At first, It appeared that one of the hinges was damaged or defective, but after working it a little bit, it opens exactly the same as the other one. One nice thing is that it comes with a wiring kit to extend the wires going to the doors. I'll take some more pics tomorrow.
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12:58 AM
FastIndyFiero Member
Posts: 2546 From: Wichita, KS Registered: Aug 2002
I can see how it mounts to the door but how does it mount to the car? I says the kits is 100% reverseable and no welding.... Let me know. I may be interested in the kit. thanks in advance. dd
------------------ 86 Fiero SE email: fierodustin@yahoo.com PROJECT: 86 GT with a 3800SC Series I
We are all jealous, seriously, lambo doors are sick, many ppl say their gonna do it, but theres only a couple that Actually get them. good luck with the project and keep us posted, peace -Andre
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12:24 PM
1986GTV8 Member
Posts: 1259 From: Orlando,FL,USA Registered: Mar 2002
Rumor- really looking forward to seeing these. My only question (which you may not be able to answer until after you have it installed)... is whether or not the left-to-right motion of the door is restricted once it is extended vertically (does that make sense).
hey FieroRumor you know you just made my year i have just been waiting for someone to buy that kit so i could make them myself you posting them pic's was the best man thank you now all i have to do is scan them and put them on autocadd and deside if the one change i want to do is make the uper arm socket hollow to get me around the patton ones again thanks for the great pic's later,
WOLF RED 88 GT prd # 1212
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01:48 PM
MiZer Member
Posts: 1673 From: Chilliwack, B.C. Canada Registered: Jun 2003
Closeup of The ball socket where the shock slips into.
Here's another pic of the hinge, showing the "bumpstop"
Hmmmmmmm.......auto cadding, you're not joking are you? You guys just might mess it up for future VDC Fiero owners. In the past, Ian or Decah Company log'd in on PFF just to see the reaction for Fiero conversion. When I first posted a thread Who wants decah?, the reaction was mixed. My reason then and still now is: Its a product like the choptop that can further bring out the beauty of the Fiero. However, Car Exces or Decah is a business: To make money.
If they were to find out that Fiero owners were coping a patented (pending) part, wouldn't they go after those and stop any furture production of the part? I know for $1,200 buck is hard for everyone and me too.... to part-with but, come on? Lets try to keep what venders we do have and not make furure enemies for the Fiero community? For that matter, I hope no one tries to copy Street Dreams VDC either, even though it doesn't have a patent.
My car was to be presented at the Daytona Import Bash, but I instead wanted to feature it at the Fiero show. That way tapping-in on more revenue for Decah. They already cover the import arena. However, once the word is out that the Fiero is unique..maybe others may jump on board.
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[This message has been edited by madcurl (edited 02-28-2004).]
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05:07 PM
PFF
System Bot
Capt Fiero Member
Posts: 7657 From: British Columbia, Canada Registered: Feb 2000
I do not think it is right for them to patent some hinges for a car. What is lambo had patented their setup for hinges. Its like patenting a certain style, I mean you can only reinvent the wheel so many times before you get back to the original design.
Its a fad and will eventually die out just like the swapping of the front ends, the big rims, body kits, its all a fad and will eventually be done. I cannot justify paying 1200 dollars for 4 pieces of steel, two shocks and some bolts. Some may like them, but I am ranting about the Decah tryin to patent a piece of steel shaped a certain way. They can read it too for all I care, I will not purchase thier products at a incredable cost. They want a monoply and to control the market, which keeps prices high for us. But hey the whole fiero market is that way.
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05:47 PM
Scott-Wa Member
Posts: 5392 From: Tacoma, WA, USA Registered: Mar 2002
Umm... if you don't want to pay the price... don't.
But THEY designed a hinge that apparently works correctly doing what I haven't seen anyone else attempt before, ie. making it work with the doors/windows and latches stock. Don't rip them off, don't copy their design. If you think you can do it on your own for your self... fine! Do it!
I too would like to see the price lower, but this is a pretty intense peice of engineering that both cost a lot of time and effort to create. It also has to be marketted, it also has to make a profit, it also is something that most people will probably want to be a bit exclusive... isn't that part of the attraction?
My hat is off to the people that designed this for our application as well as the larger more profitable market of late model imports. It's moved onto my wish list for my 88 Formula... once it's up and running with the 3800 series II, if they haven't yanked it from the market due to yahoos ripping them off, I'll be looking to purchase.
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06:20 PM
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
Originally posted by madcurl: I know for $1,200 buck is hard for everyone and me too.... to part-with but, come on? Lets try to keep what venders we do have and not make furure enemies for the Fiero community? For that matter, I hope no one tries to copy Street Dreams VDC either, even though it doesn't have a patent.
I agree with Curley, let's try to support the handfull of vendors that develop something for the Fiero, or else we are not going to be able to buy anything in the future. If the $1200 is too high and you have the knowledge, skills and abilities to design and build your own then do it. But don't just copy their design that's just not morally right.
And I don't think it's a fad...I loved the vertical doors on the Countach 20 years ago and it's still cool today. Twenty years from now Curley's chop top will still be an awesome looking ride.
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08:55 PM
madcurl Member
Posts: 21401 From: In a Van down by the Kern River Registered: Jul 2003
Rumor- really looking forward to seeing these. My only question (which you may not be able to answer until after you have it installed)... is whether or not the left-to-right motion of the door is restricted once it is extended vertically (does that make sense).
[/QUOTE]
If I'm understanding you correctly........your referring the doors lateral movement once the door is vertical, right? I sat in the Prowler which doors appear to be longer than thee Fiero's. I raised the door up (all the way) it didn't sway or rock back and forth (east to west). There was a minimal movement but not enough were it would be of concern. I ask Ian about whether it could "sway" in the wind when the door is up? Another concern is about the shocks in holding up the door and bringing it down. Once again no problem while in the Prowler. Car Excess said that later this year their may offer the fully electric doors similar to Auto Loc system. They might use Street Works system for the application?
It appears that it swings inward and outward only when it is fairly close to be being horizontal. Once ya start bringing it up, it only goes up or down, not left/right. no flappin' wings!
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[This message has been edited by FieroRumor (edited 04-02-2004).]
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12:19 AM
Bradbitz11 Member
Posts: 1826 From: Kawkawlin, MI Registered: Dec 2002
Hmmmmmmm.......auto cadding, you're not joking are you? You guys just might mess it up for future VDC Fiero owners. In the past, Ian or Decah Company log'd in on PFF just to see the reaction for Fiero conversion. When I first posted a thread Who wants decah?, the reaction was mixed. My reason then and still now is: Its a product like the choptop that can further bring out the beauty of the Fiero. However, Car Exces or Decah is a business: To make money.
If they were to find out that Fiero owners were coping a patented (pending) part, wouldn't they go after those and stop any furture production of the part? I know for $1,200 buck is hard for everyone and me too.... to part-with but, come on? Lets try to keep what venders we do have and not make furure enemies for the Fiero community? For that matter, I hope no one tries to copy Street Dreams VDC either, even though it doesn't have a patent.
My car was to be presented at the Daytona Import Bash, but I instead wanted to feature it at the Fiero show. That way tapping-in on more revenue for Decah. They already cover the import arena. However, once the word is out that the Fiero is unique..maybe others may jump on board.
I agree with madcurl.
It's not the fact that the door is opening up that is being patented. It's the hardware that is making it work that is being patented.
A lot of people just don't understand what goes into making a product that makes customers happy and stands the test of time.
To the people that think the price tag is too high, then get off your a$$ and design your own system. Don't copy other peoples' work.
I am a machinist, and I know a little bit about fabrication. The tooling for making these is NOT cheap. Even at $1200 a set, they are taking a risk, and I seriously doubt they will see a dime of profit for a year or more. Everyone wants to complain about price. Honestly, it was a VERY poor business discision to offer something like this for a car like the fiero, and although I can't afford it, I am happy to see them helping the Fiero community.
I actually hope you attempt to copy it. Make sure you post pics when you ruin your car to save a buck. BTW, if you take said stolen design to any decent machine shop, most will turn you down then turn you in if they know who you ripped off. I'm not sure who you get you legal advice from, but no, changing one radius does not clear you. If the rightful owner of the design can prove that you based you design on their patented design, you lose.
[This message has been edited by Azriel (edited 02-29-2004).]
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01:39 AM
madcurl Member
Posts: 21401 From: In a Van down by the Kern River Registered: Jul 2003
Now I know why Decah (Car Excess) is selling them for $1299? It's a year end sale...while supplies last starting 1/20/04. Their clearing out the warehouse!. Thats not really bad compared to their adverage cost of $1600 and up?
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01:51 AM
PFF
System Bot
exoticse Member
Posts: 8654 From: Orlando, Fl Registered: Jun 2003
Gonna have to disagree a bit on this topic. If someone has the skills to make an exact copy of their product for their own personal use, their is absolutely nothing wrong with it.
I really don't forsee a rush of people trying to do this, because plans or no plans,.. it still looks like a heck of a lot of work to me, but to each his own.
Practically everything that has ever been invented has been copied a zillion times over. That's reality folks. People splash cars to make" replicas" (ahem), and all sorts of things, and in doing so run the risk of being sued if they try to mass produce patented items for sale..
Even if the item is not patened does that make it right to copy someone else's work for $$ ?
That is where the difference comes. If somebody is copying Decah's work and trying to sell it as their own for profit, then Decah should sue the Heck out of them.
Personally I don't think they have anything to worry about because i think the quality of the product they produce will be head and shoulders above any homemade garage job, and will speak for itself.
These guys (Decah) are pros, they know what is out there and what people are doing. I am sure they are confident in their product and ready in case someone tries to rip off thier design and price cut them.
[This message has been edited by exoticse (edited 02-29-2004).]
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01:55 AM
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
Originally posted by exoticse: Gonna have to disagree a bit on this topic. If someone has the skills to make an exact copy of their product for their own personal use, their is absolutely nothing wrong with it. .
I struggled with this one a bit myself...Is it wrong to make an exact copy of someone's product for your own personal use? I think it is still wrong morally and legally.
If I borrow someone's Windows XP disk and copy it, that's wrong. If I borrow a DVD and copy it that's wrong too. If I borrow the Decah hinges and copy them that's just not the right thing to do. I know it happens all the time, and it's the risk you run when you put a new product out is that other people will steal the design and copy it. That's the main reason that the hinges cost so much in the first place.
We all know it doesn't cost $1200 to weld up some hinges, but they have to recoupe their investment in the time to develop and test them, and they have to do that quickly before their design is ripped off so bad that they can't sell them anymore without drastically cutting the price. That's just the way it is in American Business.
Now how about some more picture of the installation process? (I'm interested as a future customer)
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02:06 AM
exoticse Member
Posts: 8654 From: Orlando, Fl Registered: Jun 2003
We all know it doesn't cost $1200 to weld up some hinges, but they have to recoupe their investment in the time to develop and test them.
Now how about some more picture of the installation process? (I'm interested as a future customer)
I agree about the price, ..Decah deserves whatever price they think is reasonable for their investment and that people will pay. Like somebody else said above, if you don't like it,...... don't pay it!
I agree they deserve our support and am also interested as a future customer.
Lambo doors are hardly a fad, ..they been around for years,.. people have just not had access to them as easily. I think they are here to stay. Thanks Decah.
According to patent law you can build a patented item for yourself, but you can't sell it to anyone afterward you have to destroy it or you are breaking the law. Also when I worked for Rockford Fosgate (Carbonau Design) they had all kinds of speakers like JL, PPI Soundstream, MB Quart, ect.. disassembled in the lab. I'm sure they didn't copy patented designs but they look at the competitors products.
So just don't try to start selling copies, Because you just might open a bigger can of worms than you expected to.
Steve
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09:21 AM
Fino Member
Posts: 813 From: St. Johns, MI. USA Registered: Jan 2002
I sold to the big tool companies for a while then they stopped buying. Come to find out they were making their own tool and selling it. My Attorney told me you don’t have enough MONEY to win against the big companies. I would win but I would never see the case go to court before I lost all my money. These are little companies that are just trying to help the Fiero people, SUPPORT them not screw them. I spent $15,000.00 on just the die to make the case. I sold just enough to pay off my debts. Like it has been said before “You start copying other peoples products and NO-ONE will make products for the Fiero people.”
Now my question for FieroRumor, in the photos there are no holes in the hinge to bolt on. Do you have to kind of guess by-golly?
Edit: Sorry my hyperlink stretched the page out. Ed
By the way it does cost a LOT of money to apply for a patent. By putting the words "Patent Pending" on the product the person has already spent a bundle.
(a) Whoever, without the consent of the patentee, marks upon, or affixes to, or uses in advertising in connection with anything made, used, offered for sale, or sold by same person within the United States, or imported by the person into the United States, the name or any imitation of the name of the patentee, the patent number, or the words "patent," "patentee," or the like, with the intent of counterfeiting or imitating the mark of the patentee, or of deceiving the public and inducing them to believe that the thing was made, offered for sale, sold, or imported into the United States by or with the consent of the patentee; or Whoever marks upon, or affixes to, or uses in advertising in connection with any unpatented article the word "patent" or any word or number importing the same is patented, for the purpose of deceiving the public; or Whoever marks upon, or affixes to, or uses in advertising in connection with any article the words "patent applied for," "patent pending," or any word importing that an application for patent has been made, when no application for patent has been made, or if made, is not pending, for the purpose of deceiving the public - Shall be fined not more than $500 for every such offense.
(b) Any person may sue for the penalty, in which event one-half shall go to the person suing and the other to the use of the United States.
(Subsection (a) amended Dec. 8, 1994, Public Law 103-465, sec. 533(b)(6), 108 Stat. 4990.) ----------------------------------------------------
I don't see anywhere where rumor seriously mentions reproducing them. Someone says "Where are the CAD files now, Rumor", but I don't see, nor do I believe he is the kind of man to do such a thing. Hell, where's he going to make them? I thought he lived in NY, where there's not exactly a lot of room to have your own friggin MACHINE SHOP!
More pics!
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10:23 AM
Fino Member
Posts: 813 From: St. Johns, MI. USA Registered: Jan 2002
Not to toot my own horn but (excuse the mess though) You must respect the time and effort someone puts into making there product. I for one respect patents and design since I always am looking to get a patent of my own someday on something. I'd hate it if someone came along and stole my research and copied it. If its for themselves, OK. but at least give credit as to where the Idea came from.
86 Fiero SE
