 
     |
| Aluminum Fuel Tank production (Page 1/5) |
|
CJB118
|
AUG 07, 02:27 PM
|
|
I am in contact with a nearby shop, the owner is a master welder, does aluminum tanks, and has a son apprenticing who does CAD plasma cutting. If anyone can provide me a set of plans, I will work with them on a preproduction sample, letting them work from the plans, and with the tank from my 88, while it is off the road this winter. I will test it in my car, and post updates during the process. I would plan to coordinate a production run using advice from PFF members, pricing at whatever sweet spot would get volume and reasonable return, and handle the order processing and shipping myself. What level of support could I expect in this effort, and what variables will I encounter?
I don't have a pet mouse, but I can rent a hedgehog...------------------
1988 Pontiac Fiero Formula, Yellow, original. (CJB #118)
1977 Pontiac Le Mans Can-Am W72, original, unrestored.
1977 Pontiac Grand LeMans
2003 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP L67/MN7 (Parts Car)
2001 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP L67/MN7 (DD)
2005 Pontiac Grand Prix L26 (Wife's DD)
|
|
|
fieroguru
|
AUG 07, 06:15 PM
|
|
I have long wanted a custom fuel tank to increase the "usable capacity to 12+ gallons and be 100% compatible with E85.
With those being "my" goals the design criteria would be as follows:
- Tank geometry to match the tank tunnel geometry as close as possible (no sharp corners at the top)
- Tank should fill the entire tunnel at the front and back of the cavity - move the hose connections to the side to allow the tank to extend further rearward.
- Allow the tank to be 1/2" below the floor board with a slight taper from side to side and to the rear (like a boat bottom - but very gradual) to help fuel stay around the pickup in low fuel conditions (increase "usable" capacity). Using a large holley hydromat in the bottom would also work - but they are not cheap.
- Use thin material (preferably stainless) so wall thickness doesn't reduce tank capacity and keeps weight of tank close to stock (using 1/4" aluminum will result in tank that is heavier than stock - before the additional fuel). Also, in the event of a wreck, you want the tank to bend, not crack.
- Keep seams along the lower surface to a minimum (bend the sides, front and back upwards from the bottom panel. Then make the top in sections that match the tunnel contour). Less risk for leaks, plus less overall welding which is needed to keep cost reasonable.
- Design it to use a remote expansion tank - again to maximize volume. Do the math to allow for the fuel expansion with a 75 degree temperature change. 25% in the tank, and 100% in the remote expansion tank.
- Keep the stock pickup, sender and water pump assembly - just extend the internal tubes to the lower bottom.
The easiest way to accomplish a tank design than maximizes the results is to cut the entire center tunnel out of a Fiero and take it to the tank place.
Flip it over on a bench, put a tarp in the tunnel, fill it with liquid and see what the maximum available capacity is for the fuel tank cavity. If you can capture 90-95% of this capacity (or 100+% if you make it 1/2" deeper than the floor pan) then you would really have something...
If you were closer, I would loan you the fuel tank tunnel section I have sitting on the shelf.[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 08-07-2019).]
|
|
|
|
CJB118
|
AUG 07, 06:47 PM
|
|
That is exactly the level of detail and clarity needed. Thank you for the input. I am able to shoulder some development costs, so I would be willing to pay shipping both ways for a loan of the tunnel section, or one way if you are willing to sell it. I intend to offer the shop my 88 for the winter as a development buck, but your idea would have better outcomes, especially since I am not allowing the shop to flip my whole car over.
The Holley mat item would be an option, but only on special order where it could be incorporated during the tank build. I expect only autocrossers would be willing to pay that level of upcharge.
The ultimate goal should be allowing many owners to ditch their marginal tanks for an easy install replacement, while offering them the ability to add their own accesories, like external EFPs, upgraded lines, easier routings, and maybe a newer model of drop-in sender/pickup assembly. If the tank also increases holding capacity, that would be a bonus.
|
|
|
|
2.5
|
AUG 07, 06:58 PM
|
|
|
Hopefully you can make it work on 86 and 88s
|
|
|
|
CJB118
|
AUG 07, 07:06 PM
|
|
|
This would be for all Fieros, all trims and all drivetrains. I would not be proposing it if any Fiero owner would be left out.
|
|
|
|
randye
|
AUG 07, 07:23 PM
|
|
|
|
|
hyperv6
|
AUG 07, 07:30 PM
|
|
Well I am in desperate need of a gas tank right now for a low mile car I am trying to get back on the road,
I know I am not the only one as most tanks are shot in doaner cars.
I hope someone can get something soon as this is all that is holding me up now.
|
|
|
|
CJB118
|
AUG 07, 08:49 PM
|
|
It would be nice to have plans to start from, but I think this round will start without them. I have a Fiero, a tank, a couple of jpegs, a serious craftsman, and already a nice amount of input and interest. I am currently framing out our new garage, so that is my current priority. My car spends the NH winters safely tucked away, so that period will be ideal for experimentation, and an aim to road test the prototype next spring.
I am hoping the finished tanks will incorporate the marine type sender/pickup, which screw into the flat top, use a simple flat gasket, and eliminate entirely the locking ring goofiness. If someone wants to reuse their stock assembly, that will probably be an option.
|
|
|
|
Spadesluck
|
AUG 08, 06:30 PM
|
|
|
If you can manage to produce this I am sure many would purchase it. Having old tanks like ours is only a matter of time before they start showing "more" signs of age.
|
|
|
|
CJB118
|
AUG 08, 07:31 PM
|
|
|
Thank you, I will relay that to the craftsman. I agree that time is working against us, that the dwindling number of usable tanks may lead to cars taken off the road, to drivable cars parted out, to enormous prices for tanks, and to marginal or even dangerous tank repairs or fabrications. It would serve the hobby to have a standardized, professionally fabricated line of tanks available. I am not a welder, but I have time and resources to gather the needed info, to relay that to a fabricator, to do some R&D testing, and to communicate each step here for forum members comments. If it leads to a working design, I will finance a production run that keeps a small stock on hand so orders can be shipped as soon as received. For that to work, the tank design will have to be standardized, aftermarket senders used, and additional fill capacity will be a secondary consideration.
|
|
|
|
