Hey, haven't posted for a while. I pulled my 2.8 and for a school project, I am rebuilding the engine. I have taken every last little part all apart, cleaned, hot tanked, and magna fluxed. Today, I put my connecting rods onto my new flat top pistons, and installed them into my block. Since my camshaft has gone missing, along with half of my valves, springs, keepers ect.. I figure if I will be replacing it all anyways.. I may as well get performance parts? I am wondering what set up you guys would suggest? I have the 4-speed manual in it, if that has any value to you guys! I thought about getting a more aggressive cam, and making some headers (since the ones on the fierostore are ridiculously expensive). With buying a bigger cam, will I have to be concerned with interference? Thanks. Any help would be appreciated! I'll post pictures as I build it.

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1986 Fiero GT

throw all of that away and put in a 3.4 pr. OR you could stroke it out to 3.1 with a new crank and rods.

Thanks for the input, but it's a school project. I'm not going to just abandon it.

i was joking about throwing it away but serious about stroking it out. thats your best bet at this point for more hp. bring that 140 up to 160

actually the 2.8 and th 3.4 ar ethe same block i wonder if you can bore it out as well...... just use the 3.4 pistons and crank.

[This message has been edited by Niterrorz (edited 02-07-2012).]

Build it up to handle nitrous.

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Turbo 3800 E85 5spd spec5
11.54@132.7

Turbo!

turbo 2.8
http://gallery.me.com/kboretti#100249
415hp

I'm only new to the world of "turboing".. What have you guys done to your 2.8 to make them handle a turbo? Also, what turbo set up did you use?

Haha not mine I wish, the guy who started this thread ( https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/103956.html ) is the owner of that car. He basically just used different rods and pistons because cast will melt and stock rods can bend (at the 20psi hes running) and arp rod bolts, he has to use special head gaskets or have his block O-ringed, and he uses some fancy headbolts. Think he has a turbo cam/ other valvetrain mods and his heads are ported. I dont know what he is doing for computer and tuning and such. I have not done a turbo setup either. Got plans though. The 2.8 sounds sick turboed

Port match the intake manifolds. Or get an aftermarket system like the Truleo intake. There is also the dual throttle body intake. Both of those outflow the stock system easily.
Get rid of the restrictions in the exhaust manifolds where GM welded the pipes together. You may have to reweld the joints but now is the time to do it.
There are several threads on the site that talk about these.
An easy 10 or so hp just doing this with the stock parts. A little more with the freer flowing intakes.
Then do a little porting on the heads for a little more.
You aren't going to get a whole bunch of hp out of the 2.8L normally aspirated.

quote Originally posted by n7vrz: Port match the intake manifolds. Or get an aftermarket system like the Truleo intake. There is also the dual throttle body intake. Both of those outflow the stock system easily. Get rid of the restrictions in the exhaust manifolds where GM welded the pipes together. You may have to reweld the joints but now is the time to do it. There are several threads on the site that talk about these. An easy 10 or so hp just doing this with the stock parts. A little more with the freer flowing intakes. Then do a little porting on the heads for a little more. You aren't going to get a whole bunch of hp out of the 2.8L normally aspirated.

Thanks, so are you saying that I might as well buy stock parts, but just port match the intake, and take care of the restrictions? I just figured if I am replacing it all, I may as well buy performance.

theres really nothign performance for these engines, thats why people swap them out. at this point since youve already sunk the money into the crank and such port your heads and get a better exhaust. thats really all you can do if your not willing to up the displacement by stroking it or swaping the block out.

quote Originally posted by n7vrz: Port match the intake manifolds. Or get an aftermarket system like the Truleo intake. There is also the dual throttle body intake. Both of those outflow the stock system easily. Get rid of the restrictions in the exhaust manifolds where GM welded the pipes together. You may have to reweld the joints but now is the time to do it. There are several threads on the site that talk about these. An easy 10 or so hp just doing this with the stock parts. A little more with the freer flowing intakes. Then do a little porting on the heads for a little more. You aren't going to get a whole bunch of hp out of the 2.8L normally aspirated.

To add to this list porting the exhaust manifolds is good but also clean up the y-pipe in the exhaust as well

There are some things to think about with the cam. A good medium-high performance cam is the Comp Cam 264H. It has an even intake/exhaust duration and works well with a turbo. It can be used with stock springs and stock 1.5 rocker arms. I use this cam with the 3.4L pushrod engine and a turbo. If you go with 1.6 rockers you will need performance springs.

More aggressive is the Crane Cam H-272-2. It's better for normally aspirated engines and needs performance valve springs.

Even more aggressive is the Crane Cam H-222/3114-2S-10. It needs higher compression and is more of an all-out cam.

There are many other brands available with similar specs. You can always custom order one too.

EDIT: by "performance" valve springs I mean ones that can handle more lift without binding. You still want no more than 105 lbs closed spring pressure. And you must measure your installed height for 1.7". I'd also recommend running a zinc additive in the oil. Too many people have wiped cam lobes off new cams these days.

[This message has been edited by Hudini (edited 02-08-2012).]

I have a 3.1 stroker. It has a custom cam, with 1.6 magnum rockers, performance springs, fully gasket matched intakes, hogged out exaust, and a high volume oil pump. It has a nice lopey idle, and really screams. I am more than happy with it, but often think about what it would be like to have more.

I definately understand this being a project for school so...

I say stroke it.

Positively go with a bigger cam.

Do the magnum 1.6 rockers.

Upgrade your springs.

Gasket match your intakes. Careful NOT to remove the bumps in the runners. My redline is near 5,400 rpms after the gasket matching. That is where the engine falls completely flat on power. It used to be about 4,700 rpms. The best mod that I did for driveability me thinks. That extra 700 rpms or so is the best seat of the pants feel for on ramps.

Unequivically upgrade to the high volume oil pump.

(Not an engine specialist) My builder chamfered the oil ports, and enlarged certain passages. I don't know what, or where.

For an easy 5 HP, clean out the inside of the exaust Logs. (Or build custom headers. That sounds nice if you are able to do it.)
Also, the Y pipe is a big restrictor of exaust gases. Add that to the list of thigs to remove material from.

I have been up against another 3.1, and several 2.8s. My mods smoke the others. I have also been up against an LS4. My mods look absolutely childish against that.

Good luck with your build, and post pics. We like pics.

Tony

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Fieroking Customs

I go along with the Trueleo intake making it breath. If your shop teacher wants more stock looking outcome, the Fiero intake can be bored and polished but it just won't make the hp the Trueleo setup can do.

Another approach is the one I did. Holley 390 - 4 barrel, or a Holley 350 - 2 barrel into an Edelbrock (or Offy intake), an S10 vacuum distributor, and then into the fun. A mild cam with 1.6 full rollers, undersized main pulley, (powerpulley), a crank scraper, a 95 amp distributor, reconditioned starter, and these.



Oh my, how those long tube headers open up the bottom end. My rig, without the crank scraper and the Offy, pulls clean from about 1200 rpm to 6500 rpm strong.

The real long tube headers are about 17 hp if the engine can breath enough to use them.

You want to do a porting job on the intake, mild side, and a real heavy port on the exhaust side.

Hope this helps.

Arn

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those headers look amazing and expensive. You cut, shape and weld them up yourself?

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1986 Fiero GT Fastback
1983 Honda Goldwing Interstate
1979 Naked Honda Goldwing

Ported intakes, headers (or ported manifolds) strong cam/kit, high compression pistons and an MSD igniton. A friend modified his 2.8L using these mods several years ago. The result was a 14.9 second 1/4 mile and IIRC 90 mph. The 2.8L is just not a high performance engine. If that 1/4 mile ET makes you happy for the dollars and time that you will spend,then go for it.
Many of us started with the 2.8L and went down that road only gravitating to bigger and better engines but if high 14's is your expectation, you'll meet that goal.

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" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 02-09-2012).]

quote Originally posted by Grantman: those headers look amazing and expensive. You cut, shape and weld them up yourself?

I bought the mandrel bends at the local speed shop. 16 guage pipe. I taught myself how to weld doing the job. The flanges came from WOT Tech on the 60degreev6 forum.

They are all within 1/4" of 32" and they collect into 3" tube.

Arn

I noticed this bearing looks odd.. The bearing is aligned with the tang, but yet it's sticking out.. I'm not sure if that's the way it's supposed to look?


I ordered all my valve train today and it will be here in about a week. I will be adding pictures of all of that. Until that arrives, I'll be porting and polishing my heads, and working on some sort of header.

[This message has been edited by chrisb99 (edited 02-08-2012).]

oh an islander
I have a set of cly heads for the 2.8. if you want you can use them to practice or use. tho you would need to fix a broken threaded exhaust bolt hole on one of the heads.

Here's a picture of the new pistons installed! Now, time to wait for the top end pieces to arrive to I can build my heads!



Some of you have said to "gasket match" my intake.. What exactly does that mean? Just port it out? Sorry, if you guys feel like that's a stupid question.. But I'm 17, and just learning!

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1986 Fiero GT

quote Originally posted by chrisb99: Some of you have said to "gasket match" my intake.. What exactly does that mean? Just port it out? Sorry, if you guys feel like that's a stupid question.. But I'm 17, and just learning!

Gasket matching the intakes (3 of them) requires using the gaskets as a guide as to how much to hog out. Basically, place the gasket onto the intake, use a felt tipped marker to draw out what is to be removed, and hog it out with a dremel tool. Once you place the gaskets on the intakes, you will see where the gaskets are smaller than the intakes. There is a lot of material that can be removed.

In this pic, you can see how the gaskets don't fully cover the intake opening...



Also, use great care when assembling the lower intake to the heads/valley. Be careful to tighten and torque to specs. The lower intake gasket is easily messed up if not taking care. I ran into this after my rebuild. Also, use the black RTV along the front and rear of the valley. A common point where coolant can leak into an engine after a rebuild.



Tony

Awesome, thanks a lot! So where the gasket is smaller than the intake, should I trim the gasket to make it bigger to fit the intake ports?

quote Originally posted by chrisb99: So where the gasket is smaller than the intake, should I trim the gasket to make it bigger to fit the intake ports?

Do not trim the gasket. That's the opposite of what Tony was suggesting to do.

What he said. ^^^

Tony

I built a stroker along the same lines that Tony did. Add to that an overbore and forged pistons for a Vega. The porting is a must for power. I love mine Good luck.

Biggest single improvement on these engines is the ehaust mod - hog the manifolds out to the gasket size.

Too bad you didn't take the opportunity to buy 3.1 pistons and crank - very useful torque increase.

You've bneen getting accurate advice oon intake manifold modidfication.

So the plans have changed a little bit. I popped my pistons out and found out (luckily) my cylinders needed to be bored out more.. AKA over-sized pistons. I bought a valve train kit from Comp Cams with their 260H cam.. Part number: #16-233-4, along with the roller rockers, lifters, valves, springs, all that fun stuff. Seeing as I have all this for the top end. Does anyone have any opinions on forged pistons? Seeing as I need to go bigger anyways, why not go with forged, and that way I could possibly turbo later on? I've put so much time and money into this engine and car, I want to built it a way I will be happy with it at the end of the day. Any feedback, please let me know!

quote Originally posted by chrisb99: So the plans have changed a little bit. I popped my pistons out and found out (luckily) my cylinders needed to be bored out more.. AKA over-sized pistons. I bought a valve train kit from Comp Cams with their 260H cam.. Part number: #16-233-4, along with the roller rockers, lifters, valves, springs, all that fun stuff. Seeing as I have all this for the top end. Does anyone have any opinions on forged pistons? Seeing as I need to go bigger anyways, why not go with forged, and that way I could possibly turbo later on? I've put so much time and money into this engine and car, I want to built it a way I will be happy with it at the end of the day. Any feedback, please let me know!

You don't need forged pistons for what you are doing.

Spend the money on a good used 3.1 crank and buy new 3.1 pistons! They fit your connecting rods.

quote Originally posted by BillS: You don't need forged pistons for what you are doing. Spend the money on a good used 3.1 crank and buy new 3.1 pistons! They fit your connecting rods.

I have read that my engine block must have "459T" stamped in the side of it. I haven't been able to find it on the side of my block. So that's why I have not looked at the 3.1L crank and pistons because I was under the impression that they would not work.

quote Originally posted by joshh44: oh an islander I have a set of cly heads for the 2.8. if you want you can use them to practice or use. tho you would need to fix a broken threaded exhaust bolt hole on one of the heads.

It won't let me PM you, I would like to take you up on that offer!