Here are the results from the Dyno Day in San Ramon, California. For $60, Dyno Labs would do 3 dyno runs per car. You could monitor the results, in real time, on a computer screen in the office.

Forum nicknames are in (parenthesis).

The gathering

John Tinay (spddy) , putting himself in harms way for the sake or horsepower

John's next project. Some super, all aluminum V8 (what kind was that?)

In San Ramon, even the dogs ride in style

This is probably the closest Roy Welsh (silvermist) will ever get to a Northstar. Keep dreaming, ole buddy.

[This message has been edited by fierobear (edited 03-20-2004).]

OK, time for some numbers...

Dyno Labs chart key

spddy's 3.4

Jeffrey Stillwell's (stimpy) 3800

WOW! Look at the TORQUE!

Well, OK, here are the real numbers. Because of some kind of dual ignition, the torque numbers were doubled. Back to reality (sorry stimpy)

[This message has been edited by fierobear (edited 03-20-2004).]

Post 6....but I dont get it....lol

Where are the pics?

Hold your horsepower, I'm working on it.

quote Originally posted by fierobear: Here are some comparisons of the various engines and modifications. I took the best numbers from each run Engine.........................................HP.............Torque Northstar (in a Caddy).................203.1............239.9 stock setup 3800........................................193.8............240.7 automatic 3.4 pushrod, some engine mods....147.9............192.0 5 speed Getrag 2.8 86SE, no mods.....................122.9............155.4 Note: over 200k miles on engine, 4 speed 88GT, K&N, hollow Cat................120.4............156.1 Note: 119K miles on engine, 5 speed 85SE, aftermarket chip...............115.0.............145.2 4 speed Makes you wonder about Hypertech chips and hollowed out Cats. The stock, high mileage 2.8 won the 2.8 derby

John,

The numbers you have for the Cadillac are not correct. The run you saw was Ray (the shop owner) seeing if he could get the torque readings. The way the Northstar is installed into the Cadillac requires the removal of a cover then a plate to get to the coil packs. Therefore, we did not get an accurate torque reading. I decided not to have him remove the plates to get to the coils. You may recall one of the runs showed the torque over 500 ft/lbs. Anyway, the actual readings were 224 HP (1st run) and 230 HP (2nd run). I would assume that these numbers would not change if this system were installed into a Fiero.

- Ray

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Thanks, Ray. Do you have the torque numbers? Are they correct? If so, let me know, and I will plug them in, as well.

Well, I finally mad it home after leaving at 3:30. Scott (not Steve) aka Fastback 86 was caravaning back to the south bay and beyond when I got behinf him fortunately and saw the billowing smoke coming out of the vents and from under the car. Quick call to Scott on the cel and we pulled over at Vargas Road, took a quick look at the oil-covered engine and decided that a tow was in order. Thank goodness for AAA. Amazingly the truck arrived in 30 minutes.
While going back I tried to wipe the oil off my windshield with the wipers and remembered I had no wiper fluid. I pulled off in Los Gatos and cleaned the windows. Apparently this was enough time for the truck to pass us. Near the summit of 17, we saw the tow truck pulled over in the breakdown lane! We pulled over to see what was up. Apparently the truck was heating up and he was just cooling it. We get back in my car, and it WON'T RUN! At this point I was convinced that Scott possesses some demon Fiero curse. Fortunately it was only my cars voracious appetite for thermostats. Yanked out the 5th collapsed thermostat in 6 months, and we were on our way. Whew!

Anyhow, big thanks to John Tinay for putting this together, and thanks Ray at Dyno Labs for being a great host.

THE TORQUE MONSTER RULES!!!!!

Awesome post and great to see a bunch of numbers laid down to give us all an idea of some real world comparisons on the same day... that 3800 car was series 1 or 2 and was it N/A? Looks like results from a n/a series 2 engine, and if mine make same power levels when I get it together, I think I'll be a happy camper. Too bad there wasn't a 4.9 caddy powered Fiero there for comparison.

Wow Stimpy. Sounds like a fun drive home. When it rains it pours!

Thanks for the test drive. Nice car!

Terry

quote Originally posted by Scott-Wa: Awesome post and great to see a bunch of numbers laid down to give us all an idea of some real world comparisons on the same day... that 3800 car was series 1 or 2 and was it N/A? Looks like results from a n/a series 2 engine, and if mine make same power levels when I get it together, I think I'll be a happy camper. Too bad there wasn't a 4.9 caddy powered Fiero there for comparison.

3800SC, don't know if it was series 1 or 2. After stimpy clarifies, I will edit the table.

LOL yeah it was a day alright. The car already had an oil leak that I THOUGHT was the distributor O ring, but I'm 99% sure now that its is the forward (naturally) valve cover gasket. Jeff (stimpy) and I were goofin around on 680 and I got ahead of him (cause he got stuck behind some cars) and all of a sudden I smelled burning oil. Just as I was hoping it wasn't me, I look in the rear view mirror and things are hazy. I only got through two swear words before Jeff calls and says "You're burning oil like a son of a b****." Got the car off the road and theres oil all over the front of the engine, down in the valley of the plenum, all over the cradle, and then some. AAA said it would take 2 hours to get a truck to us, but they found a guy who got there in 30 minutes. And, as Stimpy said, we pulled over when we saw him on 17 to make sure everything was cool and boom his car won't start now. Chalk that up to another collapsed thermostat (lucky, easy fix). My car is back in my driveway now where it will be for the next several days.

Anyone and everyone whos done work on the front side of the engine read the post I'm about to write in Tech and help me get 'er movin again.

Bear: It was 117.4 peak HP and @ about 4700 RPMs and 150.4ft-lbs torque @ 3700 RPMs

[This message has been edited by Fastback 86 (edited 03-21-2004).]

Wish I had gone now. My SCCAOR training was about the biggest waste of a day I can remember. Was really curious to see how the Indy ranked after the mods.

Doing it again any time soon?

Todd: sorry you couldn't make it. I plan to run the 3.4 Formula ASAP, after the paint dries. Maybe we can go there the same day?

Fastback and stimpy: sorry to hear about your problems. I'm glad you guys made it home OK, and that nothing blew up or caught fire.
FB, is yours a 4 or 5 speed? Any mods?

4 speed Muncie.

Mods to date:
Accel Coil, Coil Control Module, and 8.8mm Spiral Core spark plug wires.
Hypertech Thermomaster power chip, which I may be ditching soon after talking to John (spddy)
Hypertech cool fan switch and 180* Thermostat
CRX cold air intake with a Cone filter.
Ported rear exhaust manifold only.
CAMM CAT
Borla (I think) muffler

More to come, including a 3.4 Pushrod (most likely) in the future.

quote Originally posted by Toddster: Wish I had gone now. My SCCAOR training was about the biggest waste of a day I can remember. Was really curious to see how the Indy ranked after the mods. Doing it again any time soon?

Yes we will be doing another one in another couple of months, I need to finish up the 3800sc/turbo/ic one then test it..........Ill let everyone know when its gettin close
So every one get workin on those mods...

You bet! I'm gonna put the other chip back in, fix the oil leak problem, and port the forward manifold and maybe get a power pulley on there too in the next few months. Must...make...2.8...fast...

quote Originally posted by Scott-Wa: that 3800 car was series 1 or 2 and was it N/A? Looks like results from a n/a series 2 engine,.

Holy cow, whaddaya want from a bone stock 3800sc? By Ray's calculations, I'm right at the 240 hp and 280# of torque at the crank . If you can match that with a naturally aspirated 3800, I'll buy you lunch.

I made it home no probs, but then again it was less than 3 miles from my home.

Too bad no toddster. I was really curious to see if he has the horns and pointy tail in real lfe that he does on the forum.

Stimpy, thanks for getting me out there. Anytime you want to ride, I'll show.

Good seeing you all again. Sppdy I'll be talking to you soon about that wing/decklid paint. The hood too if I can get the extractor vent from rockcrrawl. That formula you're building is very scary.

Thanks for sharing the pics and numbers, There's less driveline loss through the manual boxes than I thought in these things.

Looks good guys!

[This message has been edited by jelly2m8 (edited 03-21-2004).]

Oh, and my car has a Series II with 4T65HD tranny.

[This message has been edited by stimpy (edited 03-21-2004).]

Damn it.. I forgot that was today... I wanted to bring the Super Duty Fiero conversion up there and put it on the Dyno!

Also, I thought spddy was going to have the white car going today? No go on that one?

Damn.. I just noticed.. I said damn.. Can I actually say that nowadays, or do I have to have an engineer bleep it out.. Thanx a lot, Janet!

Page 2??? I don't think so!

BTW Goober, the white one isn't even close to finished. The engine is a block and heads right now and thats it. It looks like its going to be awesome, but theres some work left to do on it.

The white one"soon to change" is just waiting on a part from the machine shop(who has a bunch of snails working there) Then it will be complete Bahahaha

Yes, then sppdy is gonna trade cars with me so he has a new project to work on and I have a kick ass screaming Fiero

quote Originally posted by Fastback 86: Yes, then sppdy is gonna trade cars with me so he has a new project to work on and I have a kick ass screaming Fiero

Yea thats true I never thought of that, I will need a new project.
Problem solved

well first I'm going to need to fix it to get it back to San Ramon. Jump over to Technical and take a look at my thread about the valve cover seal being blown (not the problem as it turns out) and see if you have any ideas! thanks!

quote Originally posted by Fastback 86: Anyone who hasn't taken a look at my thread in Tech, heres the gist of it. Theres burnt oil smoke and oil coming out of the dip stick tube and the motors shakin like crazy. It would appear that the poor old 2.8 is just about FUBAR. Anyone who has a 3.4 pushrod sitting around they aren't using I'd be happy to take it off your hands! spddy check your PMs. Thanks!

PM sent

Bump for a member asking about the dyno charts.

darn i really wish i could of went but sort of a long drive and kind of poor at the moment....im kinda curious to see what my 4spd v6 with the CRX intake and hypertech 4spd.... that was pretty good hp for the engine with the most miles out of stock got the best hp?

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no, i dont race anything that has more cubic inches in the exhaust tip then the engine!

I've got those same mods extreme, plus a couple more and I lost to a stocker. I take solace in knowing that my piston rings are fried and that it did damn good considering. John (spddy) told me that he actually lost power with his Hypertech chip and went back to the stock one, so I'm going to as well.