History:

Salvaged from a wrecked car possibly hit hard on the driver side.

Spent about 4000 miles behind my turbocharged 4.2L (stroked 3900). 245/40R18 no wheel spin viscious standing launches without clutch dumping.

Reinstalled stock 3900 with turbo after damaging HO motor. Reached boost levels in excess of 10 psi several times and reached as high as 15 psi a couple of times.

Trans has synchromesh in it. Several thousand miles back I started having occasional moments of difficulty finding and/or getting into first gear on initial startup and on hard runs 6th gear has been a little troublesome getting into immediately after comming off the gas but I thought my modified pressure plate may have had something to do with that. The gear would grind a little.

This is the first design tranny with the synchro issues that were upgraded in 07.

Today I got on it but with care not to abuse it by gradually but quickly accelerating to about 11 psi in 3rd gear. I thought I heard something on coast down that sounded like a piece of plastic touching the tire but ignored it until I heard it again after accelerating to about 11 psi from a stop light. By this time I had noticed my odometer was not working anymore. I also noticed the noise surfaced after a boost assisted acceleration.

I pulled my VSS sensor after noticing my gauge was getting power and that my Dakota Digital module was lit. The sensor has the dreaded metal hair on it along with an impact notch that damaged the internal coil causing it to fail as well as signal there is something moving around in the tranny that shouldn't be.

Not sure what the cause of the trouble is, wrong tranny fluid, the accident it suffered or the power from both of my motors. My 350 TPI car did not launch the way this one did with the 4.2L motor.

I guess I'll be tranny hunting for Christmas.

I believe there is a problem with the server as I was not able to post a picture of the sensor across two different computers. Hope the tranny holds together until I can get it home. It has too.

quote Originally posted by Joseph Upson: ...Hope the tranny holds together until I can get it home. It has too.

Drive it easy. Try to keep boost to a minimum.

Edit - Where are you, and how long do you have to drive it before going home?

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 11-27-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Raydar: Drive it easy. Try to keep boost to a minimum. Edit - Where are you, and how long do you have to drive it before going home?

I'm in Lawrenceville GA and the plan is to take it home to FL around mid Dec. "Drive it easy", you bet I will.

This would be the first F40 I heard to go down. But there are variables like wrong fluid as you mentioned. Mine has over 10K miles behind my V8 and still shifts like butter. Still have spare just in case. Good that these are cheap once you went thru the conversion!

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Red: TPI V8 + 6-Speed White: 3800SC auto
304rwHP/366rwTQ

quote Originally posted by Alex4mula: This would be the first F40 I heard to go down. But there are variables like wrong fluid as you mentioned. Mine has over 10K miles behind my V8 and still shifts like butter. Still have spare just in case. Good that these are cheap once you went thru the conversion!

I've considered the incorrect gear oil as a possibility but a small one. If I had never owned a 350 Fiero I'd be more inclined to blame the gear oil but I know my 350 didn't put down the kind of torque my turbo 4.2L did or get off the line as quick either so my suspicion is the accident it was involved in or the torque levels reached. This particular unit exhibited some strange characteristics for quite a while and there's no telling what kind of usage it was subjected to in the original vehicle. Maybe I'll have time to open it up when I swap it out.

quote Originally posted by Joseph Upson: I've considered the incorrect gear oil as a possibility but a small one. If I had never owned a 350 Fiero I'd be more inclined to blame the gear oil but I know my 350 didn't put down the kind of torque my turbo 4.2L did or get off the line as quick either so my suspicion is the accident it was involved in or the torque levels reached. This particular unit exhibited some strange characteristics for quite a while and there's no telling what kind of usage it was subjected to in the original vehicle. Maybe I'll have time to open it up when I swap it out.

Yeah I think the oil is not a high probability too. How many miles it had when you got it? How much torque is your car putting?

quote Originally posted by Alex4mula: Yeah I think the oil is not a high probability too. How many miles it had when you got it? How much torque is your car putting?

Not sure on the miles but my GTech accelerometer measured about 260+ lb/ft at the wheels with the stock motor and based on the feel in difference I'd say the HO motor was in the vicinity of about 400. A good launch felt more like a hop than a lunge the bottom end torque had increased so much. There was no turbo lag with the high compression and the wheels never spun. It seems as if high level load is pushing or bending something out of place.

Now I recall an impact like noise about a week ago where it sounded and felt like I ran over something and it popped up and hit the car on the driver side but I didn't see anything in the road early in the morning so I assumed something had fallen off but saw nothing out of place on inspection. For quite a while I've had the occasional problem finding 1st gear and have had the feel that the shift fork might actually be flexing as I could feel a slight slip forward trying to shift into first however the gear would not be completely engaged, but would mesh further upon engaging the clutch some. It reminded me of some of the shifting complaints I read about with it. I believe this tranny was dumped on the market because it has a problem that was bad enough to prompt a correction in the 07 model instead of surplus. I hope not otherwise a replacement will do the same thing.

[This message has been edited by Joseph Upson (edited 11-28-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Alex4mula: Yeah I think the oil is not a high probability too. How many miles it had when you got it? How much torque is your car putting?

I read up on it a little more on the G6 forum and the new symptoms I've encountered were experienced in stock cars; difficulty shifting into 1st especially with a cold transmission (some owners stated they could not shift into first without shutting off the engine when the tranny was very cold), harsh 2-3 shift, stiff overall shift, (a complaint I recently received from the G6 owner who had the custom one piece flywheel made).

My tranny didn't start out this way but digressed to poor function, then again this is the first time it has been driven in 40 deg temps since I've had it. There was info on the forum that indicated GM setup a replacement program for trannies manufactured within the first 12 months of production and that some trannies are good and some are bad for 06 regarding their performance.

Perhaps there is a manufacturing tolerance problem in a/some parts causing the difficulty with shifting that improves when the tranny warms up, possibly characteristic of the alleged bad connecting rods that made it into 84 Fiero 2.5 motors anyway.

Hope I end up with a good replacement.

Mmm... Maybe that is the reason why there are so many new ones so cheap out there.

Getting closer to the end, I just need it to hang on for about two more weeks until I can get it home. Yesterday it let out a whine that sounded like the blower belt on a 3800 SC, only it was about 4 times as loud. I wasn't pushing it very hard. It does it mainly in 1st gear which no longer decels without raising a lot of fuss. Strangely enough it comes and goes in spells although there is a constant low level whine at idle that can be manipulated by putting the tranny in gear with the clutch depressed.

I discussed it with an F40 (Saab) specialist and he said I've probably just about taken out the differential when I explained it is sensitive to high torque loads now. He also mentioned that they have a few modded applications that see 400 lb/ft routinely which leads me to suspect my forged motor when it was running exceeded that by a bit. Whatever the case, he stated that if the differential is the problem the Quaife unit would be needed to make the tranny stronger as the F40 is a "Fix it with a new one" tranny and no repair parts are offered for a rebuild.

The guy I spoke with does performance Saab trannies so upgrades and improvements involve some custom work given there are no rebuild kits available. Sounds like the 284
5-speed arrangement a little.

The manufacturer doesn't even offer specs on setting up the crush sleeve so modifications in that area are best left to a pro, unless you wanna whine.

Well, this is troublesome. I have a '06 version of the F40 going in my car (new not used), and we're hoping to be pushing over 400 rwtq. Then you have to add in the fact that I AM using a SPEC 3+ clutch setup. Would you mind sharing the contact info for the Saab guys so I can have bmwguru call them for details? I have a Quaife LSD, so hopefully that will help a bit. Thanks in advance.

[This message has been edited by mptighe (edited 01-18-2012).]

quote Originally posted by mptighe: Well, this is troublesome. I have a '06 version of the F40 going in my car (new not used), and we're hoping to be pushing over 400 rwtq. Then you have to add in the fact that I AM using a SPEC 3+ clutch setup. Would you mind sharing the contact info for the Saab guys so I can have bmwguru call them for details? I have a Quaife LSD, so hopefully that will help a bit. Thanks in advance.

Definately have a technician call and inquire as I had to go around in "circles" for a bit before I got a reasonable response to my question about the noise I was hearing. The person I spoke to was busy working on a car when I called and apparently thought I was a customer trying to get a rough repair estimate I could attempt to hold him to until I mentioned it was a custom application and asserted that I was sure it was an internal problem due to the VSS being damaged from the inside, then he opened up and started talking, otherwise you'll probably get "It can be anything..... I'd have to see it to tell you what the problem is.".

I don't doubt putting synchromesh in it may have contributed to my tranny woes somehow and probably exaserbated the synchro problems, but considering I experienced the same problems the G6 owners with the proper fluid in them did and didn't know the history behind the tranny before bolting it to my HO motor, it might have been doomed from the start. I have a new tranny already (thanks bmwguru) and it will get the proper fluid along with a sprung hub clutch to dampen the shockload a little more since the stroked motor produces a lot more bottom end torque.

http://www.genuinesaab.com/psi/gearbox.htm

So Synchromesh oil is actually BAD for this transmission? What type of oil is it supposed to use?

quote Originally posted by Blacktree: So Synchromesh oil is actually BAD for this transmission? What type of oil is it supposed to use?

I wouldn't say its bad, only that it is not the correct fluid and therefore can't be expected to have been helpful. The correct fluid is unique and a dealer item only full synthetic oil with a viscosity combo not available at parts stores. 75W80, PN# 21018899.

The symptoms are getting worse. Trying to decide if I should start off in second gear or just shut the engine off at stops. The problem with neutral idle is that sometimes it blocks out 1st gear which is one of the common complaints with the first trannies so I'd probably end up shutting it off anyway. It started out okay this morning but on taking off from a stop light I experienced a harsh slamming engagement as I eased off the clutch in 1st gear. It was pretty much like a clutch dump. It's also starting to look as if there is binding as the clutch is released where the car looks (not feel) like there is a slight hold and release on it before it moves forward. Reverse has an occasional bump engagement also on releasing the clutch. It's strange, kind of like pushing the clutch in briefly just as it starts to engage and quickly letting it back out.

I need it to hang on for one more week but will be looking into a rental car until then since once it's rolling it's fine and I'll need that for the trip home.

I drove my '01 Chevy Prizm for months with a tranny that was making a horrible noise in all gears, kinda like a couple of cans of spray paint being shook, but somewhat muffled... it started out only being noticeable under load in 5th but slowly made it's way down to all gears. It never affected fuel economy, wasn't hard to shift, coasted just fine in any gear... One morning, about two miles from home, it turned into a whining scream and 5 miles later the tires squealed and it was hard locked in second gear. I am glad I was only going about 15MPH in 2nd (I was keeping revs as low as possible) and not 60 in 5th...

You gotta have a rather large pair to drive a tranny with the issues you describe as far as you are talking... Good luck!

[This message has been edited by carbon (edited 01-20-2012).]

quote Originally posted by carbon: ... You gotta have a rather large pair to drive a tranny with the issues you describe as far as you are talking... Good luck!

LOL! Just try to be at the right place when drop the 3+ qts of fluid. I did the same once with a getrag and gladly it exploded less than 1 mile from home. But the fluid line stain on the road to my home (pushed it last 1/8mi) lasted for over 2 yrs.

It's all faith, If that takes me 300 miles, I believe AAA will cover the rest of the distance. Hopefully it won't be necessary, it was decent on the way home today, it doesn't like decel in first and keeping the clutch pedal down to prevent the input shaft from turning while idling seems to help also, anything to avoid another take off like the one earlier today. The new tranny will get the GM specified fluid and possibly even a trip to church.

You will post pics when you get it apart right?

I'm hoping the damage is related to the fact that it came from a wrecked car. The transmission itself is one nasty strong beast internally.

quote Originally posted by Joseph Upson: It's all faith, If that takes me 300 miles, I believe AAA will cover the rest of the distance. Hopefully it won't be necessary, it was decent on the way home today, it doesn't like decel in first and keeping the clutch pedal down to prevent the input shaft from turning while idling seems to help also, anything to avoid another take off like the one earlier today. The new tranny will get the GM specified fluid and possibly even a trip to church.

LOL... church...

quote Originally posted by Fierobsessed: You will post pics when you get it apart right? I'm hoping the damage is related to the fact that it came from a wrecked car. The transmission itself is one nasty strong beast internally.

I certainly intend to pull it apart as I suspect one of the forks may be bent. I certainly hope my motor wasn't too much for it. Having owned a 383 stroker IROC Z with 3.73 gears I'm pretty confident my forged motor put down every bit of 400 lb/ft plus so I'm hoping that it didn't prove to be too much for it as I expect it to crank out even more power with the cam upgrade and intercooler.

I did read where a G6 owner used synchromesh in his tranny and not long afterwards started to hear a gear whine. I suspect this tranny might run higher than usual manual temps and that's why it uses a synthetic oil, how else can you explain the change in shifting ability with cold fluid vs hot fluid. I also understand that synchromesh looks pretty thin/watery compared to the specified fluid.

quote Originally posted by Joseph Upson: It's all faith, If that takes me 300 miles, I believe AAA will cover the rest of the distance. Hopefully it won't be necessary,.

Fairth took me 250 miles, then the Walbro fuel pump took a break at the gas pump. My dash mounted electric fuel pressure gauge was a very wise investment as I saw the trouble coming after the stop at McDonalds about 100 yds away when the fuel pressure only reached about 30 psi on startup. Had it not been for the 60 lb/hr injectors I don't think I would have made it out of the parking lot.

The car stalled out at the pump. I filled up with 9.5 gallons which leads me to believe the pump overheated as it climbed up to pressure after sitting for 35 minutes. Not wanting to press my luck, I whipped out the external Walbro pump that should have been on the car a year ago and installed it in the parking lot after splicing it into the pressure line.

Now I'm at the Cracker Barrel for I don't know how long due to a terrible accident on I-75 where at least 9 people have died. Glad I didn't start out as early as I usually do, I might have been caught up in it. Still have plenty of faith left to cover the remaining ~130 miles.

quote Originally posted by Joseph Upson: ... Now I'm at the Cracker Barrel for I don't know how long due to a terrible accident on I-75 where at least 9 people have died. Glad I didn't start out as early as I usually do, I might have been caught up in it. Still have plenty of faith left to cover the remaining ~130 miles.

Holy kwrap!
I saw that headline on one of the internet news pages. Didn't realize it was on I-75, though.

Be safe, and give us shout when you get there?

Edit - I just went to MSNBC. They said that it's still closed after 15 hours. Yikes.
Of course, with your tranny acting up, I'm guessing that surface roads are out of the question.

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 01-29-2012).]

quote Originally posted by Raydar: Holy kwrap! I saw that headline on one of the internet news pages. Didn't realize it was on I-75, though. Be safe, and give us shout when you get there? Edit - I just went to MSNBC. They said that it's still closed after 15 hours. Yikes. Of course, with your tranny acting up, I'm guessing that surface roads are out of the question.

Made it.

Sat at the Cracker Barrel with a window view of the interstate for almost 10hrs before making a run for it. I followed a big truck by accident intending to drive the route the restaurant was providing customers with and that saved me an hour because the truckers have the info that we don't. Some of it was on surface streets in rural areas and they liked to beat the car to pieces since it's lowered. My 1" drop Eibachs seem to have settled at 2 inches since install.

The tranny is still going, but it was making a new sound when I pulled up in the driveway. That Walbro pump has to go, it recovered some more while the car sat and fuel pressure went up about 5 psi above what it was when I parked and that obviously makes a mess of tuning.

Dang, crappy luck. Glad the car made the journey for you.

quote Originally posted by Joseph Upson: Made it.

Good.

Sounded like a really fun trip. Not.

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 01-30-2012).]

Continued here, https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/120981.html