Allrighty, ya'll who went to the RRR and knows my story, dont give the answer! That means you too, revin.

You are cruising between 60-75 on the freeway at 1800 on a Friday night. You got your oxidized paint waxed and your interior detailed. You put the tire wet, shined up the plennum on your FORMULA and have the trunk full of goodies for the car show you have been preparing for all week. You're supposed to meet friends that night for a cookout and in an hour and a half, you hope to have a hot dog in one hand and a beer in the other.

Back to cruising 60-75. Car surges. Hmmm, that did not feel good. Surges again. Then again over and over. It loses all power until you accelarate semi-hard or let it idle. You try to hold it at speed and it feels like someone is kicking the back and over and over, some of them hard enough to make your head snap. Again, no symptoms if you accelarate or idle. You cannot get the problem to duplicate itself below 30mph.
Your check engine light is not on. Your car is throwing no codes.

Prior to this trip you have replaced within 1 year or 4000 miles: fuel filter (wix), coil (accel), entire distributor including cap & rotor (ocelot dist & delco cap/ro), ignition control module (e-tron), cruise control stalk (dickman), battery (interstate), plug wires (accel), 02 sensor (bosch), plat plugs (bosch), torque convertor lock-up solenoid (fiero store), and windshield wipers (bosch).

Problems you eliminate, in much disgust I might add, are: Cruise Control - engaging or disengaging it changes nothing, TCL solenoid - you can hit the brake and feel it release or feel it engage appropriately, gas - you have 1/2 tank of 93 octane Chevron that you fill to top with 93 Exxon when symptoms start (thought maybe 'bubble of air' in gas tank, all plug wires are seated tight, rotor still in place, charging system is fine, and windsheild wipers function great.

You have no tools and over an hour of travel to a fairly remote area.

You curse your car and all your efforts to make it more beautiful nad go home. The next day you make it in time to the show-n-shine to pass out cookies for people's early lunch. (in my Fiero I might add)

What would you do/check? What did I do

I will post the answer after ya'll Fiero geniuses reply.

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REMEMBER: stoplights synch'd for 35mph are also synch'd for 70mph.
(and for 140mph, now that I think about it.)

either you were dumb and just run out of gas, or the ignition module pukked. It dont matter how new it is. Ive had them last 3 years, and another one 2 weeks.

I would say either the plugs (havent had good luck with the bosch patnum plugs), loose connection on the coil and ignition module, or a bad ignition module.

First thing I'd check - Throttle Position Sensor. If that checked out then the ignition module.

This can also be caused by bad plug or plug wire, although if it's a plug or plug wire the problem usually only shows up under load (while accelerating), not while cruising.

Sounds like a timing advance problem. My car had exactly the same symptoms when the timing advance wire came loose from the ignition module.

Ahhh... I'll go with Pickup Coil and Ignition module. Possible loose wire?

For one, I think it's fuel related. I believe when you refueled you got some bad gas. You drained the fuel and replaced the fuel filter.

Phil

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GTDude
OVER 25 years GM experience

hmm, good one.
tps?
ignition module?

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'84 2m4 se, a work in progress

Something with the EGR or VSS? That's my guess.

Ed

PS I could look in my FSM--or it that cheating?

My guess, from personal experience -- coil. It shouldn't be gas related because you can still drive fine if one or two cilinders missfire occasionally because of bad gas. All of them wouldn't missfire at the same time to make it surge that bad. Possibly an extreamly clogged air-filter. Rotor/cap... something electrical that would cut off either the gas or the spark for a short period... possibly fuel pump thats about to fail although that would take you longer to fix.... ignition module I guess although that would shut off your car completly or not start it... hmm....

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The tone of voice(or tone of text I guess) tells me it's something simple like a engine-to-chassis ground strap, or a loose battery/alternator cable/lead.

quote Originally posted by rogergarrison: either you were dumb and just run out of gas.

HA HA HA HA hummm I think we have a winner! hee hee sorry just HAD to chime in ...Good one Roger!!

Let the game continue.........

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Blake ...............are you JUST DUMB.?????
LOL.........Hi Revin.......you smartass.

Phil

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GTDude
OVER 25 years GM experience

Ahh-- very good answers. Perhaps my solution has been answerd already... perhaps not.

I will wait on few more replies and take this time to mention that I dislike revin

******** Further Saga Detail *********

No you dum-dum Roger I did not run out of gas! I am adding you to the same list revin is on, and GTDude for that matter

I did check for air obstruction, K&N looking fine and I have taken out the airbox. All looked free flowing there.

I made a run to Autozone in Denton and was thinking MAP sensor. Maybe I had screwed it up when I was detailing engine. Put one on with a brand name of WELLS? it cost $35.00. the clips on the factory MAP kinda fell apart when I took it off, so I was sure hopeing that was my trouble. Hooked new one up and looked for any cracks in the hoses that run around and to the MAP. All good.

Get in drive car around town to freeway, problem seems fixed. Get on open freeway up to 55mph and my heart sinks as the problem re-appears. I had a very aggravating ride back home... purr... WHAM! purrWHAM WHAM purr...

So it was not the MAP sensor. BTW, Anyone have any opinion on WELLS products?

[This message has been edited by blakeinspace (edited 10-18-2002).]

Hey,
Check your other wires, that run off of your positive battery post. I had a rotten wire, that ran from the battery to the ECM. My engine, would spudder, look like it would stall, then magicly bounce back @ 3000 RPM. If this continues, it will blow out you Ignition Module. Good Luck.

Thanks,
Chris

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That kid with the Black SE.

quote Originally posted by blakeinspace: I will wait on few more replies and take this time to mention that I dislike revin ******** Further Saga Detail ********* No you dum-dum Roger I did not run out of gas! I am adding you to the same list revin is on, and GTDude for that matter [This message has been edited by blakeinspace (edited 10-18-2002).]

My guess is the NUT behind the wheel !!! No NOT jennifer!
NAME CHANGE~~~~ BLANK~IN~SPACE !! :P

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Engine temp sensor?

Good replies all... thanks for playing.

I'll post the answer on Monday and will be away from a computer all weekend. Ya'll have a nice one.

Oh yeah, and is this Wells brand MAP sensor that I bought at Autozone worth a darn?

Just put one of those MAP sensors on my car about a month ago and..........

Check back on Monday

Accidently dropped some cookie crumbs in the fuel fill port & clogged a filter?
Ran over a traffic cone & knocked a hole in the tank??
Dunno, that's a toughie

You parked the surging Fiero and took another one.

OMG....IM IN THE SAME CATEGORY AS REVIN????

I AM SURELY DOOMED!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL

Phil

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GTDude
OVER 25 years GM experience

bumping for Monday

You unplugged the tach-filter but,probley just making excusses to get to the cookies you were taking to the show when you pulled over. LOL

I had this same problem last year, and it turned out to be the TCL trying to engage and failing. Although you say you eliminated that already. Other than that, no clue.

maybe catalytic converter parts were clogging up the exhaust system, and they were rattling around to the point that they would clog and unclog, who knows.

matthew

I think your right leg has a spasm and hit the accelerator. Unfortunately, your random amnesia kicked in immediately afterwards and all you noticed was the surging. After getting home, you finished off 3 40s of king cobra. The next day, your hangover took care of the leg spasm and hence no problem.

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Ben
www.60degreev6.com

Okay...

My instinct kept saying MAP or TPS, but I have hence learned that those failures will (should) throw a code. Ignition Module failure throws no code.

I used to scoff at those who carried backup Ignition Modules, but never again. I took my 'old-new' module down to O'Reilly, and they plugged it up to a tester that ran it through a series of tests. It passed on everything except a test called 'low-rpm-idle'.

I now have a $35.00 'ProMaster' brand Ignition Module. You can bet I will be buying an AC Delco module soon as my backup. ProMaster sounds like a brand destined to fail.

So hats (modules) off to rogergarrison that guessed correctly first!
He is followed by like minded peers: FieroMaster88, LateFormula, Blacktree (wires to ig module), jnsnet, lurker, & DJvonnRapp.

Good answer and things to look for in the future go to: joe dirt for his groundstrap answer and Johnson's85SE for loose battery connections. Edherring said EGR, you know I wouldnt know what to look for if that failed?

m0sh man says clogged cat, but I forgot to mention that I dont got one. Mike Smith said Engine temp Sensor... good guess but I dont think that would cause my symptoms.

Steve Normington and SappySE107 get for their clever answers.

GTDude is a big loser with his 'bad gas' answer. No, Phil 'bad gas' is what you were experiencing after dinner last night

My new life motto is:
"Life is like a Fiero ignition module.... you never know when it will fail"

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REMEMBER: stoplights synch'd for 35mph are also synch'd for 70mph.
(and for 140mph, now that I think about it.)

Heh-heh, I think I got off on a technicality.

Thanks for the little mental exercise. It's always good to keep your troubleshooting skills sharp.

whooohooo!
lucky guess!

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'84 2m4 se, a work in progress

Last year went to Carlisle. Did my usual Columbus to Carlisle 100 mph + quick trip without a single problem. Parked my car of the showfield and hung out all day, went to leave and guess what, module died right there. Luckily Ive learned to always carry a spare. Now I also carry a 5.5mm socket to change it after scavenging around for an hour looking for one. Thanks to members who helped me find one BTW

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Ask Revin.......Module was my first guess damn it! I just hate repeating someone else. Besides.....the gas thing sounded intriguing..........LOL.......FAAAAARRRRRTT!

Phil

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GTDude
OVER 25 years GM experience

I had one Autozone module in mine for the first 3 years or more with no problem. Put in a new AC and it went in 2 weeks. Ill keep using Autozone since there free for the rest of my life.

quote Originally posted by blakeinspace: Edherring said EGR, you know I wouldnt know what to look for if that failed?

The only reason I said "EGR" is because that's one of the things which can cause surging or "chuggling", and all of the "good" answers had already been taken...

Glad to hear you got it fixed, and that it was relatively cheap....

Ed

quote Originally posted by GTDude: Ask Revin.......Module was my first guess damn it! I just hate repeating someone else. Besides.....the gas thing sounded intriguing..........LOL.......FAAAAARRRRRTT! Phil

huhhhh GT WHO?????
Don't worry Phil we ALL have had "bad gas"

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