F23 vs HTOB 282 (Page 3/3)
pmbrunelle JUN 02, 10:28 PM
A run-of-the-mill 3.4 L engine doesn't have much torque. I think it would benefit from the Cavalier F23's 14.1:1 starting line ratio to get the car going.

The thing about taller gearing is more for the higher-hp folks for whom 1st gear goes by too quickly for a human driver to manage.

I have a 14.5:1 starting line ratio with a 3.2 L and I think it's fine.

If I was going to get an F23, I think I would run the Cavalier ratios as-is, though I would still do a teardown of the box to make sure everything is OK before putting it into service.
thesameguy JUN 02, 10:59 PM
Man, that has not been my experience... 200 lb ft is not really what I would consider low torque.. either way, maybe it's the narrow power band, but 1st and 2nd are already borderline useless. I would take shorter gearing if their was literally no option, but it wouldn't be my choice.

[This message has been edited by thesameguy (edited 06-02-2021).]

Will JUN 03, 07:34 AM

quote
Originally posted by thesameguy:

My understanding was that Thelin's adapters were only useful if combined with an Ecotec - the lateral positioning is wrong for the 60*V6? I think maybe I also read that how or where they attach doesn't work on the 2.2 bell housing. :/




The thing that drives the powertrain position left to right is the axles. The F23 uses the same axles as the 282 and those dictate where the transmission ends up.
The Thelin rear bracket should work fine, but only one bolt of the Thelin front bracket will be there when using the Metric bellhousing.


quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

If I was going to get an F23, I think I would run the Cavalier ratios as-is, though I would still do a teardown of the box to make sure everything is OK before putting it into service.



The Cavalier/XFE combo (well really the XFE transmission) has almost exactly the same overall ratio set as the V6 282. The 3.4's do end up around 200 ftlbs... that's not a lot compared to anything that makes 300 ftlbs, but it's still enough to motivate a Fiero crisply.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 06-03-2021).]

thesameguy JUN 03, 01:22 PM
It's a lot more torque than most 2700lb cars have! Well, until everything suddenly had a turbo.
thesameguy JUN 03, 04:49 PM
Lacking any chill, I've ordered the brackets, mounts, and cables. Fingers crossed.
Will JUN 04, 08:50 AM

quote
Originally posted by thesameguy:

It's a lot more torque than most 2700lb cars have! Well, until everything suddenly had a turbo.



I don't think 2700# cars have turbos even today... Hell, I'm not sure there *ARE* 2700# cars anymore.

J/K... the BRZ/FRS, Mjata & Boxster/Cayman are about it (Well... and the Alfa 4C, but it makes the 718's look cheap)... The 718's are turbo, but only the last couple of years. Of those three, only the 718 is approaching "fast".

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 06-04-2021).]

thesameguy JUN 04, 01:42 PM
Eh, Ford Fiesta ST, Chevy Sonic Turbo, Fiat 500 Turbo, Mini Cooper are all all in the ballpark - 2500-2800lbs. Probably others. While none of these will make 200 lb ft, they get pretty close and have much wider power bands.

Regardless, I think the point here is that 200 lb ft in a 2700lb car makes for a responsive drive and there's no reason for that motor to be turning 3000rpm or whatever on the freeway.
thesameguy JUL 20, 11:57 AM
Well, things are moving along...

WCF delivered mounts & cables in about 35 days:



and then I cleaned out the server room at home and put some of the proceeds towards



It was a very favorable deal so I grabbed the whole megillah.

I have two questions:

1. Does anyone have a part number or source for the oil seal for an F23? It's destroyed when splitting the case, so I'll need a new one. Or three.
2. Any clutch recommendations for a 60*V6 + F23? I am not looking for race clutch... as close to stock would be great for me.