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quote From the eBay ad Lots of Pics to load.. Please wait to see all of them.. 1981 FERRARI 308 GTSi RED WITH TAN. THIS SPORTS CAR IS REALLY FUN TO DRIVE. EVERYONE LOVES THIS CAR! THIS FERRARI HAS BEEN MODIFIED BY 2 OR 3 OWNERS AGO. THE MOD WAS DONE IN FLORIDA. THIS CONVERSION MAKES SENSE! THEY CONVERTED IT TO A FIERO (GM) V6 2.8 ltr. WITH THE FIERO GETRAG 5 SPEED TRANS. THIS MAKE IT REAL EASY TO FIND PARTS AND GET IT WORKED ON. NO SPECIAL FERRARI MECHANIC NEEDED. I JUST HAD THE (GM) TRANSMISSION REBUILT TO THE TUNE OF 1400.00. IT RUNS AND DRIVES JUST FINE. IT ALSO HAS 3000.00 IN NEWER KONI SHOCKS (as stated by previous owner) They are adjustable to the height you desire. THIS ALSO COMES WITH A SET OF REPLACEMENT DOORS. THE DOORS ARE VALUED AT 2000.00. THEY ARE LOADED WITH THE GLASS AND IN GREAT SHAPE. THE OVERALL CONDITION IS THAT IS LOOKS GREAT FROM 10 FEET AWAY, BUT HAS SOME RUST SPOTS THAT WILL NEED ATTENTION TO MAKE IT A SHOW CAR. IT IS AGREAT DAILY DRIVER.Upgraded 355 MOMO rims with Great Directional Z RATED tires! The Tach, Oil, Temp, and Fuel gauges work. Speedometer works (some of the time- I think it is a ground issue) It has some quarks, but wont keep you from having fun while driving it. I do not have the Org. rims. This has the Fiero rear cradle... simply 4 bolts to drop the motor and the rear end. This is a GREAT car to put a LS1 Corvette motor in. It uses the ORG. Ferrari muffler. Windows work, but run slow like all Ferraris. I have the cover that goes around the spare tire and covers the NEW master cylinder. Comes with Manual. Bring CASH and enclosed car trailer. Unless you are within 100 miles. I AM ONLY SELLING THIS COLLECTIBLE 308 (like magnum PI) BECAUSE LAST YEAR I PICKED UP A 348. ( does any one guy need 2 ferrari's??)

So... Considering the fact that a genuine '81 308 is (by today's standards) a bit of a dog, does this technically count as an upgrade? How about with a nice swap?

somebody will like this one.

What I thought was really cool is that it uses a Fiero rear cradle. I had seen this for sale a yr or so ago on ebay and was considering buying it but I used to own a real 308 GTS, same colour and interior and sold it because I was worried it would get hit by some idiot and I would just die if that had happened. So I naturally gravitated towards Fieros afterwards because I knew I could replace one if it got damaged alot easier

The only problem i have is that it doesnt sound like a Ferrari but ..with a N* swap with 180 degree headers it would AND it would be a a really really fast car

[This message has been edited by Erik (edited 05-22-2010).]

I saw that one a while ago too. I think it is great. It is a Ferrari but you can work on it yourself and not pay for the $500 oil changes. The engine bay and under the front hood looks a little rough though.

[This message has been edited by RACE (edited 05-22-2010).]

Only thing I don't really like about it is the carbed 2.8 (maybe 3.4, probably not)... A fuel-injected setup would be much more flexible (and efficient).

[This message has been edited by skuzzbomer (edited 05-22-2010).]

These swaps are getting more common as the Value of the 308 is so low that they are not worth the cost of repair.

This is the same reason many Jags have Chevy engines too.

We had one in this area a while back set up like this. The other issue is the suspension parts still fail and rust is a major issue on these cars too if they have not been cared for.

I've seen two of these with 3800s, one N/A and the other supercharged. As said above this is becoming very common with old 308s because they're so cheap (In Ferrari terms) and service is still rather expensive (you can still pay upwards of around $10,000 for the routine Ferrari service). Why do you think that we're seeing more and more of these cars with between 30,000-50,000 miles go up for sale constantly? It's because likely these examples haven't had their major services performed. The owners bought the cars, sat on them thinking they would increase in value, and now they've fell. It's now not worth having them serviced. I've seen a 90k miles 308 sell for 15k. That's used C5 'vette territory.

Another thing to consider too is the original V8 engine these things came with was not all that up to snuff. While the L44 V6 in that car may be a bit of a downgrade in performance (but not in upkeep and maintenance), most anything else like a 3.4L or a 3800 swap is going to not only be an "upgrade", but also a heck of a lot cheaper when it comes to servicing it.

I nearly bid on a red one a few years ago on ebay that had a 302 FI V8 from a Mustang. 308's are cool vintage Ferrari, but the tune up bill isn't (around $5,000). I can see the appeal of having a cheap motor in one that has cheap abundant parts. And if you were happy with the gutless motor Ferrari put in the car originally, then the 2.8 should be just right.

I would put something else in it personally. 3800sc sounds good to me.

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[This message has been edited by FieroMonkey (edited 05-22-2010).]

Don't forget that the 2V engines originally used in these cars were in the 215-230 HP range. The 4V engines in 1982 (3?) and later were up to 270 or so.

Incidentally, the struts and body-side strut caps on that car are my work. It's good to see that that they are holding up.

Because it uses the Ferrari muffler, it sounds reasonably like an actual Ferrari.

The frame has been cut (hacked) to install the Fiero cradle and rear suspension. The geometry was completely screwed and I fixed that by putting the strut tops where they should be.

If I were doing that conversion I would have kept the Ferrari suspension and mounted the GM powertrain to the Ferrari frame. The only difficult pieces necessary to mate the two would be custom axles. Comparing the cost of custom axles vs. the effort and screw ups that went into swapping the cradle over is at best a wash, and perhaps favorable for the custom axles.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 05-22-2010).]

The killer of a 308 is the service at 30,000 miles. It covers the suspensions and cam belts. This is a very expensive deal and if you fail to change the belts they WILL break. If that happens every valve in the head will bend.

The suspension service is important as it too will fail with out the work.

Many of the conversion are cars that broke the belts and left the engine with a major repair.

There are web sites out there were they show Ferraris getting scrapped as some of the cars values are so low that they are not worth the money to repair them. Some are rare but too little demand, Some are parted out some are just junked due to rust and bad engines.

If anyone has spent any time with a Fiat it is a similar deal. Lots of service, Rust and broken parts.

The later Ferrarris are much better and still take some service but are much better for durability. At least with most modern ones you know you will make it home.

The Bugatti Veryon needs to be taken in Half to change the clutch.

And the Bugatti powertrain weighs as much as a Lotus.

HOLY ENGINE SWAPS BATMAN!!!
an actual original 81 308 and the guy puts in a GM engine and trans??
that is the first time i've ever seen or heard of this being done.
granted I would've gone with a different engine, carbed is cool though.

[This message has been edited by gtxbullet (edited 05-22-2010).]

quote Originally posted by gtxbullet: HOLY ENGINE SWAPS BATMAN!!! an actual original 81 308 and the guy puts in a GM engine and trans?? that is the first time i've ever seen or heard of this being done. granted I would've gone with a different engine, carbed is cool though.

I am willing to bet the reason for the swap was either problems with the original motor and the cost being quite a lot cheaper to swap in a cheap motor, or an expensive service where the cost of the motor swap was less than the service.

I also am willing to bet the owner made a tidy sum selling off the original engine and trans, as well as the original wheels from the car.

Actually, if you wanted to own an inexpensive 308 it is a pretty good plan. Buy the cheapest running 308 you can find, sell off the running engine/trans and with the money do a swap for a 3800 sc. Sell off hte wheels as well and put on something more current and attractive on. When all was said and done, you would have a 308 with a slightly updated look and cheaper more affordable performance.

That's what a real 308 looks like? Fiero engine notwithstanding it looks like a$$. I guess I have been too harsh on Meras and 308 rebodies if a real 308 looks like that.

quote Originally posted by Erik: The only problem i have is that it doesnt sound like a Ferrari but ..with a N* swap with 180 degree headers it would AND it would be a a really really fast car

That's the route I would rather take if I had a Ferrari. Get the real thing and gut-it-out for the reliable parts. IMO I'd throw a LS3 in the back and call it a day (well, those wheels would have to go too).

quote Originally posted by jscott1: That's what a real 308 looks like? Fiero engine notwithstanding it looks like a$$. I guess I have been too harsh on Meras and 308 rebodies if a real 308 looks like that.

This one is not a good example. It is in rather rough shape actually.

didn't we have a guy here a while back who put a 2.8 in his ferrari 3(?)8? His reasoning was that the 2.8 would be cheaper to keep running, but I think he kept the rest of the car intact (no frame cutting).

honestly, I think you'd have to be a complete idiot to consider cutting the original frame to install that sort of engine into that sort of car. He should at least have kept the frame and rear suspension intact and have a very nice car with an underpowered engine instead of a total wreck. The 308 was one of the most gorgeous ferraris ever built and if you can afford buying one with a broken engine you can bloody well afford doing a proper install of a decent alternative engine.

Can anyone recommend a shop that would do this kind of work? I would be interested in more information on having a GM 3800 installed in my ferrari 308. Thank you.

I think I would chose a N* or Short* to swap into a 308. at least you would still have the DOHC's

ixa i have been installing ls1 ls2 ls3 motors into ferrari's and porsche's for several years now. high cost of replacement engines drives the current owners to this choice. a properly rebuilt 308 motor is $20,000.00 installed. and a rebuilt motor for a 911 starts at $14,500.00 installed. ls3 conversion installed starts at 12,500.00. and ls3 has 426hp and cheaper to buy parts for.

quote Originally posted by mera7: ixa i have been installing ls1 ls2 ls3 motors into ferrari's and porsche's for several years now. high cost of replacement engines drives the current owners to this choice. a properly rebuilt 308 motor is $20,000.00 installed. and a rebuilt motor for a 911 starts at $14,500.00 installed. ls3 conversion installed starts at 12,500.00. and ls3 has 426hp and cheaper to buy parts for.

Any pics to share?

quote Originally posted by madcurl: Any pics to share?

No doub.. especially because I live like 15 min. from piedmont

here is one of the 911 ls1's. i dont take alot of pics so i dont have pics of one of the ferraris.

LS series engines in Porsches are actually becoming very popular. There's a handful of them down here in central AR, largely 911's, that I've seen at shows and they're all typically very well done. The idea behind it is just as you said - a lot of power with a cheaper parts base.

It's only a matter of time before Ferrari sues him to remove the Ferrari badges - he's modified the car...

See here: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/083159.html

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[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 10-19-2010).]

quote Originally posted by hyperv6: The killer of a 308 is the service at 30,000 miles. It covers the suspensions and cam belts. This is a very expensive deal and if you fail to change the belts they WILL break. If that happens every valve in the head will bend. The suspension service is important as it too will fail with out the work. Many of the conversion are cars that broke the belts and left the engine with a major repair. There are web sites out there were they show Ferraris getting scrapped as some of the cars values are so low that they are not worth the money to repair them. Some are rare but too little demand, Some are parted out some are just junked due to rust and bad engines. If anyone has spent any time with a Fiat it is a similar deal. Lots of service, Rust and broken parts. The later Ferrarris are much better and still take some service but are much better for durability. At least with most modern ones you know you will make it home. The Bugatti Veryon needs to be taken in Half to change the clutch.

Based on the 308's required maintenance, and cost of replacement parts, I am so glad I purchased my Mera. It's pretty reliable, parts are not hard to find, and much less expensive. Even if it does break, I can fix it myself.

Plus, its fun telling people it's a Mera, not a Ferrari

RICK, you hit the nail on the head for me.... before buying my mera i actually was looking at 308's. first i love the look of a 308 gtb qv but having worked on 308's for years my honest opinion is they are junk lol. good job security...lol. i was looking for a 308 with a blown motor with the theory of putting in a ls2 or something of the sorts. ferrari gearboxes are not the greatest and the suspension geometry isnt good either and after shopping around for quite a while i did not like any of the options i had with the 308. while looking for 308's i found a mera and out of curiousity sake looked it up on google to see what it was. i was hooked to say the least. looks like a 308 but maintenance like a gm product...sold. my .02 mike in oklahoma

say fellas??? do you know where these "junk" , "low value" Ferrari's are??
i would like to scab the exhaust muffler, for the fun of it
ya think that it would fit with maybe a little modification??

seems the old body panels in good shape should be worth something??

good morning....
Daniel

[This message has been edited by batousai666 (edited 10-21-2010).]

quote Originally posted by mera7: ixa i have been installing ls1 ls2 ls3 motors into ferrari's and porsche's for several years now. high cost of replacement engines drives the current owners to this choice. a properly rebuilt 308 motor is $20,000.00 installed. and a rebuilt motor for a 911 starts at $14,500.00 installed. ls3 conversion installed starts at 12,500.00. and ls3 has 426hp and cheaper to buy parts for.

You install all these Chevy V-8 engines in (sounds like many) Ferrari's and Porsche's and you don't take any pictures? Are there write ups on other forums written by the owners of these converted cars?

Rodney

quote Originally posted by fierosound: It's only a matter of time before Ferrari sues him to remove the Ferrari badges - he's modified the car...

Not much they can do really....but beat their chest. Its a real Ferrari and he has a title to prove it.

Im with Mera too, I built my kit after looking at real ones. Im a certified body shop for them. I used to like using my kit as a parts runner when I needed parts. I even had a salesman wonder once if I was trading it in for a newer one. I had to pop the hood before he believed I built it.

[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 02-08-2011).]

rodney... i am completely amused that you find the need to STALK me in every thread i have ever posted in here on pff. the time you have spent hijacking other peoples threads just to try to harass me. the time you have spent googling me, googling my companies, the time researching all the threads i have posted in here on pff. dont you have better things to do with your time and life? as you have noticed i have ignored you. i will continue to do so. this is the only response you will get from me as i dont really care what you think or say or the rumors you may try to start about me or my companies. as far as pics of my engines, monster trucks, sema pics, mera pics and whatever else you have asked/badgered about in the last week here on pff... other upstanding members here on pff have these pics you ask of and proof and will vouch for me. so you just seem to be making a fool of yourself for everyone else to see. actually several of us here have been watching you and laughing at you in pm's. i wont answer your questions, i wont put up pics to your responses, and i wont dignify your stupid remarks. you need to stop hijacking other people threads here on pff. dont trudge up this thread either. leave well enough alone if you dont have something positive to say. again i dont care what you say or think. dont waste other peoples time here on pff. mike

so how does the LS2/3/4/??? engines work out in the 911? does it affect the balance negatively (I'm just assuming the LS is heavier than the porsche 6-cylinder engine and that any additional weight out back would be a problem, especially on older models)?

actually its only 81lbs heavier. but after you remove the original 911 oil tank and lines along with the 9 quarts of oil that goes into it... well its kinda moot. it does not negatively affect the balance of the car at all.