quote Originally posted by 86gtv8: Hello to all PFF Members: I would like to take this opportunity to introduce myself, my name is Tom Pacheco, manager of HTD Hi-Tech Development........... Bob was only asking for information and experiences with our kit. I will attempt to answer all technical questions tommorrow. Thank You

[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 03-14-2002).]

<bump>

quote Originally posted by 86gtv8: how can i make the picture smaller

Hey, according to you, you just redesigned a V-8 kit and corrected long standing problems with it that no one else could solve....... Open your picture on your PC and find the "RESIZE" button.

Archie

[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 03-15-2002).]

Hey keep the positive comments coming Arch!!! Nothing like trying calm a flame thread!!
I'm sure you're not only a "fiero v8 expert" but also a "computer expert" WOW !!!! Were you at the red sea???

quote Originally posted by Archie: Hey, according to you, you just redesigned a V-8 kit and corrected long standing problems with it that no one else could solve....... Open your picture on your PC and find the "RESIZE" button. Archie [This message has been edited by Archie (edited 03-15-2002).]

quote Originally posted by Bob_in_NH: Were you at the red sea???

Maybe I was, Maybe I wasn't. But when I told someone I was going to do something I did it.

YOU are the one who wanted 1st hand info on HTD from someone actually involved.

YOU are the one who didn't want info from anyone else on any other subject.

YOU'VE blasted others' for trying to help you out.

The only Flame war that was going on in this thread was from you beating up on people who were initially trying to help you. And now wouldn't help you if your Foot was on fire.

You've called people who actually like my kit names like "Aren't you one of "archies sheep"???" Have you ever considered that instead of "archies sheep"... they might better be described as "Happy Customers"?

YOU've accomplished two things, one is to pi$$ people off at you & 2, you have managed to "Smoke out" the big shot from HTD.

Now that He's out in the open, we all would like to hear what he's got to say. Others are interested in this info also.

Obviously, you have some kind of bone to pick with me. I have no idea what your problem is because I have no idea just who you actually are & I don't really care. This thread is no longer yours, you seem to be happy with the little info you already have, the rest of us are not.

Even though this thread is 5 pages long, you have only had ONE person with first hand knowledge of the HTD kit respond & now he's stalling with his detailed information.

Have you ever considered that if responses to this thread were limited to ONLY PEOPLE WITH FIRST HAND KNOWLEDGE OF THE HTD KIT. That NO ONE would have responded to your 1st. post?????

HTD, only responded under pressure from this thread and they didn't give any info in that response.

Have you considered that if your initial post would have had no responses, you would have a thread going on now titled "Why Doesn't anyone help me with information?".

Ok, so why don't you just sit back and watch while PFF gets the information you asked for?

Archie

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Alright, this was the image HTD tried to post:

Let's hear the other side.

Look I have no bone to pick with at all. The comments weren't directed at you personally, but a product which you produce. None of it was meant to be personal...I do have a problem with double standards and cheep shots ,, that's it.
No i'm not saying at all that YOU started that (I know you didn't) or who did! I don't really care. People started telling me about your kit. (look at the beginning) I told them I have looked at your kit and wasn't interested. And the reasons why.

You are right I didn't want hear-say about a product that I was interested in buying,simple ,sounds logical to me.
Your also wrong about info I recieved, some people PM'd me with info "good factual info"
I again thank them! Now I understand why they chose to Pm instead of the forum!

So only one person had first hand experiance with HTD style kit. Ok so I keep looking and listening! Including info FROM HTD.
But people whom I believe to not have ANY experiance with EITHER kit started the flame thread.

I sill want to hear from THEM!! Taking cheap shots like the last one from you is not what I would expect from an adult such as yourself. It's not very productive for anyone if we want to hear from them.
I've been reading your thread without one negitve comment or shot. Your story is very interesting. You even stated in the onset of your history of the Sumwalt kit thread " if flaming and such starts you'll stop writing" .
We'll I will ask for them and think they would like the same common courtesy,For all we know they really could have re-engineer the kit and fixed many of the problems. It is possible right?
If you really want to hear what they have to say,let them say it,help them say it, don't take a shot at every opportunity!! Remember I/We want to hear it from them!!

What makes you think I've heard enough about the HTD product. Because I'm doing a stroker 2.8? I'm still interested! I'm just not going to radically alter my Formula , I can get another Fiero.
Besides pre '88s are easier to find parts for. Like I said earlier fall/winter project.

So could we ALL refrain from name calling and cheap shots.. Personaly I think this "flaming" is one of the reasons other kit producers don't participate in forums llike this one.

Remember
Let's hear from HTD.
There is always two sides to a story.
Name calling never gets anywhere.
If you don't have anything good to say don't say anything!

I think we all need a group hug!

Love,,, Bob_in_NH

quote Originally posted by Archie: Maybe I was, Maybe I wasn't. But when I told someone I was going to do something I did it. YOU are the one who wanted 1st hand info on HTD from someone actually involved. YOU are the one who didn't want info from anyone else on any other subject. YOU'VE blasted others' for trying to help you out. The only Flame war that was going on in this thread was from you beating up on people who were initially trying to help you. And now wouldn't help you if your Foot was on fire. You've called people who actually like my kit names like "Aren't you one of "archies sheep"???" Have you ever considered that instead of "archies sheep"... they might better be described as "Happy Customers"? YOU've accomplished two things, one is to pi$$ people off at you & 2, you have managed to "Smoke out" the big shot from HTD. Now that He's out in the open, we all would like to hear what he's got to say. Others are interested in this info also. Obviously, you have some kind of bone to pick with me. I have no idea what your problem is because I have no idea just who you actually are & I don't really care. This thread is no longer yours, you seem to be happy with the little info you already have, the rest of us are not. Even though this thread is 5 pages long, you have only had ONE person with first hand knowledge of the HTD kit respond & now he's stalling with his detailed information. Have you ever considered that if responses to this thread were limited to ONLY PEOPLE WITH FIRST HAND KNOWLEDGE OF THE HTD KIT. That NO ONE would have responded to your 1st. post????? HTD, only responded under pressure from this thread and they didn't give any info in that response. Have you considered that if your initial post would have had no responses, you would have a thread going on now titled "Why Doesn't anyone help me with information?". Ok, so why don't you just sit back and watch while PFF gets the information you asked for? Archie

Before I post on this topic, I want to be clear what the rules are on this post. So far I gather from the very beginning that we are seeking info on the "other" V8 Fiero kit. Comments about Archie's V8 kit are not welcome in this post. Comments about the kit that you have no real knowledge about are not welcome, either. I've read through five pages of posts and while there is some important information, far too much whining.
If I'd asked a group of people about their knowledge about Fieros and everyone sent me posts about how they "heard" Fieros were crap and how good Camaros were, I'd be upset. Then to top it off, coments from the Camaro dealership would be double unwanted.
Archie has the best web page available. It's great and filled with information. If you want to hear about his kits, it's easy. Either through his web page or from his many satisfied customers. However, anyone should be able to learn about other V8 Fiero kits without getting into a verbal fight.
Archie may be right. Zumalt kits may have had problems in the beginning, then folded. Archie's kits had problems in the beginning, too. The difference is he succeeded in correcting the problems and had continued. That is his sucess story. It doesn't include rights to control this forum or to rip competition without reprisal.
I'm doing a V8 kit, quite like the Zumalt kit. I don't think cuttina a hole in the wheel well area of the space frame weakens it, nor do I think the small, properly re-enforced notch in the engine cradle weakens it either. With the varied GM axles now available, a person should be able to move the engine over all they want and still have GM axles, if that's what they want. Personaly prefer a "jackshaft" bolted to the side of the engine, allowing equal length axles on both sides.I wish people would keep their tempers in check, so I don't have to search for the real info that this thread contains. A Fiero doesn't have an actual frame. It has a unibody and it has a cradle.
I have a picture of the beginnings of my own version of a V8 kit, but can't figure out how to post to this forum.

Well I'm hesitant to post here but I'm going to anyway.....

Firstly I don't think Bob has really done anything to piss people off here. He asked about a kit, and tried to remind people thats the info he wanted when the thread got off topic, rightly so.

Secondly , Archie I think you need to accept that you are a manufacturer and some people are not going to want to hear your opinion on another manufacturer and direct compeditors kit, for obvious reasons. You did the right thing by starting a new thread about your views on how this kit was developed. Well last time I read it there wasn't a single flame in there and no one has even interrupted it or attempted to get even remotly off topic. I don't see why you're trying to stir $#@ up here with HTD in this one. You're obviously trying to make the point of their lack of commitment to their product, lack of technical knowledge or whatever. Point taken now drop it-its been said a loong time ago in this thread you probably offer better cust. service blah blah blah. I think this thread is still looking for technical info about this kit, not about how well the guys at HTD know how to use a PC. Similarly I think anyone who's looking for info on this kit don't really care to hear from a bunch of Archie supporters about how great their kit is. Again, read the topic of the thread.

Thirdly it still amazes me that we're on this kick about how many kits HTD has on the road. I could engineer the best V8 kit on the market next week and in a debate like this its going to be deemed crap because no one has it? That makes no sense at all. Just because there are a zillion Yugo's on the road doesn't mean they are the best car around. (no offense to any Yugo lovers out there)

Am I annoyed that HTD hasn't stepped up to the plate already to give us the info? Yes
Do I think they've damaged their credibility somewhat in this forum because of it? yes I do.
It seems to me any company other than Archie making a V8 kit has an uphill battle to begin with, especially in here, but that still has nothing to do with the technical merets of the kit. And thats what this thread was supposed to be about from the beginning wasn't it?

I agree let's move forward!
HTD? Where are Y o u ? ?

Why not just give them a call to clear up the whole issue? , if you planning on spending some cash on a v8 kit , a long distance phone call is nothing

not to flame archie but after reading this thread he seem's to be a tad mad that your not listening to his "happy" customer's , and going for his kit and just dropping the whole HTD kit all togeather.. Bottom line is you buy what kit suit's you , some people are too busy to come online and awnser question's , some aren't.

No need to make fun of each other's computer skill's eather

I would imagine Archie is like the rest of us, interested in seeing if HTD has actually repaired these flaws with that kit.

You have to agree that it looks like HTD is dodging the issue.

So far all they have done is strung us along. I hope this is not how they treat paying customers.

Come on HTD, get your $hit together and prove us wrong!

------------------

1) I already did contact them. I was suprised to see them reply on the forum. They stated this stuff is actually why they don't participate in forums. I'm waiting for the info on the forum just like everyone else.

2) I'm still waiting for the info on their kit! I never said they were better just different approach,That I wanted to look at first hand. I don't want to spend a couple thousand dollars on something to find out it's really not what I wanted.
The HTD website doesn't have enough info to make an "informed decision" from. Archies website DOES have enough info to decide I DON'T want his kit.

Bob

quote Originally posted by Stokin_the_neighbors: Why not just give them a call to clear up the whole issue? , if you planning on spending some cash on a v8 kit , a long distance phone call is nothing not to flame archie but after reading this thread he seem's to be a tad mad that your not listening to his "happy" customer's , and going for his kit and just dropping the whole HTD kit all togeather.. Bottom line is you buy what kit suit's you , some people are too busy to come online and awnser question's , some aren't. No need to make fun of each other's computer skill's eather

OK, Let's see if I have this right.

85GToronto Can bump this thread to the top and it's ok.

I bump the thread to the top and I'm flaming.

Bob claims he wants info on the HTD kit and my kit is not a part of this discussion, yet he takes a poke at my stuff in everyone of his posts.... And I'm not supposed to say anything.

Since Bob would like this thread to be about bashing my kit, he insults my customers by calling them "sheep" etc. and makes out like they are paid to support the kit they are using. (Read his posts).

Bob asks questions about HTD and it's ok. I ask for the same answers from them & I'm continuing a Flame War.

HTD asks how to make pictures smaller.... no one answers them for more than 24 hours, I tell them how to do it and Bob is throwing flames at me.

We finally get HTD to the point where they are saying that they are going to post up some info here and Bob steps up and gives them an excuse to delay it even more by saying "They stated this stuff is actually why they don't participate in forums."

Bob, bashed a couple of people who were genuinely trying to help you by saying (on page 1) "Does Archie sell stock for his company?".

I would ask you now "Do you have stock in HTD?

Now if you want me to stay out of this thread, then don't keep bashing something you know nothing about. If this thread is about HTD then why have you mentioned my name more than you've mentioned HTD?

Archie

If HTD did contact you, did they give you the information you wanted? Did they contact you thru email or PM? Will you let the rest of us know what they said? What exactly were you looking for in a V8 kit? I would be interested in having a V8 kit for my car also and any information would be helpfull in making up my mind as to which is the best choice for me.

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That wasn't meant to be a flame!! it was really a positve cooment about your website! YOU do have enough info up to determine whether you kit is for ME... HTD doesn't have enough detailed info!! Sh?t you even have the instructions up for everyone to see. I like that! I requested installation instructions from another comany not HTD and still don't have it!!That's all I was trying to say.. Nothing at all meant by the referance!!

Sorry!!

The transmission mounts you see is the one that would go towards the front of the car. The one on the left was the one we recieved. This mount was just angle iron and some thin flat plate. It didn't line up or sit flat on the sub frame and the little extension was just welded on . It would break too easily (as you can see in the picture) so when we were making changes we had the mount folded for the extra strength and also welded spacers on the the new mount so it would sit poperly and flush on the cradle.

On the other transmission mount we made some small changes. For the flywheel issue we took the facing off a new clutch that would normaly sit towards the flywheel. We laid the flywheel on a bench and used a strip of plastercine around the center bolts. We installed the disk with pressure plate and still had aprox 100 thousandths of an inch between the springs and the tapered bolts. But you have to understand we made change from the orginal design

For the axles, we had Bear Racing make us the strongest heat treated shafts that they could make .

I'll type a little more we I get back from dinner.

[This message has been edited by 86gtv8 (edited 03-16-2002).]

While I'm certainly not worried about the "modified" Zumalt kit I have in my car (because it has a nine year record), it is disturbing that HTD isn't coming to the plate. I think there are a number of people here that would be interested in what they have to say about their kit, and probably most of them haven't even posted in this thread. There is a very large audience here on the forum, that HTD would be a fool to ignore!

While I can appreciate HTD's reluctance to get involved in this thread, I also believe that if they don't, we all lose some technical knowledge that we base decisions on.

Just my opinion.

I think they came to the plate, The post before you was from them.. I think they forgot the bat!

quote Originally posted by California Kid: While I'm certainly not worried about the "modified" Zumalt kit I have in my car (because it has a nine year record), it is disturbing that HTD isn't coming to the plate. I think there are a number of people here that would be interested in what they have to say about their kit, and probably most of them haven't even posted in this thread. There is a very large audience here on the forum, that HTD would be a fool to ignore! While I can appreciate HTD's reluctance to get involved in this thread, I also believe that if they don't, we all lose some technical knowledge that we base decisions on. Just my opinion.

That's one sorry display!!!

quote Originally posted by Bob_in_NH: I almost sorry I even asked about this kit... See I've installed some "kits" of other nature not a v8-fiero, they all say Oh' were a complete kit.. Order the kit look at it .Damn ! they never said anything about making this or hacking this up. Or you end up mickey mouseing,,,,I don't like suprises when I spend good hard earned money, 2grand is a good chunk of change to just drop uniformed, don't you think ? Please ,None of this is meant as any kind of flame.

That reminds me of a story.....hang with me here.

The year is 1965, I was 15 and was sick of building Model Cars. I bought a 1939 Ford 2 door sedan from a guy down the road for $20 and I bought a '56 Ford Wagon with a 272 in it.

In my massive collection of Car magazines I saw an ad for a complete conversion kit to put the 272/292/312 Ford engines into my Ford. I sent for the brochure and it gave me the impression that it was a complete and easy kit. I ordered the kit with confidence because the kit came from Hurst Shifter Company. Yes, back in the days of a Virgin Linda Vaugh, the Hurst company had a lot of products besides shifters.

I was all excited when I got the kit, but all that was in the box was some instructions, a cast ALum. bellhousing/adapter and a welded up front engine mount. Well follow the instructions and pull the Flathead out of the '39 and the 272 out of the '56. Start putting the thing together and come to find out that the front mount was designed to use the timing case cover from the 312 T-Bird ONLY. I'm here to tell you that the timing case cover from the 312 T-Bird was quite rare and expensive even back then. I couldn't afford the TBird part and try as I might I couldn't modify the 272 part to make it work. To say that I was pi$$id is an understatement. That's when I saved my money and bought a 396 BBC and made all my own parts to put it into the 39. I still have those Hurst adapters around here somewhere & I'VE NEVER BOUGHT ANOTHER THING FROM THAT COMPANY. I'll tell you, to grow up in the '60's messing with cars, to NEVER BUY ANYTHING FROM HURST was a pretty hard thing to do. Imagine the answer they got whenever someone would ask why I didn't have a Hurst Shifter in whatever hot rod I was driving through out the 60's. I've never said a good word about Hurst since then.

When I did my V-8 kit, I remembered the lesson Hurst had taught me and I built and tested several cars before I ever even considered selling a kit. The reason my kit has remained virtually the same design for the last 16 years is that it was carefully engineered from the start.

I worked hard at making my kits do the job that they are advertized to do. I also work hard at getting ALL of the info to my customers BEFORE they buy parts. I remember how badly I felt about Hurst all those years ago & I never wanted one of my customers to feel that way about me. Most of my customers have positive things to say about me. I've worked hard at making it that way & it pi$$es me off when they are insulted and called names.

Archie

Point taken.!

Yeah, I can make a bracket too...

------------------

Ben Cannon
88 Formula, T-top, Metalic Red. "Every Man Dies, not every man really Lives"
88 Formula, Northstar, Silver, In-Progreess. -Mel Gibson, "Braveheart"

Here's the webpage of my friend. My last project "kit" turbo install on a 4cyl camry. They left out a lot of "little details" But we did get it going! I think I tried to post this before but it didn't work. If it doesn't work let me know! http://www.meisners.net/camry/CamryTurbo/

Bob

Archie, that was well said and i coulden't agree more...

quote Originally posted by Bob_in_NH: Here's the webpage of my friend. My last project "kit" turbo install on a 4cyl camry. They left out a lot of "little details" But we did get it going! I think I tried to post this before but it didn't work. If it doesn't work let me know! http://www.meisners.net/camry/CamryTurbo/ Bob

quote from: Burien Toyota performance Presently the kit fits 90-97 Celica's and 90-96 MR2's. The 90-2000 Camry will come soon but requires slight changes to our system due to oil pan differences, engine mounting differences and the source of water for the Turbo.

The webpage to the turbo kit that's linked on your website specifically states that it isn't made for 90 and newer Camry's. I noticed this from when you first posted the link but didn't want to take the thread off topic.
Maybe they changed it in the week after you did the swap and found the problems, but before you posted the link here though.

Sorry I thought I had posted that but it didn't work. Yup the website says that. He/we were told by them that they had fixed the kit to fit the other models . They did kinda, We took lot's of notes and pix then My buddy re-wrote the installation manual and sent it ot them. I don't want this off topic either it was just an example of a kit that "should" work but needed a lot to make it work..
Bob

quote Originally posted by Bob_in_NH: May I ask both HTD and Archie why can't a solution to the solid mount be found? It seems that after all these years either kit style should have solved this.

WAIT A MINUTE...WAIT JUST A MINUTE.. I thought you didn't want info on my kit. Didn't you say you already had enough info on it to make an informed decision?

I don't understand your question. If you've looked at my site as much as you say, then you know that my "normal" SBC kits, that I sell, don't mount the engine 100% solid. I've never sold kits (for "Normal" SBC's) that are all solid mounted. I personally prefer all solid mounted and most of the cars that I have built inhouse have had solid mounts but if you look at the V-8 kit parts list http://home.v8archie.com/v8fiero.htm or the assembly thing I have on the site http://www.v8archie.com/v8install.htm you'll see no mention that any trans. mounts except original are used.

Evidently you haven't studied my web site quite enough OR you are assuming facts not in evidence.

Sorry, I hate to have to jump your butt about this but just a few days ago you were yelling at the top of your lungs that you didn't want or need info on my kit.

Archie

Now let's see how long you have to wait for HTD to answer your question?

I seems that the California Kid has some experience with the Zemalt Kit.https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/019504.html

Maybe he can help you!

------------------

Can't hold myself back....what exactly is the concern with solid mounting??? I'm solid mounted and haven't experience anything remotely dissatisfactory with the setup. If anything, I think it has improved the "sports car" feel of the car. Suprisely, very little vibration and noise is transmitted to the passenger compartment. I've never had one person who's riden in my car make a negative comment on this matter. The only minor thing I notice, it that at a "steady state" cruise of about 40mph I get just a little "gear sing" noise from the Getrag that probably wouldn't be tranmitted if the engine, and trans weren't solid mounted. Doesn't bother me, just part of the "sports car" element!

quote Originally posted by California Kid: Can't hold myself back....what exactly is the concern with solid mounting??? I'm solid mounted and haven't experience anything remotely dissatisfactory with the setup. If anything, I think it has improved the "sports car" feel of the car. Suprisely, very little vibration and noise is transmitted to the passenger compartment. I've never had one person who's riden in my car make a negative comment on this matter. The only minor thing I notice, it that at a "steady state" cruise of about 40mph I get just a little "gear sing" noise from the Getrag that probably wouldn't be tranmitted if the engine, and trans weren't solid mounted. Doesn't bother me, just part of the "sports car" element!

I 100% agree with the "Kid" although I think the gear sing is common to the Getrag, I hear it on everyone of them.

I've done solid mounts on 30 or more customer cars and have never heard a word from them about it being a problem with them.

Some people just get something in their head that a certain thing is bad and the only basis for that is rumor and not on 1st hand knowledge.

Archie

.

[This message has been edited by pherder (edited 03-17-2002).]

Why do people have to make assumptions like that, must everything be spelled out exactly. Ooops!!!! "solid" front mount. And YES Archie , like stated earlier they have
been up on your website for what,4 years,of course I read them,many times!!
I don't want any info on your kit that was engineering question ! You did say "you engineered the kit" Yes? So you would have a good insight to what the
issues are with the front mount. I do respect your experience and knowledge!
Sorry sore spot ,,, From here on I'll refrain from any reference or acknowledgement of or to any "other" kits in this thread but the HTD..... OK!

Htd is there any plans in the future to offer a rubber mount for the front.

Bob

quote Originally posted by Archie: WAIT A MINUTE...WAIT JUST A MINUTE.. I thought you didn't want info on my kit. Didn't you say you already had enough info on it to make an informed decision? I don't understand your question. If you've looked at my site as much as you say, then you know that my "normal" SBC kits, that I sell, don't mount the engine 100% solid. I've never sold kits (for "Normal" SBC's) that are all solid mounted. I personally prefer all solid mounted and most of the cars that I have built inhouse have had solid mounts but if you look at the V-8 kit parts list http://home.v8archie.com/v8fiero.htm or the assembly thing I have on the site http://www.v8archie.com/v8install.htm you'll see no mention that any trans. mounts except original are used. Evidently you haven't studied my web site quite enough OR you are assuming facts not in evidence. Sorry, I hate to have to jump your butt about this but just a few days ago you were yelling at the top of your lungs that you didn't want or need info on my kit. Archie Now let's see how long you have to wait for HTD to answer your question?

199

[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 03-17-2002).]