Originally posted by E.Furgal: 30k is 21760.00 take home,, rent, 12k a year, so, you are now at 9760.00 health insurance will eat almost all of that, so bread and water diet..
I would also benefit from a breakdown of those costs. 9k in healthcare costs yearly?
TANF is the cash and it is a 5 year limit, you can never again get it. From what I understand they also have to go in for classes to learn how to get a job. I know people play welfare, but it seems to be more difficult than these articles make it out to be.
Really? Bankers and stock brokers? Monetary policy had nothing to do with it? As much fun as it is to demonize the evil rich, bankers and stock brokers don't control the money supply. The only exception to that is the very specific segment of bankers that are the Federal Reserve. I get the feeling you mean bankers in general and not specifically the Fed.
I'm not saying there aren't abuses by bankers and brokers. I'm saying they not responsible for the increase in the money supply that has caused much of our inflation. Monetizing debt and fiat currency played a far larger role in that problem.
I think it’s more to do with moving to the ‘shareholder value’ based system vs stakeholder. If you look at the chart posted in it, using a CPI inflation calculator, the median wage has stayed essentially flat while the average wage has been increasing; this suggests that growth hasn’t ‘trickled down’ but rather, going almost solely to the higher percentiles.
My gripe with the share holder value system is how intertwined it is with the morally bankrupt wallstreet. We were essentially forced into 401k systems with companies touting how awesome and better they were for us and how much control they allow. When you get down to the brass tax of it, the 401k system has been the biggest fleecing of the American populace. Prime example, before I knew better I had a Roth IRA that I was contributing the maximum allowed through American Funds. American funds in turn, invests this money back into companies. For the ‘privilege’ of actually planning a retirement, American Funds was taking out a 4.5% sales charge, .12% in 12B fees, and a .59% ER that hit every single year. I opened this Roth back in 2011/12 time frame when the DJIA was in the 11’s. Even through the most recent hit taking it down to the 16’s, American funds had made more of a return off my money than I had; I was at like 1% OROR after all their fee’s. This was with moderate risk growth.
So basically wall street got in bed with companies to make employee’s invest and take out a huge cut, then tout how awesome they are for the employee while they get fat and happy. Any attempt to legislatively add clarity to these fee’s gets met with MASSIVE resistance . . .but they tout how these systems are in our best interest.
I would also benefit from a breakdown of those costs. 9k in healthcare costs yearly?
go price out a plan for a single person, no company plan.. self employeed friend is paying 912.00 a month.. my company plan covered me for the first 6 months while out on medical leave, after that it was going to be 990.00 a month..
formula posted a bunch of, what if's.. last time I checked a single person doesn't get many deductions.. somehow reply'n to bdubs post of a single making 30k , formula thinks is a single mother with a child and a bunch of deductions.. not a single childless tax payer.. cost of living here is much different than W.V. 50k gross will not work here for a 2 parent household with 1 child, god help them if they have 2-3 ..
I'm glad you have it all figured out. What deductions did you use for that net income? How many dependents? Was there a health insurance subsidy involved? And since that $30k is so little, did you also include food stamps, rent assistance, heating fuel assistance, child care tax credits (if applicable), etc?
Here's one example: Depending on the individual situation, many people making "only" $30k "take home" far more than that measly $30k. A single mom in this scenario would be FAR better off financially taking a $1000 pay cut to $29k per year after taking on all the benefits.
I do have it figured out, clearly you don't.. as a single mother, isn't a single with zero dependants.. you don't get food stamps you don't get rent assistance you don't get heating assistance you don't get child tax credits
you get head of household deduction of a tad over 3 grand, and that is them just giving a % of the extra they raped you for being single..
studio apartments are 900+ unless you want to live in a dive, and don't value your life, auto insurance will eat 2000.oo rmv fees will eat some more, renters insurance if you do that, health insurance fuel for vehicle upkeep rags to put on your back so you are not naked electric bill that has now doubled (thanks Obama) heating bill food 21 k after taxes does not go far.. rent here is higher than most home loan payments..
now add internet, cell phone, maybe a few dates a year, nevermind a car payment, if you choose not to drive a 10-15 year old used vehicle that sells for 3500+ here..
30k might go far in a doublewide trailer park.. or W.V. where you can buy a house for 30k..
again, where do you get a single mother as a single dependant???
You get to claim yourself and any dependent children. That's 1 for the single mother and 1 for the child. That's from the instructions on how to fill out your taxes.
quote
Originally posted by E.Furgal: I know all to well,
Were unmarried as of December 31 and Paid over half the cost to run your home in 2014 (rent, mortgage, utilities, etc.) and Supported a qualifying person.
For the purposes of the Head of Household filing status, a qualifying person is a child, parent, or relative who meets certain conditions that enable you to qualify for Head of Household.
These rules are stricter than those for claiming a dependent; for example, although you may be able to claim a roommate as a dependent, that person would never qualify you for Head of Household status.
A qualifying child would be:
Your child (including legally adopted), stepchild, foster child, sibling, half-sibling, step-sibling, or a descendant of any of them (for example, your grandchild or niece) AND Permanently and totally disabled OR under the age of 19 as of December 31, 2014 (under 24 if a full-time student) and younger than you (or your spouse, if filing jointly) AND Lived with you for more than half the year AND Single (or if the child is married, you'd have to qualify to claim them as a dependent even if you're not going to claim them as such).
A child that is too old to fit the definition of qualifying child may qualify as a relative for Head of Household. A qualifying relative would be:
Your mother or father, if you're qualified to claim them as a dependent (even if you're not claiming them as such) OR A relative related by blood, legal adoption, or marriage other than a parent (child, sibling, grandparent, nephew, aunt, step-parent, in-law, etc.) AND lived with you for more than half the year AND that you're able to claim as a dependent (even if you're not claiming them as such).
Have you been claiming Head of Household without a qualifying dependent? If so, you have bigger problems than an internet discussion.
Single: Taxable Income Tax Rate $0 to $9,225 10% $9,226 to $37,450 $922.50 plus 15% of the amount over $9,225 $37,451 to $90,750 $5,156.25 plus 25% of the amount over $37,450 $90,751 to $189,300 $18,481.25 plus 28% of the amount over $90,750 $189,301 to $411,500 $46,075.25 plus 33% of the amount over $189,300 $411,501 to $413,200 $119,401.25 plus 35% of the amount over $411,500 $413,201 or more $119,996.25 plus 39.6% of the amount over $413,200
California collects income tax from its residents at the following rates.
For single and married filing separately taxpayers:
1 percent on the first $7,749 of taxable income. 2 percent on taxable income between $7,750 and $18,371. 4 percent on taxable income between $18,372 and $28,995. 6 percent on taxable income between $28,996 and $40,250. 8 percent on taxable income between $40,251 and $50,869. 9.3 percent on taxable income between $50,870 and 259,844. 10.3 percent on taxable income between $259,845 and 311,812. 11.3 percent on taxable income between $311,813 and $519,687. 12.3 percent on taxable income of $519,688 and above.
Single: Taxable Income Tax Rate $0 to $9,225 10% $9,226 to $37,450 $922.50 plus 15% of the amount over $9,225 $37,451 to $90,750 $5,156.25 plus 25% of the amount over $37,450 $90,751 to $189,300 $18,481.25 plus 28% of the amount over $90,750 $189,301 to $411,500 $46,075.25 plus 33% of the amount over $189,300 $411,501 to $413,200 $119,401.25 plus 35% of the amount over $411,500 $413,201 or more $119,996.25 plus 39.6% of the amount over $413,200
California collects income tax from its residents at the following rates.
For single and married filing separately taxpayers:
1 percent on the first $7,749 of taxable income. 2 percent on taxable income between $7,750 and $18,371. 4 percent on taxable income between $18,372 and $28,995. 6 percent on taxable income between $28,996 and $40,250. 8 percent on taxable income between $40,251 and $50,869. 9.3 percent on taxable income between $50,870 and 259,844. 10.3 percent on taxable income between $259,845 and 311,812. 11.3 percent on taxable income between $311,813 and $519,687. 12.3 percent on taxable income of $519,688 and above.
Have you ever tried moving broke? How does one relocate to a area where the rent is higher, when they are literally one short paycheck from not making bills?
Many millions of people do it every year all over the world with little more than the clothes on their backs. Only in America will people chose to stay in an economically depressed area simply because they find more excuses not to move than reason TO move. #1 excuse? An imagined fear of failure.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 10-28-2015).]
I remember being on my own on less than $30k a year. Back in the late '90's adjusted for inflation that was about $20k per year. At the time I was making between $15k-18k a year (depending on overtime). I wasn't living on bread and water. I had an apartment, roommate and enough money to go out occasionally. I didn't own a car at the time. I took out a loan to buy my Fiero for $2500. Got raped on interest because I had no credit but it got me a car.
You can either find a way, or you can find a reason not to. I'm not suggesting it's easy. I know what it's like to lose everything and go from long term unemployment to starting over from scratch. It sucks, but it can be done.
I'm not saying this to say how great I am or be boastful in any way. I'm saying it to point out I have first hand experience in the situation. We didn't have ObamaCare then, but at my income level at the time I probably would have just paid the fine unless the subsidy made the insurance cheaper than the fine.
By the way, you can put off paying the electric bill a lot longer than you can the rent.
I remember being on my own on less than $30k a year. Back in the late '90's adjusted for inflation that was about $20k per year. At the time I was making between $15k-18k a year (depending on overtime). I wasn't living on bread and water. I had an apartment, roommate and enough money to go out occasionally. I didn't own a car at the time. I took out a loan to buy my Fiero for $2500. Got raped on interest because I had no credit but it got me a car.
You can either find a way, or you can find a reason not to. I'm not suggesting it's easy. I know what it's like to lose everything and go from long term unemployment to starting over from scratch. It sucks, but it can be done.
I'm not saying this to say how great I am or be boastful in any way. I'm saying it to point out I have first hand experience in the situation. We didn't have ObamaCare then, but at my income level at the time I probably would have just paid the fine unless the subsidy made the insurance cheaper than the fine.
By the way, you can put off paying the electric bill a lot longer than you can the rent.
You can either find a way, or you can find a reason not to It is not hard to figure out which of the above, that way too many will do nowadays. The "entitled" generations. The "wah wah wah" generations. The "Oh poor poor me" generations. The "OH, if [fill in the blank] would just [fill in the blank] then I, wouldn't have to [fill in the blank] generation will always try to blame someone else, anyone else, everyone else but themselves--always. This country doesn't need a new fiscal policy or new tax structure, or a new industry--it just needs a new people.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 10-28-2015).]
Oh, I could tell, difference is you quoted me and my math.. that wasn't for a single mother of one.. and was in that post telling me how I have it all figured out and how I am wrong.. when I was.. and still am..
let you in on a little secret . my wife.. single no kids.. the year before we got married.. made 30007.08 gross.. I know what the numbers are.. but please, tell me again how I only think I have it figured out..
Many millions of people do it every year all over the world with little more than the clothes on their backs. Only in America will people chose to stay in an economically depressed area simply because they find more excuses not to move than reason TO move. #1 excuse? An imagined fear of failure.
I am not speaking personally, I am not in a economic depressed area, though I have lived in them in the past, and yes it was hard to escape.
1. If you have kids, and you move to something sub par, or live in a car etc. Children services can and will take your kids, so moving for people with kids to much more expensive places is probably out of the question. 2. A lot of the places have family living 3 generations together, people typically move in with family. Here in the USA, that isn't accepted a lot of the time.
I am not speaking personally, I am not in a economic depressed area, though I have lived in them in the past, and yes it was hard to escape.
1. If you have kids, and you move to something sub par, or live in a car etc. Children services can and will take your kids, so moving for people with kids to much more expensive places is probably out of the question. 2. A lot of the places have family living 3 generations together, people typically move in with family. Here in the USA, that isn't accepted a lot of the time.
3. I think you are right to a degree, in the US you are far less likely to have to watch your kids starve to death, or freeze to death. Though either is possible. On the other hand, the standard of living has been on the decline since the 80's, some have been effected by it, and some haven't. Those that haven't don't see the big deal, eventually all of the working class will be caught up in the wage slash.
Originally posted by dennis_6: A lot of the places have family living 3 generations together, people typically move in with family. Here in the USA, that isn't accepted a lot of the time.
This is a culture failure here in the U.S. Grandma/Grandpa can watch the kids, and Mom and Dad can also care for Grandma/Grandpa, besides the family being closer and knowing eachother better, bills are saved, obligations are shared. ..Besides that we cant even keep Mom and Dad from divorcing anymore, that is if they ever even got married.
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 10-29-2015).]
Originally posted by dennis_6: 3. I think you are right to a degree, in the US you are far less likely to have to watch your kids starve to death, or freeze to death. Though either is possible. On the other hand, the standard of living has been on the decline since the 80's,..
I also think alot of people waste alot more money than they used to pre-80s.
This is a culture failure here in the U.S. Grandma/Grandpa can watch the kids, and Mom and Dad can also care for Grandma/Grandpa, besides the family being closer and knowing eachother better, bills are saved, obligations are shared. ..Besides that we cant even keep Mom and Dad from divorcing anymore, that is if they ever even got married.
I think that is what is going to have to happen. People have to lose the self centered attitude, and become family orientated. Generations will have to live together. That should fix a lot of the poverty issues. Allow both mom and dad to work without having to spending a fortune in child care. This means the American dream is dead for most people, and the majority of us should stop trying to attain it, or expecting others to attain it.
I also think alot of people waste alot more money than they used to pre-80s.
Some do I am sure. I have seen breakdowns on this forum where min wage is enough to live on, but none of it covered a emergency. Transmission going out on car would be a disaster. Medical bills, etc.
3. I think you are right to a degree, in the US you are far less likely to have to watch your kids starve to death, or freeze to death. Though either is possible. On the other hand, the standard of living has been on the decline since the 80's, some have been effected by it, and some haven't. Those that haven't don't see the big deal, eventually all of the working class will be caught up in the wage slash.
Actually, the US standard of living has been stabilising since the late 70s-early 80s closer to what it should have been for 2 1/2 decades prior to that--a more realistic and sustainable standard. If people want to dream and live in an alternate reality, that's fine, but they shouldn't expect someone else to give up part of what they worked for in order for that imagination based alternate reality to come true. As I said, those who covert what others have will always find some reason not to make a change in their own life--always.
Originally posted by maryjane: If people want to dream and live in an alternate reality, that's fine, but they shouldn't expect someone else to give up part of what they worked for in order for that imagination based alternate reality to come true. As I said, those who covet what others have will always find some reason not to make a change in their own life--always.
In 1959 30k would be roughly $3,693. In that year... 23 percent made under 3k (24.3k) 22 percent made 3-5k (24.3k-40.6k) 43 percent made 5-10k (40.6k-81k) 9 percent made 10-15k 3 percent made over 15 k
I would say our current wage structure is far worse than 1959 and that wasn't even the peak for worker wages, min wage peaked in 1968 which would be 10-11 dollars a hour today.
This may be more sustainable, but American culture has to change to more 3rd world like. Parents that think their kids should be able to afford a nice house, and a get a great job right out of school has to go. It is becoming less and less possible. When my kids are grown, I will encourage them to stay home as long as possible, I understand the American dream is dead for at least 49% of Americans.
[This message has been edited by dennis_6 (edited 10-29-2015).]
Originally posted by dennis_6: This may be more sustainable, but American culture has to change to more 3rd world like. Parents that think their kids should be able to afford a nice house, and a get a great job right out of school has to go. It is becoming less and less possible. When my kids are grown, I will encourage them to stay home as long as possible, I understand the American dream is dead for at least 49% of Americans.
I wouldnt say 3rd world but, yeah people trying to do too many things on credit. When credit got tight the imaginary world got real thin, suddenly they feel like they are being pinched. You mentioned "American dream" a few times, I think it possible the individuals, (and subsequently the country of united individuals) no longer have the tenacity/character/integrity/moral foundation to create it anymore is the problem.
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 10-29-2015).]
2. A lot of the places have family living 3 generations together, people typically move in with family. Here in the USA, that isn't accepted a lot of the time.
until the baby boomers, it was like that here.. 3 generations under one roof a lot of the time.. now they rather ship jr to day care and grandma to a home. babyboomer=me generation..
Many millions of people do it every year all over the world with little more than the clothes on their backs. Only in America will people chose to stay in an economically depressed area simply because they find more excuses not to move than reason TO move. #1 excuse? An imagined fear of failure.
WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it is moving away from family.. I know it might come to a shock to you,, and some other but.. many still put family first.. has nothing to do with failure..
I wouldnt say 3rd world but, yeah people trying to do too many things on credit. When credit got tight the imaginary world got real thin, suddenly they feel like they are being pinched. You mentioned "American dream" a few times, I think it possible the individuals, (and subsequently the country of united individuals) no longer have the tenacity/character/integrity/moral foundation to create it anymore is the problem.
I would call third world, at least for about 25 percent of Americans. $8-11 a hour, one working parent and first world bills. That probably works out to a near third world lifestyle. At least upper scale third world. Roof of some form over head, running water, electricity. I knew plenty of people that couldn't afford to go to the doctor here in the states. Almost empty fridges. Usually had some utility or another cut off, because they couldn't afford to pay it. Sometimes it was heat in the winter.
[This message has been edited by dennis_6 (edited 10-29-2015).]
I would call third world, at least for about 25 percent of Americans. $8-11 a hour, one working parent and first world bills. That probably works out to a near third world lifestyle. At least upper scale third world. Roof of some form over head, running water, electricity. I knew plenty of people that couldn't afford to go to the doctor here in the states. Almost empty fridges. Usually had some utility or another cut off, because they couldn't afford to pay it. Sometimes it was heat in the winter.
My problem is the ones I knew in situations like that had created the reasons they were there, some were still creating those same reasons. It snowballs. Again its generalities, they dont mean much. Regarding labels, where is the 2nd world, is there none? I dont think the comparison to 3rd world countries is possible.
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 10-29-2015).]
Indeed there are a lot of run down homes in across the country.
I was being a bit facetious with the 2nd world comment, it seems it doesnt come up, people skip straight to "3rd world".
In a lot of the homes, are people working full time. I guess I can see, it being like the former soviet eastern bloc also. The part that irks me, is outsourcing and allowing illegal former labor and abuse of green cards, brought this. It doesn't have to be this way.
