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| To engine swap or not to engine swap (Page 2/5) |
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cvxjet
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FEB 07, 02:56 PM
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I swapped in a 3.4 F-body into my 85 SE V6.....only 20 more horses, but 30 more Lb/Ft of torque....and it comes in approx' 1000 lower RPM, which is like having better rear-end gears...my light Fiero was getting to 60 in 7.5 seconds....now it has a 0-60 of 6.5 seconds, the quarter goes by in 14.8 seconds....what is really nice about this engine is that although it doesn't rev high, it has a broad power curve.....When I drive windy roads, I rarely have to shift because there is a lot of power everywhere from 2500 up to 5000 rpm.
Of course, it also looks like the stock engine- which I think is a plus....and, if you happen to be at a racing venue, and beat a guy....You tell him "Nope- just a stock pushrod 2.8....it just is very under-rated...." (Say it with a smile!)
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82-T/A [At Work]
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FEB 07, 05:30 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Raydar:
The "worked over" heads... did they port them? Were there obvious differences in the ports?
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Yeah, so... ARI Racing sells three sets / categories of heads:
Standard Heads (rebuilt to meet / exceed OEM Fiero Specs):
Performance Heads (rebuilt with high-end parts to support a really hot cam, and installed with stainless steel SI valves)
Ported Performance Heads (everything the performance heads come with, but ported)
So basically, it's a ported version of this cyl head: https://engine-parts.com/pr...st-iron-large-valve/
He doesn't sell them anymore, because the combination is so limited. He actually only has a single set of Performance Heads with the SI Stainless Steel swirl-port tulip valves. There was a whole thread on this, and people were seeing "dynoed" about a 5 more horsepower increase on an otherwise totally stock 2.8 and stock cyl heads... haha. Anyway, he's got one set left with those valves (already installed) and then I bought his last set of heads that were ported. Minus the slightly better valves, I've seen people on here claim 8-10hp from well-ported valves. I'm guessing I'll probably see ~10hp withe port and new valves above what the stock 3.4 will give me. The stainless valves have narrowed shafts by the valve opening to allow for more volume through the valve.
Anyway, what he specifically said to me is:
"The Ported heads just have a light polish on them, but have the ports opened up for gasket matching to the felpro exhaust manifold gasket. Then the ports are blended to make a smooth transition. We don't highly polish these, which is why we keep the cost down to $350 to add the port job on."
I had to find my old e-mails, and the total cost of the cyl heads (shipped to my house) was $1,266.49. :/
It's a bit crazy expensive for a set of reworked V6/60 heads with the nicer valves... but this is my "forever car," and also my first car. Haha... like CVXJet says... the 3.4 really wakes up the Fiero and makes it exceptionally more driveable. I really wanted / want my Fiero to look totally stock, but get the most power I can from it without going nuts and modifying things. So I didn't mind the cost. In the end, my goal is 190-200hp from the V6/60... which I should have no problem being able to get from the H272 Crane Cam on the 3.4 with the 1.52:1 roller rockers, ported heads, larger Darrel Morse throttle body, hogged exhaust manifolds, port-matched complete intake, freer-flowing 2" exhaust, etc. I figure with the 5-Speed Getrag, it will be absurdly fun to drive.
The new heads are sitting next to the 3.4 Crate Motor in my garage in the big DCC9 box that's at the beginning of every single one of my daughter's YouTube Videos...
... right there off to the lower right, under the cardboard box and the Fiero tail-light. It's amazing how small that motor is. I literally have the Crane Cam in the box, the lifters, the assembled long block with an already attached set of rebuilt heads, and then the set of ARI Racing Engines Fiero cyl heads, an alternator, Rodney's 3.4 conversion kit, and dozens of other parts shoved into that big plastic crate with the DCC9 on it.... haha.[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 02-07-2024).]
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Nasta
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FEB 08, 09:49 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by Vintage-Nut:
To me, you don't need a "complete rebuild":
Remove the heads IF the head gaskets are shot, rebuilt them with new gaskets and repair any leaks...... |
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Other issues arose which likely contributed to the gaskets failing, I can't remember the part name but something caused the oil pressure to skyrocket. That has been fixed and now I've been just chasing oil leaks and since everything has been cleaned up and dye put in, there's leaks from the head gaskets and 3-4 seals around the engine.
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Vintage-Nut
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FEB 08, 11:09 AM
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| quote | Nasta:
Other issues arose which likely contributed to the gaskets failing, I can't remember the part name but something caused the oil pressure to skyrocket. That has been fixed and now I've been just chasing oil leaks....... |
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Hmmm, high engine oil pressure is normally an obstruction, and the common causes is a dirty oil filter.
If the oil flow is constricted, the worst-case scenarios can lead to engine failure.......
You’re probably familiar with an oil change; do you have the history of when often the engine oil and the filter has been changed?
{EDIT}
I asked you a question earlier; "do you usually turn wrenches, or normally pay a shop to work on the vehicle?"
IMHO, I'm getting a feeling that this is more the latter than the former from your comments.[This message has been edited by Vintage-Nut (edited 02-08-2024).]
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Nasta
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FEB 08, 12:46 PM
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IvUOTE]Originally posted by Vintage-Nut:
Hmmm, high engine oil pressure is normally an obstruction, and the common causes is a dirty oil filter.
If the oil flow is constricted, the worst-case scenarios can lead to engine failure.......
You’re probably familiar with an oil change; do you have the history of when often the engine oil and the filter has been changed?[/QUOTE]
Oil and filter change was done last summer when I bought the car, looking into the oil leak it was a dirty PCV valve increasing air pressure in the crankcase, the gauge on my dash reads the oil pressure maxed out 
Whether that explains the gaskets failing now I've no idea.
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Vintage-Nut
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FEB 08, 02:35 PM
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I believe this is two problems:
*A dirty PCV valve, which will make oil leaks, but it will not make 'high oil pressure'.
*A faulty oil pressure sensor CAN look like high oil pressure (a.k.a. MAX) but I bet it is wrong.
If the oil gauge on the dash still reads 'maxed' - connect a hand-held oil pressure meter to check the gauge or replace the oil sensor.
As I said, I still think that you don't need a "complete rebuild" yet......
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Nasta
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FEB 08, 03:32 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Vintage-Nut:
I believe this is two problems:
*A dirty PCV valve, which will make oil leaks, but it will not make 'high oil pressure'.
*A faulty oil pressure sensor CAN look like high oil pressure (a.k.a. MAX) but I bet it is wrong.
If the oil gauge on the dash still reads 'maxed' - connect a hand-held oil pressure meter to check the gauge or replace the oil sensor.
As I said, I still think that you don't need a "complete rebuild" yet...... |
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Just spoke with my mechanic, the exact parts that need replacing are the valve cover gaskets, head gaskets, rear main seal, oil pan gasket, front crank seal and torque converter seal. The engine needs to be lifted regardless to do the oil pan gasket so I prefer to get the most work done at that point. My mechanic doesn't to do engine rebuilds so his assessment comes with no profit for him.
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1985 Fiero GT
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FEB 08, 03:39 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Nasta:
Oil and filter change was done last summer when I bought the car, looking into the oil leak it was a dirty PCV valve increasing air pressure in the crankcase, the gauge on my dash reads the oil pressure maxed out
Whether that explains the gaskets failing now I've no idea. |
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a maxed out gauge is not necessarily a problem, oil thickness, temperature, etc can make the oil gauge "peg" if it is 5w30, it likely will peg out upon cold startup, and as it is idling, will go down after a few minutes of idling (1000rpm) if the car has vacuum leaks and idles high, oil pressure may never go down much below max, and it will be higher when driving, it only really goes down after idling, When at operating temp. On top of that the sensor can be broken or even slightly off, and the gauge can be slightly off, leading you to think it is pegged all the way up, when it really is only 3/4 (while driving, or with a high idle, 3/4 is normal) 1/2 or less when idling at or below 1000rpm, with the engine fully warmed up.
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Vintage-Nut
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FEB 08, 04:09 PM
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| quote | Nasta:
Just spoke with my mechanic, the exact parts that need replacing are the valve cover gaskets, head gaskets, rear main seal, oil pan gasket, front crank seal and torque converter seal. The engine needs to be lifted regardless to do the oil pan gasket so I prefer to get the most work done at that point. My mechanic doesn't to do engine rebuilds so his assessment comes with no profit for him. |
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OKAY:
1st - you normally pay a shop to work on the vehicle, check!
2nd - the exact parts that need replacing and not a "complete rebuild", check!
Some will replace the oil pan gasket on the vehicle; others rather completely remove the engine from the car......
IMHO
Add "rebuild the cylinder heads" with fresh valves on the list as they're out!
Maybe add a new stock oil pump or a high-volume oil pump as the oil pan will be off...?
So, as I said in the beginning:
You can fresh-up the original 2.8L engine with new gaskets and seals
OR
Spend more for a 'swap'.........
| quote | | Rebuilding the original 2.8L engine is the 'cheaper' route |
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What is your budget?  [This message has been edited by Vintage-Nut (edited 02-08-2024).]
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Nasta
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FEB 08, 04:38 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Vintage-Nut:
What is your budget?
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It's become a necessity to get it done, $3000 CAD is going to hurt and that's what I was looking at, $4000 CAD is going to be brutal. I'm too invested to stop.
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