHT FOR YOUR PICS THERE VERY HARD TO SEE!!!! Thank you!!!
except this motor is all aluminum and will weigh less than a cast iron chevy v8 .i think this project is awesome , so many people have said they are doing or have done a v12 swap but these are the first pics of one being done .looks great .
Not everyone has to travel a quarter of a mile in 10-11 seconds, not everyone wants a 3.4 or 3800sc. Jezz I say build what you want, I say putting an iron block v8 in a fiero is crazy (JMO). I am glad to see someone doing what others said could not be done (transverse) I am pulling for you, keep it up and can't wait to hear it run.
IP: Logged
11:23 PM
PFF
System Bot
Eau_Rouge Member
Posts: 208 From: Ontario, Canada Registered: Jan 2007
I'll give you an A+ for creativity but I am not so sure that the design will work. The first question is strut tower strength and rigidity. You've narrowed the strut towers and did you shave the brace beam that goes across? The other area of concern is the exhaust manifold to firewall clearance. While you may get this to work, there's got to be an easier way to get you the 300+ horsepower that you crave. I guess that its uniqueness that you are looking to acheive as some Fieros have already run in the 10's and 11's. I doubt if you will get anywhere close to these ET's.
I don't think it matters what horsepower or 1/4 mile this car gets. A true V-12 is sweeeeet!!! I can't wait to hear it running. (in my mind I'll probably compare it to the Lamborghini Miura V-12 -- Everyone has to hear that engine.. so smooooth)
I don't think it matters what horsepower or 1/4 mile this car gets. A true V-12 is sweeeeet!!! I can't wait to hear it running. (in my mind I'll probably compare it to the Lamborghini Miura V-12 -- Everyone has to hear that engine.. so smooooth)
While this is an interesting swap, it isn't up there with many others in terms of performance.
The V12 only put out 299 BHP out of 5.4 litres. A turbo 3.4 or a normally aspirated V8 can easiy match that wthout the instalation problems.
I like V12s a lot (I own one) but I am not sure that one belongs in a Fiero, other than for wow factor.
Russ is a very good friend of mine and he loves fabrication challanges (like myself). I am pretty sure this build is not about absolute performance, but more of a fabrication excercise in doing something very different. He already has fieros with: BBC, SBC, and 4.1 caddy. 8 years ago his daily driver was a 3800 series 1 and there is a near complete 3.4TDC/4.10 4 speed swap on the shelf... He spent many years as an automotive tech, fabrication shop welder and machinist (has a mini machine shop in his garage) and pretty much can fabricate any part needed for any of his projects.
Russ has a bunch of neat projects and not all of them are Fieros.
IP: Logged
07:38 AM
fieroguru Member
Posts: 12331 From: Champaign, IL Registered: Aug 2003
Russ's shop is quite dark and I would rather see more fab work than have Russ take the time to add more lights.
Russ since you are using Photobucket, you can edit the pics to be lighter. I can see them just fine at work, but they are very dark on my monitor at home.
Here is one of my pics from the last time I stopped by a couple of months ago:
)
THIS is the engine that should go into the Miura project. 
