Halo Headlights (Page 1/4)
twestie MAR 28, 12:51 PM
So I installed a pair of Halo headlights a while ago but never wired up the Halos. I had a thought, so correct me if I'm wrong. I thinking that if I were to rewire the Halos and the headlight motors to come on with the marker lights, that will allow me to have the headlights up with just the Halos turned on. Thus keeping the actual headlights on the same (but now separate) circuit. In short, Markers, Halos, & motors on one circuit operated by the marker light switch. Headlights on their own circuit operated by the headlight switch. So I guess what I'm asking are there any load issues or anything to prevent me from doing this? Has anyone done something similar?


This is for a '85 2M6 with the old headlight system.
1985 Fiero GT MAR 28, 01:51 PM

quote
Originally posted by twestie:

So I installed a pair of Halo headlights a while ago but never wired up the Halos. I had a thought, so correct me if I'm wrong. I thinking that if I were to rewire the Halos and the headlight motors to come on with the marker lights, that will allow me to have the headlights up with just the Halos turned on. Thus keeping the actual headlights on the same (but now separate) circuit. In short, Markers, Halos, & motors on one circuit operated by the marker light switch. Headlights on their own circuit operated by the headlight switch. So I guess what I'm asking are there any load issues or anything to prevent me from doing this? Has anyone done something similar?


This is for a '85 2M6 with the old headlight system.



Shouldn't be hard to connect the halos to the parking lights, shouldn't draw to much power, if they are led, but to get the headlight mechanism to work in the way described would be very hard and require some out of the box thinking. There are so many different relays and switches controlling them now that adding anything without extensive thought is sure to short something. I wired up a system to show me to wink the headlights but that is only powered when the headlights are up and use additional relays to "channel" the voltage from the factory wiring to the headlights. There are many ways it can go wrong.

https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/147547.html

A simpler thing is to connect the halos to park light circuit, then press the headlight up button, and when they are up, either pull out just the headlight button, or if the switch is stiff, quickly turn everything off, then parking lights back on. When parking lights are on, the motors are unpowered, and will stay in whatever position they are currently in (up)

With that in mind, why would you want your headlights up like that, in the daytime they should be down, at night they should be up and on, if it's bright enough that you don't need full headlights, you don't need parking lights and halos, they are called parking lights for a reason (originally intended to be left on while vehicle is parked on the side of a road with no lighting about a century ago) similar to our use of hazard lights today.

If you want daytime running lights, change the lower front marker light, either wire it to be on with ignition signal (relay powered off coolant fan relay) or get a fancy dual bulb lense or some switchback led thing.
theogre MAR 29, 12:18 PM
⚠️ In many places cops can/will stop you for "weird" or illegal lights.

Is Illegal in most places to have Parking Lights On w/o HL On while Driving. For that matter... In some states, Parking Lights On even on a Parked Vehicle have restrictions too. (Related, Fog/Driving Light On Only When Low Beam HL are On.)

All versions of DRL have Rules too & require to "run" w/ Parking Lights Off including HL wired to be DRL when in DRL mode. (HL DRL mode requires Low Beams @ 50% power too.) Also why Many new vehicle w/ DRL turn off the DRL partly or totally when Turn light are On.

Many Mod'ed Front Park/Turn to be DRL but that has problems even when GM et al did that to some vehicles at factory when in early years allowing/requiring DRL.
Example: GM did that some trucks & others & 3157 bulb (1157/2057/2357 but w/ different base) died fast & cook the fixture too because Kept the Bright Hot Filament On for Hours.
Many Fiero (& other old cars) did same & "melted" the fixture, lens or both, worse w/ TFS replacement Lenses.

LEDs have problems to start regardless of the Hype pushing them & Illegal too in external fixtures made for standard bulbs.

See https://web.archive.org/web...cast.net/~fierocave/ light section

"halo" HL bulbs that "replace" H6054 etc often have problems & even when you ignore there Illegal in US & many other Countries because not "DOT Legal" or otherwise "approved." Perform poorly by light output is bad, burns out way soon, or both. What may look as Sealed Beam Bulbs on Newer Jeeps w/ "halos" installed when made are Fixtures that uses 9003 & related HL bulbs same as other "Aero" HL assemblies. Or can be a SB w/ added "halo" around that & at some distance look as one piece.

------------------
Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)

The Ogre's Fiero Cave

1985 Fiero GT MAR 29, 03:39 PM

quote
Originally posted by theogre:

⚠️ In many places cops can/will stop you for "weird" or illegal lights.

Is Illegal in most places to have Parking Lights On w/o HL On while Driving. For that matter... In some states, Parking Lights On even on a Parked Vehicle have restrictions too. (Related, Fog/Driving Light On Only When Low Beam HL are On.)

All versions of DRL have Rules too & require to "run" w/ Parking Lights Off including HL wired to be DRL when in DRL mode. (HL DRL mode requires Low Beams @ 50% power too.) Also why Many new vehicle w/ DRL turn off the DRL partly or totally when Turn light are On.

Many Mod'ed Front Park/Turn to be DRL but that has problems even when GM et al did that to some vehicles at factory when in early years allowing/requiring DRL.
Example: GM did that some trucks & others & 3157 bulb (1157/2057/2357 but w/ different base) died fast & cook the fixture too because Kept the Bright Hot Filament On for Hours.
Many Fiero (& other old cars) did same & "melted" the fixture, lens or both, worse w/ TFS replacement Lenses.

LEDs have problems to start regardless of the Hype pushing them & Illegal too in external fixtures made for standard bulbs.

See https://web.archive.org/web...cast.net/~fierocave/ light section

"halo" HL bulbs that "replace" H6054 etc often have problems & even when you ignore there Illegal in US & many other Countries because not "DOT Legal" or otherwise "approved." Perform poorly by light output is bad, burns out way soon, or both. What may look as Sealed Beam Bulbs on Newer Jeeps w/ "halos" installed when made are Fixtures that uses 9003 & related HL bulbs same as other "Aero" HL assemblies. Or can be a SB w/ added "halo" around that & at some distance look as one piece.




Yeah there are a lot of rules to look into when making changes, along with how fussy the police in your area are, where I live, you are actually allowed to make necessary modifications on an older vehicle without DRLs to add DRLs, dot certified or not, as long as there is some forward facing light that is on during the daytime, they allow that because they require all cars to have some form of DRLs, even older ones from before they were required. My DRLs use a name brand LED in the front lower marker lights that is a little brighter then the original front lower marker bulbs, I run the DRLs on the parking "filament" on that bulb, wired to a relay with power and ignition signal coming from the radiator fan relay.
theogre MAR 29, 06:27 PM

quote
Originally posted by 1985 Fiero GT:
Yeah there are a lot of rules to look into when making changes, along with how fussy the police in your area are, where I live, you are actually allowed to make necessary modifications on an older vehicle without DRLs to add DRLs, dot certified or not, as long as there is some forward facing light that is on during the daytime, they allow that because they require all cars to have some form of DRLs, even older ones from before they were required. My DRLs use a name brand LED in the front lower marker lights that is a little brighter then the original front lower marker bulbs, I run the DRLs on the parking "filament" on that bulb, wired to a relay with power and ignition signal coming from the radiator fan relay.

In the US LEDs are Not for use in any external fixture w/ tungsten bulbs for many reasons. USDOT/NTHSA has long "ban" replacement LEDs & Why many have "off road use only" on the package but Osram/Sylvania etc knows the product will sell & be use on street vehicles. Even ignore that, Cops see a light is Too Bright, Too Dim, Weird/Illegal colors, or in the wrong places (like lights under a car) are enough to stop in many places.

Real Fact is most replacement LED & a lot of Factory Install LED in vehicles Do Not last long for many reasons. Highlights: Road vibration, crap power, power surges, & moister etc getting in the "fixture" that Tungsten bulbs often ignore kills LED fast. I've stopped counting how many Prius etc w/ partly or total dead LED taillights years ago. And many stay "dead" because high cost to replace the whole thing from/@ a car dealer. WORSE when have blind-spot & other electronics in that too. Example: www.thedrive.com/news/how-t...d-into-a-5600-repair
jelly2m8 MAR 30, 01:55 AM
I just HAVE to!


Sorry all you purists, technology has passed you by, Sorry you can't see the way forward.80's - 90-s headlights


The irony.

#SorryNotSorryTechnologyHasMovedOn

[This message has been edited by jelly2m8 (edited 03-30-2024).]

1985 Fiero GT MAR 30, 06:07 AM

quote
Originally posted by jelly2m8:

I just HAVE to!


Sorry all you purists, technology has passed you by, Sorry you can't see the way forward.80's - 90-s headlights


The irony.

#SorryNotSorryTechnologyHasMovedOn




To be fair to the Fiero, the 5x7 halogen headlights hold up very well compared to older seperate bulb/lense designs, if you think the Fiero is bad, those are horrible! Also the 5x7 halogen has been updated with the most recent halogen technology, so a modern bulb is much better then an original from the 80s would have been. That being said, I will be changing them out for something that performs better, just not something flashy that obviously didn't come with the car.
87GT3800SC5SPD MAR 30, 11:44 AM

quote
Originally posted by jelly2m8:

I just HAVE to!


Sorry all you purists, technology has passed you by, Sorry you can't see the way forward.80's - 90-s headlights


The irony.

#SorryNotSorryTechnologyHasMovedOn





I couldn't agree more. Regulators have dragged their feet on keeping up with vehicle lighting since the adoption of the sealed beam headlight in about 1936. Europe has always been light years ahead of the US on keeping ahead on lighting technology.

I use Hella H4 headlights in my Fiero with well engineered, high quality LEDs. The Hella H4 headlights are glass, with well designed lenses, that don't deteriorate and cloud up, rendering them useless.

Properly engineered LEDs emit a light source in the correct location to properly reflect light and make these headlights far superior to the more modern polycarbonate fancy headlights that become cloudy, with poor lighting results. Most important, headlights need to be aimed properly to provide useful light for driving and avoid blinding oncoming traffic. It is not the amount of light that is blinding, it is headlights that are not properly aimed causing the blinding.

I have used European spec headlights since I got a drivers license, many decades ago. I have never been questioned about my headlights that have always been properly aimed.

The nice thing about Fiero headlights is that, if you don't like how they look, they are only visible when you turn them on.

As far as being legal or not, I feel the same way about my 3800 conversion that is way less polluting than the original 2.8, but it is illegal in California where I don't live.

theogre MAR 30, 09:24 PM

quote
Originally posted by jelly2m8:
I just HAVE to!

Sorry all you purists, technology has passed you by, Sorry you can't see the way forward. <snip the rest & BS FB link>

You like many others just drink your coolant Koolaid claiming LED HL & more are "Better..." Often Most because you believe the Hype from most Trade Rags like "Car & Driver" & more pushing same BS often they know is BS & just following PR/Marketing handouts from the Brands because want that Ad/Sponsor $ so they "Lie." Others Lie outright like TL/BTR did & still does after changing names again.

Worse Often Most compare to 6052 etc Non-Halogen lamps or Factory Installed Halogen using Less Power thus Making Less Light & so on & most cases isn't even "Apples to Oranges" but far worse...
Many Recent to Current H6054 uses Same Bulb types insides as many new vehicles w/ "Aero" HL assemblies. You have little or no difference on Light Output.
Even in the 80-90's any Halogen SB HL was Way Better then 6052 & others "normal" Tungsten SB & Many GM Cars Still came with them Including Fiero & other Low Trim "Base" models into the 90's.
Many High Trim models like any w/ "GT" label also came w/ "Weak" "Dimmer" Halogen running ~ 35W low 50W high. Plus many buy "Basic" Halogen bulbs in the aftermarket that are "weak" to sell cheap @ any store vs SilverStar etc.
That Ignoring Many vehicles have Wiring Problems that will make Any lighting look "dim" "yellow" & worse when people buy just "DOT Legal" "SilverStar" class that pulls More Amps that Cooks HL & Beam Select Switches & more to the point can even start a Fire. H4 w/ even Higher Amp Draw Bulbs often quickly melts a lot of electric parts.

I & others work in Automotive, Tech & Electronics & seen the BS is getting way deep w/ LEDs because Same BS happen w/ HID "Upgrade" before. Only a 1 or Very Few Real Companies made a HID kit for old SB systems that meet most to all FMVSS 108 etc but Philips "Xenarc" SB Upgrade cost $700-900 & soon cancel that line.

You & "Friends" claim "Modern HL" are better too... Yet IIHS & others Org's have actually Tested Many New HL setup for US & EU markets including High $ Models & results is bad news because many are Crap regardless Halogen, HID or LED based. Because Car Designers often have No Clue & Don't care if the Lights are working only "they look cool" & Bean Counters & other "management" types quash many other trying to isn't good so just make sure Passes FMVSS 108 or whatever reg's for other markets @ Bare Minimum & be done.

Then add Bad Plastics on "Aero HL" cars > ~ 10 years old is still a huge problem. Many current models have problem when just > ~ 5 years parked outside, under trees, etc. Vs Good SB w/ Glass Fronts or whole shell look same @ 10 20 even 50 years later.

Also go and Read the LED HL Warranty from Trucklite GE etc... Those High $ LED have 1 to 3 years max & have Many Ways in the doc to Void them because of crap power & other problems in most vehicles.
MOST "Halos" of any types, HID & LED "upgrades," & more on Amacon Eflay etc don't have a warranty & cheap because are a Complete Scam many w/ Bogus DOT &/or ECE marking. Those companies don't care & rarely take down crap vendors because get a huge amount of $ & when does, same vendor just get new name & account in Hours.

Isn't just crap car parts... Just follow Fashion Counterfeiting Problems for a few days... Even if Amacon or Eflay completely stopped selling "Red Sole Shoes" or whatever Fad of the Week, Wish, Temu, AliEx & others keep on sell the crap in the US & EU.
theogre MAR 30, 09:49 PM

quote
Originally posted by 87GT3800SC5SPD:
I couldn't agree more. Regulators have dragged their feet on keeping up with vehicle lighting since the adoption of the sealed beam headlight in about 1936. Europe has always been light years ahead of the US on keeping ahead on lighting technology.

I use Hella H4 headlights in my Fiero with well engineered, high quality LEDs. The Hella H4 headlights are glass, with well designed lenses, that don't deteriorate and cloud up, rendering them useless.

Another w/o a clue...

When you have 5x7 HB2 Shell w/ 9003 Bulb then have exact same thing as Thousands of "Modern Cars." Example: Truck-Lite P/N 27009. These have been available for 10+ years... Many "H4" shell are HB2 shells too & "DOT Legal" but not all.

"Europe has always been..." then push "H4 w/ LED..." But what does the EU/UK say??? No.
Fact: HID or LED "upgrade" in Any Halogen Shell like your Hella H4 will often Fail Inspection in several EU states & in the UK. Because most Inspections there require Optical Testing machines that look @ HL Aiming but also Light Levels & Output Pattern/Shape & HID/LED "upgrades" do not Focus correctly & Fail.

Other LED HL "upgrades" w/ custom shells can be too bright or too dim or have other problems & Fail too. Isn't just "PnP" units that try to replace 9003 et al Halogen Bulbs.

Also UK MOT rules Changed ~ 2018 to "ban" HID "upgrades" then now added a "ban" on LED "upgrades" too. Go read MOT requirements & Watch YT etc showing a few shops doing the job on a typical car that Pass MOT. Even before the Optical test, the Inspector looks at a lot of the vehicle & often just seeing the Aftermarket HID Ballast, Fans/Fins to cool LEDs, etc, is an Instant Fail & rest of the inspection is often Cancelled.

In Some Countries, If the Cops stops you w/ any safety problems, they can Impound or "just" Ticket you & that Ticket is Fine, Points, & must have vehicle Reinspected before can drive it. IOW You Pass today, install crap anytime after, cops can basically tear up that inspection & order you to get another eating that cost on top of repairing the problem, fines, points, etc. Like in the U.S., Points in other countries can/will cause Insurance Price jacked up, lose you license etc.