I know this is covered several times but... Even if your AC is dead you likely still need to clean before crap causes a fire from junk in/near the resistor pack. I've clean my heater/ac box before (a few years ago) and still get crap in there even when I don't drive much and don't park under trees. Found because I had to replace the blower today... Doesn't look bad right? (Pictures from a small camera turn sideways thru heater blower hole then rotated/etc to show here.) Remove resistor and carefully stirred up the crap... Looks worse now because shape of box hinds more. then carefully used a vacuum thru the blower hole. end result (Little out of focus but not taking blower out again.)
Note the bend fins from earlier cleaning... Many don't have a screen to protect the AC evap and very easy bend the fins even when you're careful.
Best way to clean w/o taking the box completely apart: Remove the blower and use a camera to look at resistor area. Use the camera to see your work too. Any small camera w/ a screen to show pictures taken make this easier. When cleaning is needed then: A. Remove 2 screws and the resistor pack to clear the space to clean. B. Carefully stir the crap using blunt piece of soft wood or plastic. Avoid hitting the AC even then. C. Suck out the junk. Slide nozzle/hose against the floor and/or front wall to prevent AC fin damage. Repeat B and C as needed.
If you have mold etc stuck to the AC then try soft brush to loosen that but make sure vacuuming in done outside or have HEPA filters. You don't want to breath this.
After you're done turn on blower at full speed out side and doors open to blow out the box. Many times you still get loose crap blown out the vents after work on the box.
I tried just removing resistor pack but even with something to stir up crap can't reach all then suck out the resistor opening.
I have a heat only box in a parts car that I'll take picture inside later. Not sure if they have same level of this problem. AC Evap is slanted in the box so airflow forces most junk to the resistor side. Heat only boxes are different. Even if heater only box doesn't push crap to the resistor like above, you want to clean them anyway. Sometime a leave get into the resistor then fries and ashes/embers falls into other junk and starts a fire.
Another note: Cleaning the AC box helps smells after using AC. Moisture run off quickly grows mold to start then add rotted leaves etc... You can use same method on many cars not just Fiero. Even some cars w/ blowers under the dash in the car.
------------------ Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should. (Jurassic Park)
Found mice nest in one of my stored Fieros today. Just have removed five handfuls of what looked like chopped jute padding and paper. Bad stuff to start a fire. Wonder if dryer sheets will keep them out in future.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
Why not put a screen on the hole were the fresh air comes in under the plastic cowling? I am doing this before I put mine back together. Should help with junk getting in there.
[This message has been edited by Spadesluck (edited 10-25-2018).]
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: Found mice nest in one of my stored Fieros today. Just have removed five handfuls of what looked like chopped jute padding and paper. Bad stuff to start a fire. Wonder if dryer sheets will keep them out in future.
Mice nest = mice crap and pee. Clean the area w/ Lysol and other foam cleaners to remove that and kill germs.
quote
Originally posted by Spadesluck: Why not put a screen on the hole were the fresh air comes in under the plastic cowling? I am doing this before I put mine back together. Should help with junk getting in there.
On top under wipers? Run wiper motor w/ windshield trim/screen off and you see have to clear wiper trans when running. Wiper trans take more room than most think because never see it running.
Found mice nest in one of my stored Fieros today. Just have removed five handfuls of what looked like chopped jute padding and paper. Bad stuff to start a fire. Wonder if dryer sheets will keep them out in future.
In my experience dryer sheets help, and at least they don't smell bad.
Here's heat only box inside, pic thru blower opening on my parts car... There is a door, hot/cold door I think, that closes heater core there. (Control head inside of car is missing.)
Seem like heat only box is more open to let a lot of crap thru unlike AC/heat box above that pushes crap towards the resistor. I would clean it if you pull the blower for any reason but doesn't look as bad as a fire hazard for most things. Resistors look better because how it's made but small junk may get stuck, pic shown some burn crap (and some cob webs) on the resistors, and so cleaning out all crap can help. If mice etc moves it you must clean and use Lysol etc too. Not sure how you can clean the door... Old Foam likes to fall off making a bigger mess to deal with.
You can pull the blower on both boxes in minutes so checking/cleaning is fairly easy. 5 7mm hex head screws and 2 power connectors. Both have same blower and fan but is a bit tighter to remove in AC car w/ spare tire in. You do not have to remove sun roof shelf to remove the blower or the resistor set. AC cars can be easier when you have a long 7mm nut driver or socket extension. Magnetic tools help too.
If you can, remove the blower nut to check under the fan. Sometimes things get stuck between motor and fan and rub the fan and can be intermittent noise problems.
[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 10-26-2018).]
Are other types of cooler operating resistors available that could replace the original incendiary style? The debris should still be removed but the fire hazard might be mitigated...
[This message has been edited by David Hambleton (edited 10-26-2018).]
Originally posted by Spadesluck: Why not put a screen on the hole were the fresh air comes in under the plastic cowling? I am doing this before I put mine back together. Should help with junk getting in there.
On top under wipers? Run wiper motor w/ windshield trim/screen off and you see have to clear wiper trans when running. Wiper trans take more room than most think because never see it running. [/QUOTE]
Not on top but under the wipers. If you take your wipers off and the plastic molding that goes around there in the middle is the hole that brings in the fresh are. A screen could be put there to keep the stuff to getting inside.
[This message has been edited by Spadesluck (edited 10-26-2018).]
Originally posted by David Hambleton: Are other types of cooler operating resistors available that could replace the original incendiary style? The debris should still be removed but the fire hazard might be mitigated...
Not really. This setup is still used but have thermal fuse(s) to cut power for overheat from low/no airflow. The fuses often won't blow for a leaf getting stuck in/on them. Some add a metal "screen" to keep out such things and maybe could make that but make sure the screen can't cause a short or reduce airflow over the resistors. Others just use better, often more expensive, resistors that's close to many problems but many are bigger then the resistors here. Still Others have MOSFET(s)/transistors to act as resistors but changing to this setup much harder. google heater blower resistors and look at many images. (Thermal fuses are small cans size of 1/2w to 1/4w resistor.)
Finding a replacement resistor set w/ right values is tough because no-one publish that data for selling parts. Often not even in FSM and other books covering repairing heat/ac. The blower speed affect airflow to rest of systems and cool the "resistors." DIY Replacement/"Upgrade" may cause too low speed and that can cause other problems and oven heat the "resistors." "resistor" here because including MOSFET and other method to control blower speed and need blower air to cool.
Many current vehicles have 2 speed rad fan same as 84 Fiero w/ AC w/ a better resistor somewhere on rad fan motor or fan shroud. Example: from a wreck 2007 Kia, resistor was in the corner of the shroud.
Originally posted by Spadesluck: Not on top but under the wipers. If you take your wipers off and the plastic molding that goes around there in the middle is the hole that brings in the fresh are. A screen could be put there to keep the stuff to getting inside.
Is exact what I meant. On Top of heat/ac box. Watch wiper trans when wiper motor is on. You find less clearance to heat/ac inlet when wipers are on.
Could try just sealing the windshield trim/screen better. Many are warped etc letting in more leaves. Mine is warped where it goes over bottom of windshield. Haven't time to fix it and many used ones are no better.
Gotcha, I was just not picking up what you were putting down at first. No I have not looked at the area with the wiper motor going, that is a good point though.
[This message has been edited by Spadesluck (edited 10-27-2018).]
Everyone should know the potential for losing the entire car and possibly an entire building. I've owned my 88GT since 1998 and have often cleaned out mouse nest material. The ZZ4/TPI swap of 1999 spun a bearing in 2007, cracked the block, and then it sat in my barn until 2015 when I began a rebuild that has taken over 3 years to reach an " almost done" state.
Last week, I connected the battery for the very first time and noticed a wisp of smoke coming from the heater fan/AC accumulator area. In a panic I disconnected the battery but the smell of burning persisted. Since I'd rewired the engine bay I was worried about an electrical fire that had surfaced under the dash yet there was no smoke in the car. A worst nightmare included losing three years of time and $ plus burning down an entire building despite the fact I keep a fire extinguisher in the shop.
I quickly removed the heater motor and found the wheel was packed full of mouse nest. Immediately with no gloves I pulled out all the remaining mouse material and then shop vacuumed all that I could inside the blower housing.
During this 3 year rebuild the keys were not in the ignition but it was still in the "ON" position. Also during my rebuild and F40 swap, I'd had the dash heater control out and it was apparently in the ON position so that when I bolted up the battery ground, everything became active including that deadly resistor.
For some reason, i'm unable to post the photos of the pile of nest material including acorns, factory insulation, and dead mice. The resistor area was packed full but showed the charred material where the fire had tried to start.
Below are images of what I nearly lost, not including the entire building and all the tools.
------------------ 88GT 355 CI Sequential EFI Bigstuff3 , AFR milled 180, Dyno'd at 427 HP anderson@gdsconsulting.com
[This message has been edited by V8Steve (edited 10-27-2018).]
That's only what I could see. The resistor area is still packed like the photo and entire system needs cleaning. That pile includes two whole dried out mice.
[This message has been edited by V8Steve (edited 10-27-2018).]
Yes, AC blower is On any time the key is On unless AC Off button is pushed in.
Yes, you have a lot more cleaning and may need to take the whole box out of car to clean. Please Wash your hands and use HEPA filter on vacuum to clean mice nest more. Best is pull out most of thrash "by hand" so doesn't go thru a vacuum and fine trash exit thru vacuum exhaust and go everywhere.
Normal Shop and Home vacuums are not made to handle HAZMAT and Bio Waste even with HEPA filters but most use them anyway... I would use shop vac bags and remove it after and put that bag in plastic trash bag. At minimum... empty the vac in a trash bag and clean the vac and replace paper filter and wash foam hold by a rubber band.
I would get a mask w/ HEPA filters to clean this mess even when not using a vacuum. Standard "dust masks" won't do here.
Why? Mice/Rats and their waste can carry many germs/viruses that can infect humans including rotavirus and "black plague." Plague is still around but you often don't hear of this because of better medical now. Rotavirus is bad news for many and have killed people. Plus God knows what they used to built the nest can mean have Asbestos and other problems you don't want to breath.
ETA--> I've cleaned and seen many nest before... That's the worse I've seen in a car. So much crap is likely why didn't just burn outright and you fast shutdown likely helps but still smolder to "warn" you. Others here have burn down the car with less junk because of the blower and plenty of air flow.
2022 Edit to fix Shopvac link now they "reopen" the store...
[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 04-07-2022).]
Here's what was inside. The entire system must be cleaned out.
I got the puff of smoke on a car that was not started since Mar. I just cleaned out a heater box that looked almost like that. It was a car stored outside and I pulled the crap out and used a shop vac as well. I just hope that the virus doesn't hit me but the question is how do we prevent this???? We can put mothballs on the floor but will this keep the vermin away?
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
...the question is how do we prevent this???? We can put mothballs on the floor but will this keep the vermin away?
I'm hoping this is the solution for me. This stray cat has adopted me over over the summer, and now lives in my yard full-time. I'm rewarding her here for taking down this 16" rat. She's not very big herself, but she's fearless and efficient when it comes to the local rodent population. Every week or so she presents me with a "gift", just to show me that she's doing her job.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 12-29-2019).]
Just keeping rodents away allows them to multiply and attack in numbers. Extermination is more effective and prevents population expansion. I have 6 traps in the barn, 2 in the pool shed & 2 in the house (just in case). Bait them with raisins. Sometimes get a few mice with the same raisin. There are a couple of cats and birds of prey around; I don't know if they catch any. The traps are more humane anyway. No terror, instant lights out.
Bait them with raisins. Sometimes get a few mice with the same raisin.
I've never tried raisins, but peanut butter certainly seems appealing to rodents... such as these two roof rats that were caught within hours of setting up the trap.
There are many variations of this same theme, but I had first seen this type of mouse trap being used up the BC coast in the middle of nowhere. I was amazed at how simple and effective this type of trap was. Sure, it doesn't kill them instantly... but at least there's no poison involved. And if rodents have gotten into your food or Fieros, it becomes easier and easier not to feel sorry for the little buggers any longer.
[EDIT] I hadn't revisited this thread for awhile, and I noticed that the video I had originally linked to had disappeared. So I've now linked to a different video that not only demonstrates the type of trap that I was mentioning above (rolling log trap), but it also shows three others. The results of the test are interesting. My only complaint is that the rolling log trap that the fella in the video demonstrates had a very narrow log. I would've used a wider one that the mice might've been more liable to try and walk on... before being dumped.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 07-19-2022).]
Saturday while doing the RFTH 23 Rerun, on a cold and often rainy day, I was using the heater and defroster almost all day. Toward the end of the 200+ mile run, the heater motor started making some loud squealing noises. The 2 hour trip home was without heat. Every time I turned on the blower, it screeched like mad. I knew that the bearings had failed in the motor.
This afternoon, I pulled out my spare and set about to swap it for the old motor. Without repeating a lot of what has been said above, this is what I found. Seed bits, leaf bits, pine straw bits, automotive insulation and hair. The car has been driven regularly for the past 4 years or so, but had at least that much prior time sitting with a blown motor and other issues. I have no idea where the hair came from, unless it was with the previous owner. When I removed the blower motor, I couldn't even feel the ballast resistor. Nothing in the squirrel cage. It was all against the resistor and the AC coils. Some of the material had melted into the coils, bridging between the windings.
For size comparison, my 10 1/2 foot is in the picture. The pile is about 5 inches high.
I pulled the A/C completely out of the front, so I could thoroughly clean the fins (toothpick and vacuum). Mice like to climb on things. If they climb on you front suspension (tie rods, hoses), that can lead them to the small rubber tubes that allow fresh air in. There is a fresh air inlet tube on both sides of the spare tire compartment. One leads to the heater core, the other, to the A/C coils. To prevent mouse infiltration again, I cut small pieces of wire mesh (1/4" grate) and installed them at the front end of the inlet tubes. This should prevent mice entry, at least at these locations. This sounds like a common problem among Fiero's being stored in colder climates. Mice are always looking for shelter, when the temps start falling.
Originally posted by sledcaddie: I pulled the A/C completely out of the front, so I could thoroughly clean the fins (toothpick and vacuum). Mice like to climb on things. If they climb on you front suspension (tie rods, hoses), that can lead them to the small rubber tubes that allow fresh air in. There is a fresh air inlet tube on both sides of the spare tire compartment. One leads to the heater core, the other, to the A/C coils. To prevent mouse infiltration again, I cut small pieces of wire mesh (1/4" grate) and installed them at the front end of the inlet tubes. This should prevent mice entry, at least at these locations. This sounds like a common problem among Fiero's being stored in colder climates. Mice are always looking for shelter, when the temps start falling.
Not quite right... There's 1 small hole/tube to drain AC evap and most cars not just Fiero. All Fiero, AC or not, have 2 larger tubes (~1½" total diam) to drain rain water from windshield wiper trans sump area. Right side Drain...
CLICK FOR FULL SIZE
Inside of sump...
CLICK FOR FULL SIZE
Left drain hit the sump between brake and clutch MCs. Heat/AC Air Intake is same sump area below right wiper pivot and breath thru screens under hood and windshield. OE setup allow most times crap get washed thru the drain but big/rotted leaves can plug them and that often needs cleaning the sump. If you block mice getting in thru the sump drains then very likely the drains will plug from leaves etc and easier too. When that happens water in the sump can't drain and can flood heat/ac intake. The smaller AC evap drain can plug too w/o anything to block mice. When that happens will often act as heater core leak w/o coolant to stink or be sticky.
[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 10-29-2018).]
Seems like the thread has been hijacked into trophies and WMD - Weapons of Mouse Destruction. I have a wide arsenal myself but will stay on topic.
Says the guy that posts multiple images of his beautiful fancy engine, cradle, and engine bay... none of which are even located in the same end of the car as this thread's topic.
Besides... preventing a mouse nest from being built inside the heater box is IMO absolutely still on topic.
quote
Originally posted by sledcaddie:
There is a fresh air inlet tube on both sides of the spare tire compartment.
I'm not exactly sure which tubes you're referring to, but it's funny how many people think the water drainage tubes for the front cowl are "fresh air inlets".
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 10-29-2018).]
I'm hoping this is the solution for me. This stray cat has adopted me over over the summer, and now lives in my yard full-time. I'm rewarding her here for taking down this 16" rat. She's not very big herself, but she's fearless and efficient when it comes to the local rodent population. Every week or so she presents me with a "gift", just to show me that she's doing her job.
Thanks, Ogre and Patrick. I did not realize the intended function of these tubes (drainage). It's a catch 22. If you put a screen across to prevent mice, the there's the possibility of plugging from leaves. Although, most Fiero owner's don't leave their Fiero's parked under a tree for too long Yes, Ogre, the A/C condensation tube is much smaller in diameter. I'm not sure a mouse could climb through that.
Can someone please show me where the leaves and mouse stuff accumulates? What do i take off to clean? jon
------------------ Astronomy says we will find a coded signal from outer space. Then we'll KNOW that life exists there, for coded signals aren't by chance.
Biology says there are coded genetic signals in every cell, but we KNOW that no intelligence created life.
I'm the original owner of a white ' 84 2M4 purchased Dec 10, 1983 from Pontiac. Always garaged, no rust, 4-wheel drifts are fun!
I acquired an '88 Formula about a month ago that's been sitting in a forest out in the open for about two years. The car is in surprisingly good condition, but I was a little leery about what might've collected in the heater box over the last 25 years.
I've heard that because there are some "resistors" (to do with the slower fan speeds) inside the heater box, if crap collects in there, anything flammable can actually be set on fire by these coiled wire resistors when they get hot.
I've been holding off using my blower until I had look in there. But the weather's now changing and I need to use the heater. I'm also in the process of removing all the A/C hardware on the car. I don't like A/C, and as far as I'm concerned, it's all just dead weight... so out it comes.
Anyway, back on topic... I've seen worse in other member's pictures in this forum, but man oh man, I'm still glad I took it apart before I used the blower. Look where all the crap was sitting... right against the resistor coils!
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 05-13-2020).]
Pulling the resistor pack and see is clear and do nothing else is bad news. That only shows really bad problems. Is often hard to look in the box thru the hole there too w/o a bore scope.
Pull the Blower motor carefully so don't wreck the "fan" or worse. Use any small camera to look at parts in first post for AC cars and related for non-AC cars.
Unless the crap is really stuck... You can remove whatever thru the blower hole w/ soft wood/plastic tools and vacuum cleaner for AC cars. This prevent problems dealing w/ AC system.
But If mice lived there, Do Not use a vacuum cleaner. That can contaminant a big area very easy and dangerous way before CCPvirus problem currently. See https://www.fiero.nl/forum/F...HTML/141959.html#p17 above
[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 05-14-2020).]
But If mice lived there, Do Not use a vacuum cleaner. That can contaminant a big area very easy and dangerous way before CCPvirus problem currently. See above.
Ogre, a relevant question you might be able to answer. Two years ago I discovered that rats had gotten into part of my unfinished basement and made one helluva mess. Rat poop everywhere. I was able to get rid of the rats, and I was able to prevent others from gaining further access... but I was reluctant to clean up the area with a vacuum due to the health concerns that you've mentioned.
At some point, I obviously wish to reclaim this area. Do the rat droppings continue to be a risk after they've sat for a couple of years? Do they lose whatever it is that's dangerous to us? And if not, what's the best method of cleaning up this freakin' mess? Do I need to use a vacuum with a 50 foot hose so that the exhaust is somewhere outside of the basement?
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 05-14-2020).]
Originally posted by Patrick: Ogre, a relevant question you might be able to answer. Two years ago I discovered that rats had gotten into part of my unfinished basement and made one helluva mess. Rat poop everywhere. I was able to get rid of the rats, and I was able to prevent others from gaining further access... but I was reluctant to clean up the area with a vacuum due to the health concerns that you've mentioned.
At some point, I obviously wish to reclaim this area. Do the rat droppings continue to be a risk after they've sat for a couple of years? Do they lose whatever it is that's dangerous to us? And if not, what's the best method of cleaning up this freakin' mess? Do I need to use a vacuum with a 50 foot hose so that the exhaust is somewhere outside of the basement?
You left the mess for years? Likely already made worse problems by people tracking it all over but let's say not right now.
Again isn't just rat poop and related but whatever used to make a nest often contains HAZMAT like lead paint, asbestos, etc. that's never "safe." If just a "feeding zone" etc w/o a nest, cleaning can still be bad depending on many things.
Many can't pay to clean but can minimize the possible problems. (Face it, Most "Pro" cleaners for this often cost Hundreds of $ or more and many can't pay even if they want to...) You wear a mask and clean by hand tools keeping a mist of water to control dust as much as possible. Even avoid sweeping too because of dust generated. Then "wash" the area w/ disinfectant w/o flooding so "the water" won't run everywhere. Foam spay is easy to see just where you put it on. Let the cleaner to work for a bit before removing/rinsing if needed.
You need N95 or better mask and correct goggles because you work w/ right there and can get dust or spray on you. (Many cleaning products will hurt your eyes too...) Pxxx mask is better here because of use of water and cleaner can try to make filter wet. But for 1 time use N95 should work and is cheap. (normally before current BS..) Correct googles have small air vents so spayed trash/cleaners has a hard time getting in. Example: https://www.lowes.com/pd/3M...fety-Goggles/3776059 For larger areas... If you can't/won't buy Tyvek suit... (often < $15) At minimum use trash cloths you throw away right after done like wear shorts under trash jeans and take off in the same area and take a shower. Don't track the trash thru a house to take that shower.
No vacuums sold by normal retail stores are rated to handle HAZMAT or Bio hazards. ShopVac and others won't say the HEPA filters/bags stops all trash going thru the vacuums. HEPA Filter media keeps a lot of stuff in but any air leaks will allow trash to get out. Vacuum Filter Seals and other parts are simple not made to handle HAZMATs. Example: SV Type W HEPA and other:
quote
*Non-hazardous, non-toxic, non-flammable materials only. Do not use this filter for vacuuming lead paint debris. This filter is NOT intended for use under EPA Regulation 40 CFR Part 745 for lead paint material clean up.
If can't safely handle lead paint then can't handle many other HAZMATs. Plus the big Warning on most SV site pages:
quote
Due to the Coronavirus pandemic, Shop-Vac Corporation has received numerous inquiries about filtration materials in its products.
This communication is meant to answer such inquiries.
First, the filter materials used in the vacuum cleaners are for no purpose other than to protect the end users of Shop Vac products from particles or debris being expelled back into the ambient air during operation. They are in no way designed or intended to protect humans from bacteria, viruses or other pathogens. Second, direct contact or coverage of the human mouth or nose with the filter materials are strictly forbidden for any purpose. Under no circumstances should anyone attempt to make a mask or mask material from any filters manufactured, sold or distributed in the market for or by Shop-Vac Corporation. These materials were not designed, intended or designated for this type of use. Please consult the CDC website for more information at https://www.cdc.gov/coronav...2019-ncov/index.html
If you're going to buy anyway... Buy the smallest vac that takes HEPA bags so hose crap goes directly in the bag. You Don't want any "Dyson" types that might have HEPA filters After the dirt "box." If you have a ShopVac, get HEPA dirt bags and HEPA filter go onto the motor. Trash the bag in heavy plastic bag and clean the rest before using again. Keep HEPA filter on until blocked reducing airflow. Note that Some "permanent" filters are Not "Wet Rated" and get ruined or plugged fast if you suck up wet/soak trash. Check the label. Example: SV Type X filter is wet/dry but JJ is Dry Only. Not sure if Type W etc HEPA is Wet rated.
HEPA vac parts, like N95 masks, maybe very hard to find now because of CCPvirus panic. Like All HEPA products for SV like TT UU Bags are out of stock for weeks at shopvac site and most retailers.
Originally posted by theogre: You left the mess for years? Likely already made worse problems by people tracking it all over...
I know, it sounds strange to leave it for so long. It's a part of the basement used for storage, so no one's been walking through there. I was hoping that whatever is hazardous in rat droppings would dissipate over time, I haven't been able to find any information that proves or refutes that.
quote
Originally posted by theogre:
If you have a ShopVac, get HEPA dirt bags and HEPA filter go onto the motor. Trash the bag in heavy plastic bag and clean the rest before using again. Keep HEPA filter on until blocked reducing airflow. Note that Some "permanent" filters are Not "Wet Rated" and get ruined or plugged fast if you suck up wet/soak trash. Check the label. Example: SV Type X filter is wet/dry but JJ is Dry Only. Not sure if Type W etc HEPA is Wet rated
As I mentioned in my original post, it might just be a whole lot easier to use a long hose that reaches inside the basement from a shop-vac located outside. In doing so, the standard or quality of the filter material would be irrelevant as the expelled shop-vac air would be outside of the basement.
Ogre, I appreciate your information very much. Thank-you for posting it. It's good to be forewarned of potential health issues. I've got to wonder though... I can't imagine that the owners of summer cabins out in the sticks (where rodent intrusions are often a problem), go through all the trouble of using N95 masks and HEPA vacuum filters when returning to their holiday retreat each year. I understand that it might be the best thing to do, but in some situations it just isn't practical.
I think what I'll do, is buy an N95 mask (whenever they become readily available again), and then rent an industrial strength vacuum with a hose long enough to allow me to place it outside while I battle in the basement. What a nuisance!
If your car, camper, boat or whatever is going to be stored for any amount of time, buy some bars of Irish Spring soap. Cut them in half and tuck them away in places (that you won't forget about). I kept a bar in the trunk, in the car and under the hood. Never had mice.
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That's a lot of crap packed in there!
This stray cat has adopted me over over the summer, and now lives in my yard full-time. I'm rewarding her here for taking down this 16" rat. She's not very big herself, but she's fearless and efficient when it comes to the local rodent population. Every week or so she presents me with a "gift", just to show me that she's doing her job. 
I was able to get rid of the rats, and I was able to prevent others from gaining further access... but I was reluctant to clean up the area with a vacuum due to the health concerns that you've mentioned. 
Likely already made worse problems by people tracking it all over but let's say not right now.
