Abortion thread (Page 2/43)
ray b MAR 28, 05:34 PM
this is exactly where the ''we want less government''
BREAKS INTO YOU MUST DO AS WE SAY
or we will use our oversized [worlds biggest] prison system
our just-ice system that only cares about procedure not guilt
all supported by the church in it's uncountable sub cults everywhere

never mind the effects on teen moms and their kids
WE feel GOD DEMANDS THIS
even tho no body ever talks to god
as you believers just made him up

sorry weird claims need proof
you side has NONE
laws need to be fact based
NOT feelings or even old belief
Hudini MAR 28, 05:54 PM

quote
Originally posted by slicknick:

If you're legislating against abortion, you better be legislating for taking care of people cradle to grave.

No death penalties

Universal Healthcare

Universal Basic Income

Addiction Rehabilitation

Or else you don't really care about people and are using abortion as a single issue.

But the CHURCH can help people with a hand up!!

Bull. The smaller guys do what they can sometimes, but Osteen and the like will spit on you on the sidewalk if there ain't a camera there recording some fundraiser.

Some people don't want babies.
Sometimes circumstances change.
Sometimes the burden is ruinous to all involved.

Don't have SEX if you don't want a baby!!

Get off of your high horse. People are gonna get laid. It's what we do as humans.

Adoption is a great choice

Until there are no children available for adoption, then there's too many children waiting for a forever home. Not to mention the abuse that exists in foster care.

There are even adoption agencies out there that have the gall to not adopt to gays. Imagine having a loving home waiting for you but it not being good enough.

We kill everything else on this planet with reckless abandon, why is a fetus any different.

And cool, maybe abortion will be outlawed in some states. And even some of those anti-abortion states want to keep you from traveling interstate for the procedure, like some prisoner.

Abortion won't stop, it'll just get more gruesome.



So many false equivalencies here.

Every state has a Safe Haven law. No need to rely on charity. There is an absolute overwhelming demand for babies such that people go to Asia to find an unwanted baby to adopt.

From personal experience I can tell you my wife and girls all choose this one issue as to who they vote for. "A clump of cells" as my youngest says. Many women want the right to kill their offspring before birth without having to get approval from the state. They also feel we don't have a horse in this race.

"my body, my choice" also applies to those not wanting to get vaccinated.
Hudini MAR 28, 05:59 PM

quote
Originally posted by ray b:

this is exactly where the ''we want less government''
BREAKS INTO YOU MUST DO AS WE SAY
or we will use our oversized [worlds biggest] prison system
our just-ice system that only cares about procedure not guilt
all supported by the church in it's uncountable sub cults everywhere

never mind the effects on teen moms and their kids
WE feel GOD DEMANDS THIS
even tho no body ever talks to god
as you believers just made him up

sorry weird claims need proof
you side has NONE
laws need to be fact based
NOT feelings or even old belief



Again, false equivalencies. No need for teen moms as every state has Safe Haven laws. Give the baby up, no questions asked.

Less government does not mean NO government. It's pretty simple, don't kill another human. However, the question becomes when is that "clump of cells" a human?
olejoedad MAR 28, 06:06 PM
My only comment in this thread is this.

If all people would follow the Ten Commandments, this discussion would not be happening.
ray b MAR 28, 06:27 PM
tali-ban supports your position fully and for the same reasons [none]

I try when ever possible not to agree with the tali-ban
esp if god based

most of the old T is copyed in their system

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

cvxjet MAR 28, 09:58 PM
I can see both sides of the issue- but I believe that a total ban like the extremists are trying to create is wrong. My own conservative beliefs are low taxes, strong military and less government- and biased towards local government.

I fully understand the Christian right's opinion, even though I disagree with it to some extent. They basically believe that any life is God-given and sacred...so to take any life is wrong. But taking this ideal to an even more extreme level; "No sperm or eggs should EVER be wasted, and you are evil if you ever do waste them" This leads to "No masturbation, no sex except for reproduction", etc.

I also understand the less extreme versions of the liberals beliefs; That a woman has a "right to chose"....I strongly disagree with the celebratory way some extremist women view this situation.

I have absolutely iron-clad beliefs about some of this; A woman's life takes precedent- if her life is in any way threatened by her pregnancy, then it should be her right to ask that it be terminated. I also believe that women who are victims of rape should be allowed whatever choice they wish. The absolute idiocy of governor Abbott stating "We will completely eliminate rape" is beyond stupid- He is either completely brain-dead or he is a rapist trying cover his azz; "Doth protest too much"

I have a far better way to handle this situation; I believe the moderates from both sides should form a group that will try to cut back as much on abortion as possible- create groups that will help with adoption of unwanted babies, help to eliminate as much rape as possible, and education so that children (12-17) fully understand the pluses and (Mainly) the minuses of pregnancy, child birth and rearing. I am talking about a phased approach; 12 year olds will only get a very basic idea, then at 14 (High school) there will be more detailed info, and senior year a very detailed look at the real situation.

I also understand that a lot of people on the right want children to be "little innocents" until they turn 21.....That is a fools dream.
randye MAR 28, 10:33 PM

quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

My only comment in this thread is this.

If all people would follow the Ten Commandments, this discussion would not be happening.




Almost ALL of our laws are based on the bedrock of Judeo-Christian teachings.


Want it to be illegal for people to murder other people, (including children, born or unborn)? Thank the 6th Commandment

Want it to be illegal for people to commit rape or incest? Thank the 7th Commandment

Want it to be illegal for people to steal or rob from you? Thank the 8th Commandment

Want it to be illegal for people to commit perjury in court or lie in contracts? Thank the 9th Commandment

Want proportional, equitable, punishment under the law? Thank Leviticus 24:19-22

Want the law to limit what civil authority can do? Thank the book of Romans.

[This message has been edited by randye (edited 03-28-2022).]

82-T/A [At Work] MAR 29, 07:48 AM

quote
Originally posted by Fats:

And since you've got the Government in charge of everything else, you go to their office to get laid.



LOL... I can only imagine what that would look like. I suspect nothing like they have in the Netherlands, and probably more like a run-down 80s looking Government building that has rooms with administrators that are hired to perform sex acts. They have to wear gender-neutral clothing, so as not to offend. There are forms to fill out... MANY forms. You must wear a mask while doing it, and there must be multiple layers of protection... a translucent plastic sheet between the two of you. Protection of course... and they must be government-certified condoms. You are not allowed to pick a gender because that would be sexist. Sex workers are chosen at random because picking a hair color, body type, or race would all be bigoted.

To be clear, I've never utilized the red light district in the Netherlands, but every time my wife and I go to Amsterdam, we hang out at one of the bars and watch people go in and then count the number of seconds / minutes till they come back out. Hahah...
2.5 MAR 29, 12:15 PM

quote
Originally posted by slicknick:


Human life has never been that sacred. We just can't work the kids to death in the coal mines anymore.

In the US, and I'm sure many other places, you can't be poor anymore. you can't live in a shanty with a pot belly stove and your 20 kids and eat dirt like you used to. Society and the system won't allow it, and even when it did, those kids were dropping off like nobodys business.

So do you want to go back to dust bowl times when kids died from work and untreated disease, or caveman times when they just ditched them, or what?

Or do you want that pregnant mom to work two or three minimum wage jobs, miss OB appointments, get immediately reported to the state for missing said appointments, and have a child where, since we don't believe in welfare all that much, suffers as much as possible with their mother. Or is everything just white picket fences and stay at home moms in your world?



One can create a lot of imaginary scenarios, it doesnt change the act of abortion. In the world of scenarios, does multiple people making multiple bad choices through time mean killing unborn children is now ok? Later down the road would it be ok to kill if they are less than 1 year old (12 months outside the womb)? 1 month? Maybe the elderly?
2.5 MAR 29, 12:25 PM

quote
Originally posted by cvxjet:

I fully understand the Christian right's opinion, even though I disagree with it to some extent. They basically believe that any life is God-given and sacred...so to take any life is wrong. But taking this ideal to an even more extreme level; "No sperm or eggs should EVER be wasted" .



This stretch is silly to me. Life begins at conception, scientists can figure that out. Periods waste eggs by apparent design.

Related to as you said the Christian opinion : Doesn't it seem like the argument that we don't need a foundation to be "moral" people crumbles when we see that we are ok with dismembering our own offspring in the womb when we decide what we feel is right based simply on public opinion?

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 03-29-2022).]