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| How bad is this rust? (Page 2/3) |
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Patrick
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MAY 13, 07:58 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Personally, for a private seller, they're probably not going to allow you to take down the wheel well liner...
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It is not necessary to remove the plastic wheel well liners in order to see the rear upper frame rails.
| quote | Originally posted by Patrick:
The plastic wheel well liners need to be at least loosened and pulled down a bit in order to properly check the rear upper frame rails for rust and lack of structural integrity.
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1985 Fiero GT
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MAY 13, 09:17 PM
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Also, not entirely sure if this will help, I was doing some feeling around from the engine bay last winter, and seemed to remember being able to feel the rear upper frame rails from the engine bay, looking at pictures maybe it was something else I was feeling, but if the engine bay opens into where the upper frame rail is, a flexible hand will be able to feel rust and roughly guesstimate how solid it is.
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cartercarbaficionado
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MAY 13, 09:23 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by dizzie:
I am! I'm not coffeegirl or whatever - I just saw that post after I did this one. I understand the skepticism since this is my first post, though. I just got interested in Fieros recently. Hopefully this will develop into a long-standing journey that doesn't send me to the poor house! 
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in that case I offer my apologies, you can pm Me if you need any interior parts 3d modeled or weird knowledge on Fieros, or any recommendations on good first upgrades
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dizzie
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MAY 13, 10:03 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by 1985 Fiero GT:
Also, not entirely sure if this will help, I was doing some feeling around from the engine bay last winter, and seemed to remember being able to feel the rear upper frame rails from the engine bay, looking at pictures maybe it was something else I was feeling, but if the engine bay opens into where the upper frame rail is, a flexible hand will be able to feel rust and roughly guesstimate how solid it is. |
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Hey that's a great backup idea, thank you.
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dizzie
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MAY 13, 10:06 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by cartercarbaficionado:
in that case I offer my apologies, you can pm Me if you need any interior parts 3d modeled or weird knowledge on Fieros, or any recommendations on good first upgrades |
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Very kind of you! No worries at all. The ability to 3D model sounds really cool and I'm already appreciating the specialized knowledge here in the forum 👍
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theogre
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MAY 13, 11:14 PM
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In VA that some areas don't get a lot of road salt or near the ocean either case above is common.
Undercoat in other states like NY often hind major rust damage. Search here for Ziebart for related issues.
Rust you see or not may may still have rust in/on brake parts etc that are "toast" needing a lot of work on whatever that cost plenty even you doing the job. Shop doing many jobs on 20+ year old car often cost a lot just in Labor because stuck/broken parts eats Time even if can get the parts to replace all what's bad.
You don't have to pull panels now... Bore scopes are cheap and stiffer ones easily reach rear upper frame rails etc. I have USB one that use a Laptop or phone to view. Laptops have a bigger screen but often doesn't work well in sun light hitting them.
If seller won't even allow that, walk away.
Best if can go to a shop & get someone to inspect the car before buying. Find a shop that does this before you start shopping. Many "dealers" can allow you to take the car to a shop you like/trust. Others not & you walk.
Cars w/ "Current Tags..." status of Tags means very little. For States w/ Inspection they often don't get under the car or if they do is too late & you on the hook if Fails. NY gets under the car but often miss a lot of problems unless something bad is require to Pass or is way obvious.
But if the Tag is "Historic" "Antique" etc then car has No Inspection likely in Many Years plus are Rules for these special Tags limiting driving, transfer when selling, & more. In some states you can't transfer them & new owner need to apply for the tag again or follow direction for a normal Tag & Pass Inspection.
"Clean" Carfax et al mean little too for many reasons.
That's just highlights for normal cars w/o "Brake upgrades," "lowering," engine swaps, etc that often have there own set of problems.------------------
Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)
The Ogre's Fiero Cave
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dizzie
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MAY 14, 10:22 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by theogre:
In VA that some areas don't get a lot of road salt or near the ocean either case above is common.
Undercoat in other states like NY often hind major rust damage. Search here for Ziebart for related issues.
Rust you see or not may may still have rust in/on brake parts etc that are "toast" needing a lot of work on whatever that cost plenty even you doing the job. Shop doing many jobs on 20+ year old car often cost a lot just in Labor because stuck/broken parts eats Time even if can get the parts to replace all what's bad.
You don't have to pull panels now... Bore scopes are cheap and stiffer ones easily reach rear upper frame rails etc. I have USB one that use a Laptop or phone to view. Laptops have a bigger screen but often doesn't work well in sun light hitting them.
If seller won't even allow that, walk away.
Best if can go to a shop & get someone to inspect the car before buying. Find a shop that does this before you start shopping. Many "dealers" can allow you to take the car to a shop you like/trust. Others not & you walk.
Cars w/ "Current Tags..." status of Tags means very little. For States w/ Inspection they often don't get under the car or if they do is too late & you on the hook if Fails. NY gets under the car but often miss a lot of problems unless something bad is require to Pass or is way obvious.
But if the Tag is "Historic" "Antique" etc then car has No Inspection likely in Many Years plus are Rules for these special Tags limiting driving, transfer when selling, & more. In some states you can't transfer them & new owner need to apply for the tag again or follow direction for a normal Tag & Pass Inspection.
"Clean" Carfax et al mean little too for many reasons.
That's just highlights for normal cars w/o "Brake upgrades," "lowering," engine swaps, etc that often have there own set of problems.
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That's a wealth of info and perspective - I appreciate you taking a look at this. Sounds like I should definitely ask about what kind of coating that is if I take a look at the cleaner car. A cheap scope sounds like a great investment. Makes sense about state inspections and tags, though I hadn't thought of that before - especially antique tags. And even if I don't know a good shop in the area the car is being sold, this makes me want to pay for a pro mobile/ onsite inspection - I've seen some companies that offer them now for older cars at $300-500. I believe all the models I'm looking at are stock, but I should double-check for any upgrades like brakes. Thanks again!
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Yellow-88
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MAY 21, 12:01 PM
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Hi
Having done several restorations and "refreshments" on old cars, I welcome a nice coating of surface rust. Nothing sticks to steel like rust so it makes an excellent primer when treated with rust converter chemical, when used correctly according to the manufacturers instructions. Top the converted rust with high quality paint. Again follow the spec sheet.
Steel parts that have competently oxidized are no longer steel and require replacement. Brake lines and cables can rust from both inside and out. Fortunately, stainless steel lines are readily available.
I worry about undercoating that has been applied sometime after a few years on the road. The coating can look great but under it may be pretty bad. Correctly done it is a good thing but can be a cheap cosmetic sales gimmick. Look very carefully at coated surfaces.
I agree that there are parts of a frame that serve no structural purpose. Common sense should tell you what's important.
Yellow-88
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dizzie
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MAY 21, 04:12 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Yellow-88:
Hi
Having done several restorations and "refreshments" on old cars, I welcome a nice coating of surface rust. Nothing sticks to steel like rust so it makes an excellent primer when treated with rust converter chemical, when used correctly according to the manufacturers instructions. Top the converted rust with high quality paint. Again follow the spec sheet.
Steel parts that have competently oxidized are no longer steel and require replacement. Brake lines and cables can rust from both inside and out. Fortunately, stainless steel lines are readily available.
I worry about undercoating that has been applied sometime after a few years on the road. The coating can look great but under it may be pretty bad. Correctly done it is a good thing but can be a cheap cosmetic sales gimmick. Look very carefully at coated surfaces.
I agree that there are parts of a frame that serve no structural purpose. Common sense should tell you what's important.
Yellow-88 |
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Appreciate the perspective there. Yeah I have a feeling I'll be doing some pressing on the coated parts of the underside to see if there is a lot of give in them. On non-coated surfaces, hopefully I'll be able to tell the difference between surface rust and parts that are completely rusted through. Maybe a little scraping with my fingernail or a key will clue me in. Thanks.
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Yellow-88
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MAY 24, 11:59 AM
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Hi
I'm pretty much assuming that any old car with road time on it will need some rust attention. I'd buy either of the cars you show.
Yellow-88
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