Dog training (Page 1/3)
MidEngineManiac JUN 18, 03:27 PM
OK, so the little guy (now known as "Redneck") is growing like a weed and incredibly smart. 2 weeks and most of the "normal' training is done...

EXCEPT.

He is a biter (mouth-player really, but doesn't realize his own size). None of the normal training methods seem to work. In fact he will double-down. Settle for a second then take a retaliatory snap. Anybody got any "novel" ideas to break the habbit ? I cant really douse Kims ShihTzu's and cats, plus us, in the sour stuff and consider a shock collar a last resort. I dont want to break him, just teach him teeth are a no-no, and he juuuusssssttttt cant seem to grasp that. He is only 10 weeks though, so might grow out of it too, but might not and decide to "play" with a human in the future. BAD idea at the size he is going to be.

He isnt going after shoes or furniture or anything (butcher bones cured that quick ) , just playing rough with living things.

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 06-18-2023).]

Patrick JUN 18, 07:37 PM

quote
Originally posted by MidEngineManiac:

Anybody got any "novel" ideas to break the habbit ?



Full disclosure... I have zero experience training a puppy. However, I have had a husky, and they are notorious for being independent and difficult to control.

Animals such as dogs and cats, especially young ones, seem to relish attention... much like small kids I guess. The last thing they want is to be ignored. What I would try doing with your pup, is as soon as it exhibits undesirable behavior, attach it to a short tether at the far end of the yard... where it's by itself and is totally ignored for a short period of time. For how long? I dunno, maybe five minutes, ten minutes? And when it comes time to release the pup, do not make a fuss. The "fuss" could be interpreted as a reward. That's the last thing you want the pup to believe. Just quietly detach it from the tether and go do something else. When the pup again exhibits undesirable behavior, again just quickly and quietly attach it to the tether, away from any attention. Hopefully the pup will associate these "time outs", which it won't enjoy, with behavior (biting in this case) that you don't appreciate and/or want.

The biggest mistake I've seen with friends trying to train their pets is that they themselves act inappropriately. While "scolding" their pet for some infraction, they at the same time are petting the dog/cat, or doing some other action that the pet perceives as a positive. Even yelling at the pet could be interpreted as something positive, as it's attention. It's no wonder then that the pet never changes it's behavior... as this bad behavior is being reinforced!
ls3mach JUN 18, 10:52 PM
I've been training, raising, breeding since I was a little tyke. I mostly fool with larger breeds myself, but my family has done a lot of doxies.

Great Danes are notorious mouth users. There mouth is hand level. All things they do as a puppy may seem cute, but they turn into 120+lbs and it isn't cute then.

I don't care that's its frowned upon, but aggression for aggression. I broke my alleged "chicken killer' Dane this way. He still loves me even after a couple whoopings. He is great with kids and doesn't put hands in his mouth. He can be left alone with chickens, cats, small kids, ducks, other dogs. Everything
MidEngineManiac JUN 18, 11:06 PM
This one, mom is pure Shepherd, That's easy. Dad is a King Shepherd mix, and going by his size and look I'm thinking there is some dire Wolf in there somewhere.
Patrick JUN 18, 11:13 PM

quote
Originally posted by ls3mach:

CLICK FOR FULL SIZE



There's that gas meter again!

cvxjet JUN 19, 12:23 AM
A couple of suggestions based on what I had to deal with; My "new" dog Sille was adopted and then rejected twice- I was her last chance. I thought it had to do with her being a BORDER COLLIE- Lab mix (Border Collies are extremely active- you must exercise them or keep them busy MOST of the time.

What I found out tho is she actually has a LAB problem; Labs think they are in a Mosh-pit all the time- They like to run into you- usually just friendly bumps but Sille has a little bit of scramble upstairs- She's ready for a zoomy...stomp my feet and, instead of running around, she goes 20 feet away and then CHARGES at me barking and growling.

She actually has a (Relatively) "Soft" mouth, but running at you with her mouth open she can get you by bumping into you with her teeth. She still has this problem, but now I tell her "SIT!!" and she does with a "What did I do wrong?" look.

Also, I actually bit her paw just enough to make her pull it back- she basically got the idea.

To tell your dog that YOU are >>In Charge<< you should roll them on their back and put your mouth near there neck while growling- the dog should go limp-pawed while licking you ("I get it- YOU are in charge") You should start this when they are playful, then slowly take it to where you do it when the dog is NOT listening to you.

The other thing- just as important; You want your dog to understand discipline, and do right because of fear of punishment- but you also want your dog to LOVE you and want to PLEASE you. The way to tell your dog that, even tho you are in charge, you love him and he's family, is to "Lick his ears" That is a dog's way of showing affection. (I don't actually lick- I just nuzzle her ears in a repetitive pattern)....Important note; If you get an ear nibble from your dog, you are absolutely loved 100% by your dog (I would pay a million dollars to have one more ear-nibble by my previous dog Skye)
Patrick JUN 19, 12:40 AM

quote
Originally posted by cvxjet:

Important note; If you get an ear nibble from your dog, you are absolutely loved 100% by your dog.



Oh great... now I feel guilty as hell because I used to push my husky away when she did that.

Raydar JUN 19, 10:28 AM
We have Australian Shepherds. In particular, we have a ten-month-old puppy, who is very mouthy. (He's actually just like a drunken frat boy, but that's a whole 'nother issue. )

Usually, if he puts his mouth on us (especially our hands), we'll tell him "no bite!" and then pull our hand away, immediately stop what we're doing, and turn away from him.
Dogs want to interact with us, and please us. If they do something that they recognize is counterproductive to that goal, they'll figure it out.

I'll ask Tammy when she gets home, since she's the real trainer (does it as a business) but that's my take on it.
ls3mach JUN 19, 11:52 AM

quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

There's that gas meter again!



That yard is small and the dog is big. ROFL.
I will be out at the "farm" Saturday and will trying and get one with him and the Muscovy ducks without a meter in the photo.

To parrot what CVX said yes it is all about dominance. Another show of submission amongst dogs is teeth licking.

Labradors were my first solo breeding experience. I was maybe 12? They have soft mouths and that is what makes them great for retrieving ducks.

A super high energy dog like a shepherd needs a lot of stimulation. They also use their teeth to nip things to make them mind. I don't care if this is frowned upon, but a quick slap and stern command are my solution. It took me less than 2 for my Dane to learn. His papers specifically said he couldn't be around chickens. The slap was to catch his attention. He loves and trust me (that is key) and the stern "NO" and disappointment is what set it over the edge. He isn't a food driven animal. He loves his treats like all dogs, but if it isn't on his agenda it isn't his interest. He needs a goal or task. I don't feed my dog people food to speak of, but he gets my plate when I finish. If he isn't hungry or doesn't want to get up (they are extremely lazy animals) it will sit until the cat eats it or it dries and I have to clean the plate anyway.


The cat on the other hand is altogether different. He is treat driven. He is also not to be trifled. He knows basic commands like come and up. He does not appreciate company. Every once in a while he wants a shot at the title and I beat him like a red headed step child. We come to an agreement and things go back to how they should be. I don't know what has happened to make him only love me, but he is just a very mean cat. I give him 0 treats or wet food. I save those for company and he still lights them up every time they try to touch him. Sweet and loving to me and the dog. I know he is going to outlive me, so I hope he makes peace with someone.


Here's people food on the ground. I have dozens of photos of him just looking at it. He even lets the cat get to it. He loves treats, but when he is tired of learning commands not even they will motivate.

NO METER

I would walk the dog. Walk him a lot. Walk him until you are tired. Do it multiple times daily. This will build the bond, trust, and respect. Don't allow any behavior you think is cute now, but would be a problem at full size. I got mine at 10 months and had to unlearn a lot of stupidity from a neglectful or ignorant family. Not all dogs are for all people. I wish my Dane was more high energy, but I am high energy so it works well this way. I've read Danes need 5-10 miles exercise daily and I know better. He may get that in a full day of being free and roaming, but anything more than 3 miles isn't his jam. We went shooting last week and after about an hour he was tired of checking things out and was laying under the trucks in the shade. You can tire out a 10 week old puppy, but a dog like that is going to need a lot of attention. Walks are my favorite way to teach discipline. They are learning to walk at your speed. Stop when you stop. Use the potty outside. Check out new smells. All under the supervision of a leash, which after a few walks they won't even realize is a way of you dominating them, but they will accept it just the same. It is worth it to them for the adventure. I also do solid walks before I start training lessons. Get them out of the fresh energy before you take it slow and teach the basics.


Oh, I forgot, I had a mouth issue for a brief bit. I just rammed my fingers farther in to make him gag. 5/7 he was not a fan. You have to make sure they know it isn't a game. In my dogs case it is life and death. We are within 20lbs of each other now and he could easily kill most things. Chickens were the least of my concern.

Why are there no photos of your pup in this thread?

[This message has been edited by ls3mach (edited 06-19-2023).]

cliffw JUN 19, 01:04 PM

quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
Animals such as dogs and cats, especially young ones, seem to relish attention... much like small kids I guess. The last thing they want is to be ignored. What I would try doing with your pup, is as soon as it exhibits undesirable behavior, attach it to a short tether at the far end of the yard... where it's by itself and is totally ignored for a short period of time. For how long? I dunno, maybe five minutes, ten minutes? And when it comes time to release the pup, do not make a fuss. The "fuss" could be interpreted as a reward. That's the last thing you want the pup to believe. Just quietly detach it from the tether and go do something else. When the pup again exhibits undesirable behavior, again just quickly and quietly attach it to the tether, away from any attention. Hopefully the pup will associate these "time outs", which it won't enjoy, with behavior (biting in this case) that you don't appreciate and/or want.



That's how I trained my wife, .