Hi guys, I'm new here, but about to buy an '88 GT 5-speed. The car is cherry, with 16,000 miles, as it's been in storage since '92. The current owner is just sorting out a couple issues before I can go ahead and buy it, but I'm getting ready. Hopefully I'll have it by the middle or end of February.
In any case, the car has it's original silver/gold weave wheels and the tires are ORIGINAL. I'd like to preserve the OE wheels and tires for collectability of the car in the future, so I'd like to pick up another set of wheels and tires for it. Also, I doubt the original tires are safe to drive on. What options are out there for wheels? I'd like to go with a 16" or 17" and I'll select an appropriate summer performance tire, but I haven't found any wheels that look good on the car so far. I would like to stick with something similar to the original design, like a BBS LM (http://bakati.com/s~q-BBS%20LM%20gold.aspx). The other option would likely be a 5-spoke design, as you can never go wrong with a classic 5-spoke.
Any suggestions? Also, is there any issue with fitment of 225mm width tires on these cars? Thanks!
There are million of type of rims u could get for fiero scion tc, Toyota celica, cavalier z24, mostly any rim style that has a 5x100 bolt pattern will bolt up Im in the process of trying to find z24 02 rims or celica gts rims for my 86 gt They also have a 5 spoke style as well
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07:02 AM
fierosound Member
Posts: 15190 From: Calgary, Canada Registered: Nov 1999
Stock rims on a 88 are 6" wide on front and 7" wide on rear. Earlier years had the same width wheels on the front and rear.
This is because the front track on the 88's is wider with the redesigned front suspension. This is something to keep in mind when buying new wheels. You don't want the front wheels "sticking out" and looking goofy
So, from the looks of it, if I run a "square" setup of same size wheels front and rear, as long as I use the same offset front and rear, the outside of the wheel will be in relatively the same position. I'm planning on running a square tire setup, too. That should dial out some of the inherent understeer. 225/50/16 or 225/45/17. They're popular sizes, so lots of options and lots more grip.
Any clearance issues with 225's on the front or rear of an '88 GT on 7" wide wheel with 30mm offset (stock rear width/offset)?
[This message has been edited by Z3SpdDmn (edited 01-27-2011).]
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09:34 PM
Jan 28th, 2011
sportcoupe Member
Posts: 329 From: Savannah, GA Registered: Oct 2010
There are million of type of rims u could get for fiero scion tc, Toyota celica, cavalier z24, mostly any rim style that has a 5x100 bolt pattern will bolt up Im in the process of trying to find z24 02 rims or celica gts rims for my 86 gt They also have a 5 spoke style as well
Careful now, just because a wheel has a 5x100 bolt pattern doesn't mean it'll bolt right on to a Fiero. You have got to look at hub bore size as well. I know for a fact that a 17" Scion wheel will not bolt on unless you machine out the hub center some. I did the Scion wheels on my '88 (and they look great too).
Also, I'm looking at the offsets. It looks like I'd want a 30mm offset in a 7" wide wheel, front and back. Most of the tC wheels on Tire rack are 40 to 48mm offset, depending on the width. I could just run 5mm spacers if needed, but I suspect they'd be fine. Tire Rack isn't posting any of the hub bores. I've run into the same problem trying to run wheels from a SpecMiata on my E30. I was going to have my friends at Forgeline bore out the centers, but their machine was down for a couple months. So, I ended up selling them and just buying another set with the proper bore.
As I'm typing this, I'm finding myself very surprised that the Fiero's wheels are hub-centric. I thought that most domestic cars were just lug-centric. That's a good thing, though.
I have Scion tC wheels on my Fiero as well. Yes, you have to open the bore, I was able to machine them myself but it shouldn't cost much to have it done. What I like about the Scion rims is that they are a high quality wheel, not those cheapo rims that pep boys and other places sell that are Chinese. Plus, you can get a good deal on eBay from some tC owner who put on some crappy wheel and wants to get rid of the factory rims. I bought mine in June off eBay and paid $209.00 INCLUDING shipping for 4 wheels that were in near perfect condition.
[This message has been edited by TONY_C (edited 01-28-2011).]
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04:00 PM
Alex4mula Member
Posts: 7403 From: Canton, MI US Registered: Dec 1999
Also, I'm looking at the offsets. It looks like I'd want a 30mm offset ...
Good luck finding that in a non-custom wheel. Most out there I see are 42-35. For the front I preffer 42. The rear usually is ok up to 35 if rim is less than 8.5". It is my experience that for example a 7" wheel with 42-45 offset will be great at front but maybe a little tucked in at the back. A 35 offset will be great at back but then a little bit out at front. This is all if you are really picky on that. The major problem is to find a rim design that you like that will have both (42 and 35) for a great fit front and back. I have that on my red car. The yellow has 7.5" and 35mm all around. The front looks ok for me. But the steering effort is much harder than in the red one wih 42mm. It is all a compromise. Good luck.
Based on what you're saying, in order to preserve a square wheel/tire setup (which allows 4-wheel rotations), I would want to run a 5-8mm spacer in the rear. Sweet. I think I've found my solution.
I just went to see the car last night and heard it run for the first time. It sounds great! Looking forward to getting it.
Based on what you're saying, in order to preserve a square wheel/tire setup (which allows 4-wheel rotations), I would want to run a 5-8mm spacer in the rear.
Normally, the tires sizes are staggered - the rear tires are wider than the front. Stock size for 88 GT is 205/60R15 front and 215/60R15 rear. You're obviously planning to run the same size front and rear. Any particular reason?
Normally, the tires sizes are staggered - the rear tires are wider than the front. Stock size for 88 GT is 205/60R15 front and 215/60R15 rear. You're obviously planning to run the same size front and rear. Any particular reason?
So, I've found the wheels that I want, but I'm having a HELL of a time finding anything with little enough offset (in the 30-35mm range). I REALLY want BBS LM's for the car, but at $3,000/set, they're worth more than most Fieros (not OUR Fieros, of course ).
So, I'd need a 10mm spacer up front and 10-15mm spacer out back. So, my question is, how much spacer can you add while still being able to guarantee full thread engagement? I believe I could just run longer bolts... http://store.blackforestind...com/bfi10whsp5x.html
And, by the way, looking at what tire sizes are available, I'm probably going with 225/45/17 front and 235/45/17 rears. That will also keep the stock pitch with the front tires being slightly shorter than the rears. Alas, I won't be able to rotate. But, I won't drive the car a whole lot, so I'm not really caring any more. I'm pretty much looking between the Continental ExtremeContact DW, The Bridgestone RE760 Sports (which I had on my Z4 Coupe) and the Michelin PS2's (which I ran on our One Lap of America car). I might pony up for the Michelins. They're the best all-around summer tire out there. 4000 miles of street and track convinced me of that.
Let me know what you guys think. The car I'm getting is Black with beige interior and the stock wheels are gold lace with silver lips. So, I'm kindof going for a period-correct look here. Thanks, Anthony
[This message has been edited by Z3SpdDmn (edited 02-14-2011).]
So, I just ordered the replica wheels with the Bridgestones. They didn't have the Michelins and getting the entire package from this place proved to be most economical. However, I just realized that the hubs on the Fiero are studded with lug nuts, not threaded with lug bolts. D'oh. I'm used to German cars...
So, my wheel/tire/alignment guy will press the studs for me for free if I get him the hubs. So, I guess that'll be my first project. I may even do it this weekend as soon as I get the car home. Does anyone know where I can get 10-15mm longer studs? Also, what is the size of the rear axle nut?
Can anyone confirm that they'll work? Per my research and calculations, the stock studs are 41.5mm thread length (+ 8mm knurl length) and I need to add 10-15mm. That converts to 2.165", so I figured I should be ok with 2.1 to 2.2" threads. The late GM studs are 2.5" - .315 knurl length = 2.185". Should be perfect! ....if I got it all right...
I wouldn't worry with 45mm in the front. Why you want a 35mm offset there? I think 42 is perfect, 45 good adn 45 way to far outside. For teh rear the 45mm may tuck in a little but if I were you I would try the wheels first as is and then go crazy changing studs and spacers if you don't like it. And please post pics. I think those wheels look great and very close to stock ones. I was going to get them and widen the rear to 9.5" but I think I'll do 18s instead.
I wouldn't worry with 45mm in the front. Why you want a 35mm offset there? I think 42 is perfect, 45 good adn 45 way to far outside. For teh rear the 45mm may tuck in a little but if I were you I would try the wheels first as is and then go crazy changing studs and spacers if you don't like it. And please post pics. I think those wheels look great and very close to stock ones. I was going to get them and widen the rear to 9.5" but I think I'll do 18s instead.
I'm kindof thinking that I might be overreacting on the difference that 10mm will make... I think I'm going to hold off on getting spacers until after I get the wheels on. I have a set of 5mm spacers at home that should work, so I'll throw those on the rear and see how everything fits up. I've bought the studs, but I could probably return them or resell them if I needed to. I would much rather NOT pull the hubs, lol. And, of course, pictures will be coming in a couple weeks, after I get the wheels on! Thanks for your input.
I don't know if anyone is following this thread, but here's a quick update... I'm stuck in Huntsville (just minutes from The Fiero Factory) for work all week every week for the past few weeks and the next 5 weeks. This is excruciating, since I picked up the car last weekend and it's sitting at home without me!! I'm impatient, though, and I want the car as "done" as possible, as quickly as possible. SO...
I've ordered the BBS LM replicas with the Bridgestone RE760 Sports (F:225/45/17 / R:235/45/17), as I mentioned. Those will arrive this week. Since the car needs an alignment, I figured I'd do the lowering springs and shocks/struts at the same time. I can't believe that there are literally NO matched sets out there, aside from The Fiero Store's custom lowering springs. I had to get KYB Gas-A-Just fronts and GR-2 rears since I couldn't get a matched set without going to the Koni's (more than I wanted to spend). I got the shocks from Tire Rack since their prices were considerably cheaper than TFS and they were in stock, only 1-day delivery away from me. Also, typing this just reminded me I have a $100 gift certificate there that I won at a BMWCCA Club Race, so hopefully they'll still let me use it!
Fortunately, despite being stuck in AL, I've got a great friend in my crew chief / engineer and he stopped by my fabricator/mechanic's house, got the shop key, went to my house, picked up the Fiero, went to the shop, dropped it off, and came back with my roommate. The springs/shocks/struts will be installed on Friday. Then, Saturday morning, I'll throw the new wheels/tires on and take the car 200 yards down the street to the alignment shop. THEN, I WILL TAKE THE CAR FOR IT'S FIRST REAL DRIVE!
I'm excited, if you can't tell. It's funny because I haven't been this excited over a "new" car since probably my first sports car (2.8L Z3 when I was 20).
Does anyone have any basic alignment settings for a 1" lowered '88 GT? I figure Camber: -1 degree front and -1.5 rear (up to -1.5F / -2R), with 1/16-1/8" toe-in front and 0 toe rear. This should be a relatively sporty street alignment. But this is JUST MY ESTIMATE. If anyone could provide me with a baseline, I'd appreciate it! Thanks!
It might have already been said but you have to be very careful on your choice for an 88 car. 88's had a different offset than its predecessors that if not correct the car will not ride right.
Right now on my 88 Formula I'm running a staggered with nitto tires 225/40zr17 on the front. 255/35zr18 on the rear.
They hold the road pretty well but they are there for more function that fashion. (its an engine swapped car)
[This message has been edited by pontiackid86 (edited 02-22-2011).]
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09:36 PM
Feb 26th, 2011
Alex4mula Member
Posts: 7403 From: Canton, MI US Registered: Dec 1999
I have yet to see an 88 Fiero, which has hubs that are one inch further outboard in the front than the back, that is obviously about 25.4mm, with the same offset on all 4 wheels that looks good. If you don't stagger the offset on wheels you are either going to look really tucked in the back or stuck way out in the front. Some people care less than others, but it is always noticeable. If you stagger one inch wider wheels in the back than the front then you are looking at a difference in offset of about 12.5mm or so. A front wheel that is larger than 7 inches wide could have problems with rubbing on the 88 from comments in other threads.
Once again, if you don't use mid-40s offset in the front, the wheel is going to noticeably stick out of the fender. If you use that same wheel in the back it's going to look noticeably tucked. It's all up to taste, but I would prefer a stock looking fitment. Good luck on your search.
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[This message has been edited by carbon (edited 02-26-2011).]
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05:04 PM
Feb 28th, 2011
Alex4mula Member
Posts: 7403 From: Canton, MI US Registered: Dec 1999
Yup. And new suspension, too! I'm trying to post the pictures on picasa but my account is being annoying.
I went without spacers, but have 5mm spacers on order for the rear. The fronts are lining up real well. Unfortunately, due to the lack of suspension options for the '88, I was able to get KYB Gas-A-Justs for the front, but only the stock-like GR-2's for the rear. It was immediately apparent to me that the rear is severely under-damped. I haven't been able to research the car much so maybe there's a better strut for the rear that's more comparable to the Gas-A-Just, without spending the money on Koni's. I got the Fiero Store 1" lowering springs (I found ZERO other options) and I got the shocks/struts from Tire Rack.
My alignment ended up with about -.9 degrees front camber and -1.7 degrees rear, 4 degrees of caster, about 1/8" toe in Front and 1/16" toe in rear. The alignment feels great and I even felt the car out through some spirited driving up a twisty, hilly road. I'm recognizing that the car needs much more aggressive brake pads (and definitely a full fluid-flush) and the final drive ratio is really tall. It revs slow and the revs are real low on the highway. I guess it takes full advantage of it's torque that way, but a lower diff ratio would really liven things up. These are just my impressions... Saturday was my first time really driving one of these!!
It's fun, though! It has way more grip than HP right now (and probably indefinitely). I'm looking forward to driving it more as the weather warms up. I'm trying to keep the modding bug at bay because I just know that the car could make some real performance gains without too much trouble. I need to think about resale and just keep it stock(ish)!
Thanks guys! Does anyone know of ANY performance rear strut other than the Koni? My understanding is that all rear struts are the same across years, but I can't find anything comparable to the KYB Gas-A-Just (the "higher-performance" one).
devou park covington kentucky right, over looking cincy. been to that park a million times and golfed right down the road a ton of times. had friends that lived in the bluffs.
Since you have an 88 car, you could potentially use the wheels that were optional on the 1988 Meras and have the correct offsets. The Chromadoras are 15 inch wheels and were made by the same factory that made Ferrari wheels. Koeig also makes a 16" wheel that looks nice.
Nelson
Chromadora wheel
Koeig wheel
[This message has been edited by hnthomps (edited 01-12-2012).]
