Mouse and Chipmunk Debries Coming Out of Exhause Pipes (Page 1/1)
Romsk JUL 18, 04:45 PM
Hi all,

I am new to the forum. I have a 1987 GT 2.8L that was in storage in my garage for 6 years. I decided to get it going again. I tried to drain the fuel tank with a 1/4 inch hose from the filler port, but the tank appeared to be dry. I put in 2 gallons of fresh 87 octane regular gas I had on hand - I normally run on 93 [fixed typo] octane. I also put a shot of Fogging Oil in each cylinder and the engine fired right up! It didn't even crank for a few seconds, it started within a half second!

I know it developed some kind of idling issue 6 years ago that showed up ONLY after I ran out of gas. I rolled into a gas station and filled it up. It was hard to get started after filling up that one time, and when I got it started, that is when the rough/wavering idle started - and why I garaged it for so long.

Today, like I said, it started right up and was idling a bit better but it didn't sound smooth. I noticed a lot a grey smoke from the exhaust at first and it subsided a little, and came back when I reved the engine. It did not go completely away. I only ran the engine for a minute or two. I don't remember it smoking that much when it went into storage.

I shut off the engine and got out. I noticed about 2 cups of tiny nut shells (the kind Chipmunks love) and other debries were blown out of each exhaust side. I forgot to put steel wool in the exhaust ports.

I have a custom stainless steel exhaust system that is welded. I don't have a lift and I am not going to get under a car again on blocks and stuff (my wife won't allow it).

Any suggestions on how to clean out the debries before I have to resort to have it towed to the exhaust shop?
Is that is what is causing the grey smoke?
Could critters get into or past the muffler and into the catalytic converter?
Any ideas on why it used to run fine but developed idling (and possibly poor running) issues only after running out of gas once?

Also, I used to ground out a pin on the ALDL connector to get diag codes, but the Service Engine Soon (SES) lamp stopped working suddenly (again 6 years ago). I checked the bulb and it is good. The SES does not even come on as a lamp test when I perform a start sequence. It could be a mouse got at the wiring, but this car has always been tight inside - no signs of mice. But there is evidence of "critters" in the engine compartment that I cleaned up. Wires that I can see look good but my eyesight is poor these days. The SES light was working when the idle problems developed but stopped working a couple of months later as I was diagnosing the idle problem (working the issue on and off for a month or two).

Thanks.


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Paul Romsky

[This message has been edited by Romsk (edited 07-19-2022).]

Patrick JUL 18, 05:53 PM
Welcome!


quote
Originally posted by Romsk:

1987 GT 2.8L ... I put in 2 gallons of fresh 87 octane regular gas I had on hand - I normally run on 97 octane.



"97 octane"? Where do you acquire that? Whether that's a typo or not, running anything other than 87 octane in a stock 2.8 is a total waste of money.


quote
Originally posted by Romsk:

Any suggestions on how to clean out the debries before I have to resort to have it towed to the exhaust shop?



Yes, a good blast on the freeway. If there is a blockage somewhere (that won't clear basically immediately), you'll know when the engine will just barely rev over a certain RPM (say, 2500 or so). In that case, you'll probably have to replace the muffler.

Depending on the muffler's design/construction, it's doubtful that rodents could work their way past the baffles into the cat.

Talking about a cat, perhaps read This old post of mine.... just in the unlikely event that it's the contents of your cat that may or may not be causing an issue.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 07-18-2022).]

theogre JUL 18, 07:23 PM
If you run the engine to clear crap out of the muffler etc...
Keep a hose near by because can have a fire in exhaust parts. Muffler can take longer to reach burning point of crap there.

"Depending on the muffler's design/construction, it's doubtful that rodents could work their way past the baffles into the cat."
Depends on muffler design animals may not get thru there but mufflers often can hold crap that isn't easy to blow out or suck out by vacuum cleaner tools. That's what can burn. Fires inside pipes etc can have ways to get out and burn the car down is why said keep a hose handy until blow or burn out the trash.

SES/CEL doesn't work?
Don't fix iffy idle etc.
Bulb maybe good but socket or other things on dash back is "bad."

Use test light @ ECM for CEL wire and ground to car frame. If ECM plug has a cover over pins, See my Cave, Terminal Access

If that fails too then Likely ECM has problems and need to fix wiring or replace ECM.

Note: High/Weird Idle is Common if you pull battery because ECM can't Reset the IAC until you drive > 35mph on most cars.

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Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)

The Ogre's Fiero Cave

fierofool JUL 18, 09:10 PM
If you had that kind of crap in the exhaust, it's a must that you don't use the heater fan until you remove it along with the heater ballast beside the fan and check for and clean any debris that may be inside the ductwork. Reach in as far to the passenger side as you can to check for debris that's packed against the ac and heater cores. Using the heater fan causes the coils on the ballast to glow bright red like a hot plate coil. Any debris in there could ignite and it's 99% impossible to extinguish.

http://www.gafiero.org/bbs/...64.msg33104#msg33104
theogre JUL 18, 10:05 PM

quote
Originally posted by fierofool:
If you had that kind of crap in the exhaust, it's a must that you don't use the heater fan until you remove it along with the heater ballast beside the fan and check for and clean any debris that may be inside the ductwork. Reach in as far to the passenger side as you can to check for debris that's packed against the ac and heater cores. Using the heater fan causes the coils on the ballast to glow bright red like a hot plate coil. Any debris in there could ignite and it's 99% impossible to extinguish.

http://www.gafiero.org/bbs/...64.msg33104#msg33104

see https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/141959.html and many other threads on this problem.
ArthurPeale JUL 19, 04:41 PM

quote
Originally posted by Romsk:

I also put a shot of Fogging Oil in each cylinder




That might explain a lot of your smoke.
Romsk JUL 19, 08:27 PM
All,
I had a typo, I use 93 not 97 octane fuel - brain glitch, I knew there was a prime number in there [laugh]. Thanks for the advice on the exhaust and SES light . Especially the tip to check the heating ventilation system. In all my cars, I put in in heavy 1/4 inch mesh over the input ports for the cabin and air cleaners. If I can figure how to get at the Fiero cabin port without breaking something, I will do that too. Why do manufacturers leave those wide open? Critters got into my Benz fan and ate the "delicious" plastic cabin fan blades! I put mesh over the port so it won't happen again; my mechanic thought it was a great idea. I know that some wires and plastics are made of vegetable bases, critters love them! I guess it's "built in failures" to get you in the shop.

Oh, by the way... I had a 86 SE that was in the back yard for 15 years - it got severe rod knock after running low on oil. I wanted to rebuild the engine and put a super charger on it, but my wife said No! (she inherited me with it when she married me). So I stripped it down to the chassis, I even took out the front end and body panels. To my surprise, I found no evidence of mice in the cabin or heating system. But I will check my current Fiero as it makes sense.

Corvette folks love Fiero seats for some reason - those were the first to sell. I got $200 a piece for the manual crank doors. I even sold the engine for $300 with a warranty if the rod was not thrown and the block was still good. That was 2 years ago, no word, warranty expired. I kept the Tachometer, I plan to mount it in the hood for that "Tach in The Hood" look.

I made my own ALDL diagnostic tool. It uses a PC and an adapter. I have an improved design for the adapter I need to post. All the drawings and software is free from my website: paul.romsky.com

Thanks again to all!

[This message has been edited by Romsk (edited 07-19-2022).]

Patrick JUL 19, 08:42 PM

quote
Originally posted by Romsk:

In all my cars, I put in in heavy 1/4 inch mesh over the input ports for the cabin and air cleaners.



Where mice often gain access into the Fiero air box is through either of the two drain tubes for the cowl. Did you put mesh over them as well?

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 07-19-2022).]

Romsk JUL 19, 08:48 PM
Follow up:

The entire exhaust was replaced about 7 years ago and I have less than 5,000 miles on it, so I doubt the Catalytic Converter is bad, but it will be considered as I move forward.
I just talked to my exhaust shop today, they said they would cut off my muffler and shake/blow it out and weld it back on for me for 1 hour of labor. Or I can buy a new one - Lou's Custom Exhaust here in New England is great. I give them 5 stars all around.
I always ran my Fieros on 93 octane. I got a little more milage, not much, but I thought it was better for the engine. I am sticking with 93, I don't plan to drive it much, so the the cost is not a big concern.

A Sunoco station in next door Nashua, NH was selling 102 octane racing fuel for a short while about 7 years ago. So I ran close to empty and got 5 gallons. This was months before I ran out of gas and developed the rough idle I have now. I forgot the price but it was well over twice the price (if I recall it was over $5 a gallon -back then, it could have been more and why I didn't fill up). Anyway, I noticed no improvement in performance (by feel) and no increases in mileage. So I didn't switch to it.

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Paul Romsky

Romsk JUL 19, 08:55 PM
Patrick,
On my other cars, just putting mesh over those huge cabin ports and air intakes did the trick. On my Fiero I will also put mesh over the points you mentioned. Thanks!

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Paul Romsky