Getting a stuck or rusted bolt out is no picnic.
Especially the exhaust manifold bolts on the Fiero's V6 engine.

Now, I've used "Freeze-Off" products and they do work.
They are a basically a combination of 50% rust penetrant (like Liquid Wrench) and 50% R152a.
The R152a is used to 'freeze' and thermal shock the bolt/stud causing it to shrink enough to break free.



Now bolts aren't always rusted and sometimes just need that thermal shock to help break it free.
You can then use this product which is 100% R152a (and not messy). Use with caution! See can label.
Use the straw and spray upside down to shoot liquid onto just the bolt/stud you want to freeze and break loose.



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[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 08-14-2017).]

While the freezing technique may have some value; I have tried Freeze Off and it didn't work on the exhaust manifold to crossover pipe bolts. Maybe I was doing something wrong but it was total failure. Those bolts are very difficult to remove. The only thing that has worked is the oxy-acelylene torch and even with that, bolt removal was tough. .

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Sometimes it needs a 'freeze' and a knock with a hammer.
And it may need more than one shot. It isn't necessarily 'instant'.

As they say - "your results may vary".
But at least it's another thing to try. ;-)

I managed to get the rusted plugs out of the bottom of the coolant tubes by freezing.
It also worked great on carb studs stuck in an intake manifold.

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 08-14-2017).]

Thats pretty coll I didnt even know about that product. I usually start a week early spraying wd40 a few times a day on the bolts. Anythings better than the bolt breaking off flush and going through the nonsense of trying a screw extractor(which never ever works on rusted in bolts) or redrilling and tapping/helicoil. Ive heated bolts up and welded nuts on them too but I have good luck w the wd40 for a week trick. Also when getting the bolt to move a 128th of a rotation ill work that teeny bit back and forth and ill get more and more turns on it and eventually itll unscrew. Or just snap off flush anyways lol

shem

quote Originally posted by shemdogg: I have good luck w the wd40 for a week trick.

Oh man... at least use the right stuff.

Just so you know, regular WD-40 is a rather poor penetrating oil. Some info Here.

I've use freeze-off and most times doesn't work.
If you let the oil work for hours to a couple days works better.
But Same for PB blaster and some others.

many bolts in the engine block etc are too big to freeze w/o dumping 1/2 to the entire can.
Even working outside that much product gave me a huge headache. inside even just a short spray causes problems and I need to leave 2+ hours to loose the smell.
PB blaster and others smells too but doesn't need to vacate the area for hours.

Can work better on brake bleeders because their hollow and oil gets to the threads from both sides but you have to control where to oil runs on. And then make sure you have some brake pressure so fluid will instantly push oil out when you crack bleeder open. Take bleeder all the way out to clean or replace then bleed the system.
Remember Most oils hate all brake rubber parts including hoses. ("New" SAE J1401 hoses are much better but few Fiero owners has them.)

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[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 08-14-2017).]

For more than 20 years, I've used various methods to freeze metals to make them fit or to remove them. R12 and R134a A/C refrigerant, dry ice. For bolts and studs, sometimes they need a physical shock. I still have my old 3/4 inch diameter brass rod that I used for a drift, placed on the end of a stud or bolt as a punch to strike with a hammer. Keeps from breaking or damaging the offending fastener.

Just today, I used a small block of dry ice to do my front wheel bearings. Races dropped all the way in without the need to drive them with a punch.

Combination has always worked well for me - heat the fastener only with O/A torch good and hot - like almost orange - expands the fastener, crushes any rust/ junk in the threads, allow to cool a little, and transfer heat into the surrounding metal, then either remove or if it is not interested, then hit it with a shot of R152 ( or what you have available) to cool it. Something like exhaust ear, where the ear is pretty thin, keep fastener cool, heat ear one side only to expand it, thus expanding hole, cool fastener before removal.

Or, get the left hand drills out.

Mike

1/2 tulene 1/2 atf works great

Mapp gas torch is my favorite. Plenty hot!

Thanks for the idea!
Its another tool in your removal tool belt when you meet that stubborn bolt or nut that needs to come off.

Freeze off works great, I have gotten stuff off that would not come out any other way.

For those that have had bad luck, it needs to be sprayed for like 30+ seconds continuously to work, it's great on bleeder screws.

Thanks for the info with the aerosol duster! Definitely going to go get some. I've also considered using the nitrogen for freezing off warts but it's pricey. Never tried dry ice.

I find most time its a combination of things that work when it comes to heating and freezing, freeze first, whack, heat with MAP or oxy, whack, refreeze and go for it. Also tightening bolts a touch can help to break them loose initially, and gives a place for the crap in the threads to go instead of getting immediately jammed up.

I have had good luck soaking parts that can fit in a bucket in acetone, atf, and brake fluid, I have gotten some impossibly stuck things unstuck, things I spent more than one week on trying different things every day.

I have even tried using wax from a crayon, heating the exposed bolt threads and dabbing it with the crayon, the wax gets instantly sucked up into the threads and does a great job breaking things loose.

And always reassemble with antiseize!

I've tried a freeze-off product a few times and never found it to work.

I tried a small torch on an assembly I had off the car, with the torch hitting the nut I was trying to loosen. After a while, and no success, I thought it would be a good idea to keep the torch on the nut and hit the bolt with the freeze-off. WOW! Instant flame-thrower! Then I read all the warnings on the can about it being very flammable and thought, yes, that was a really dumb idea. Especially when I realized a while later it was a left-hand thread.

quote Originally posted by couldahadaV8: I tried a small torch on an assembly I had off the car, with the torch hitting the nut I was trying to loosen. After a while, and no success, I thought it would be a good idea to keep the torch on the nut and hit the bolt with the freeze-off. WOW! Instant flame-thrower! Then I read all the warnings on the can about it being very flammable and thought, yes, that was a really dumb idea. Especially when I realized a while later it was a left-hand thread.

The best lessons in life are the ones we (only just) live to make use of!

I would even say use a propane (or whatever) fuel torch, heat up whatever bolt you want to remove, and THEN freeze it, much greater thermal shock and should be even better to break the rust free.

Seems I have been heating a lot of bolts with propane and then dosing them with water to cool them off quickly lately.