I am posting this specifically for those that have asked about the power steering system as it is installed on Zimmer Quicksilvers. This system uses the PS rack from a Merkur Xr4ti (85-89). I have had this system on 2 cars, and will be installing it on a third. Rodney has this same system, as do at least three other forum members. The system itself consists of the following parts:
Merkur rack (modified)
Custom billet pulley
GM pump
GM reservoir
Custom mount brackets
Hydraulic hoses

In addition, the intermediate steering shaft on the car must be modified.

The specific mods that I am aware of on the rack itself are the removal of some of the housing on the right side of the case, and the shortening and "squaring" of the knuckle attachment. (This is where the intermediate shaft attaches to the rack--I'm not sure of the correct name). In the pictures I've tried to show both the places on the rack that are modified.

I cannot describe the pulley and mounting brackets adequately, as they are specially made for this purpose, but I have included a couple of pictures so you can see them.

The pump and reservoir are standard GM-issue, and the hoses just made to order for length.

Installation of the system requires a few small modifications to the hole through the firewall, the rubber intermediate shaft cover, and the rubber rack mounts. Also, a small part of the battery heat shield must be removed to provide clearance.

This is a completely reversible installation, so you could put the stock rack back on without much trouble at all.

I have these pieces in my family room, so if anyone wants additional pictures or detail I'd be glad to take some shots and email or post them for you.

Hopefully this answers some questions and helps out the development of this idea using other equipment as well.

[This message has been edited by bwayne (edited 12-10-2002).]

Price?

You didn't mention it, do the Fiero Tie Rod Ends just screw on to the Merkur tie rods or does it take other ends or modification?

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by bwayne: I am posting this specifically for those that have asked about the power steering system as it is installed on Zimmer Quicksilvers. This system uses the PS rack from a Merkur Xr4ti (85-89). I have had this system on 2 cars, and will be installing it on a third. Rodney has this same system, as do at least three other forum members. The system itself consists of the following parts: Merkur rack (modified) Custom billet pulley GM pump GM reservoir Custom mount brackets Hydraulic hoses In addition, the intermediate steering shaft on the car must be modified. The specific mods that I am aware of on the rack itself are the removal of some of the housing on the right side of the case, and the shortening and "squaring" of the knuckle attachment. (This is where the intermediate shaft attaches to the rack--I'm not sure of the correct name). In the pictures I've tried to show both the places on the rack that are modified. I cannot describe the pulley and mounting brackets adequately, as they are specially made for this purpose, but I have included a couple of pictures so you can see them. The pump and reservoir are standard GM-issue, and the hoses just made to order for length. Installation of the system requires a few small modifications to the hole through the firewall, the rubber intermediate shaft cover, and the rubber rack mounts. Also, a small part of the battery heat shield must be removed to provide clearance. This is a completely reversible installation, so you could put the stock rack back on without much trouble at all. I have these pieces in my family room, so if anyone wants additional pictures or detail I'd be glad to take some shots and email or post them for you. Hopefully this answers some questions and helps out the development of this idea using other equipment as well. [This message has been edited by bwayne (edited 12-10-2002).]

[This message has been edited by jstricker (edited 12-10-2002).]

No offence meant to anyone using the power steering or looking into it, but why on gods green earth would you want power steering in a Fiero? Just curious as to why anyone would want to replace the rack n' pinion on any sports car with power assist. Don't mean to rag on anyone with any physical disabilities if this is your reasoning.

I would have liked it in my 3800SC Fiero. Not like I didn't have the power.

quote No offence meant to anyone using the power steering or looking into it, but why on gods green earth would you want power steering in a Fiero?

Don't knock something you have no experiance with. I have it in my 88 Mera and the difference is night and day. Sorry. It is very nice to have. I can turn a corner with 1/4 turn of the steering wheel. Makes driving my car like driving an Indy car. I have the pressure set so the power effect is low but I now have 12:1 steering. Lane changes are a touch of the wheel. Really makes driving my Mera seems more like a high end sports car/exotic car. So why on gods green earth would you want rip on something you have never experianced?

[This message has been edited by Rodney (edited 12-10-2002).]

[This message has been edited by Rodney (edited 12-10-2002).]

I just bought an 87 GT with power steering.All my vehicles with the exception of my 88 GT have power steering.All those vehicles can be driven with just one finger on the steering wheel.The steering in the 87 requires some effort,but is not too easy.The best way to describe it is like the difference between your car with worn tires and with new tires.As far as why would you have power steering on a sports car,why not?Is a car supposed to be harder to steer because it's sporty?I don't see anyone taking the power steering out of a Corvette,and if they did,people would say they're crazy.Brian(bwayne) should post some pictures of his car on here,it is awesome!

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#1112
Question my ability,question my intelligence,never question my integrity!

Where did you get this? And if its not available, would you consider selling it to Rodney so he can make a kit, or at least have the mounts and all that drafted up so we can machine them?

------------------

Nobody likes a loser, be a cheater.
^{RAPE ME!! Er, wait, no.. That's not quite right.. RATE ME!}

All I did was ask a question, I didn't really mean to put anyone on the offensive. I just didn't think that there was any effort involved with the rack 'n pinion setup as far as driving the car, had variable assist on my Expedition and it was great when parking. It just seems to me that you get more feed back from traditional rack n' pinion than power assist. I have no experience with the particular unit you guys are talking about and wondered why it would be any better. Call me old fashioned but I like to get some feed back from my car. Give me a bad rating if you think I asked a bad question! I always thought the only bad question was the un-asked one.

I don't want power steering per se, but I do want dramatically quicker steering. It appears that the only way to have that is to go to a power rack which is much quicker than the stock rack. The power steering also negates the increase in effort from the quicker ratio. I like the effort level of my Fiero's steering, but I wouldn't want it any heavier.

Rodney, is this the rack you have?

If not, how much faster than stock is this rack?

I'd probably buy one after I get everything else done I want to do and get it painted and the engine swapped to a 3800.........

I think it would be great.....just expensive and time consuming.........

Phil

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GTDude
OVER 25 years GM experience

I want to know price of the kit, without pump because my 3800 Series II is currently running one with the line looped.

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1987 Pontiac Fiero Coupe #18,838
3800 Series II SFI; 4T60-E Trans w/ 3.33 final drive; Terminator exhaust; 4 wheel vented disc conversion; Walbro 307 fuel pump; W-body air box w/ K&N filter; Rear 32mm sway bar; 134a functioning A/C; GM Pontiac CD player 7-band EQ w/ factory location sub; much more and...a stock GN's TURBO on the way!

Conversions Performed:

1985 SE 3800 Series 1 SC 4T60-E

1987 Coupe 3800 Series II 4T60-E

1987 SE 3.4 DOHC 5-speed (under construction)

http://dtcc.cz28.com

[This message has been edited by Darth Fiero (edited 12-11-2002).]

The rack in the picture is the last one available from the source that's been supplying these for the past few years. This one is not for sale, as it is destined for my '84SBC.

When they were last sold as a "kit", they were priced at $1250. For this amount you got a brand-new modified rack, new pump, new reservoir, custom pulley, custom brackets, custom hoses, modifications to your supplied intermediate steering shaft, and instructions. The first time you do it, this takes about 4-5 hours to install. After that, maybe 3-4. Used parts could reduce the cost somewhat of course.

I won't comment for Rodney on whether or not he will decide to build this for sale. Personally, I'd like to see it available but it may not be feasible at a price that people are willing to pay.

bwayne,

Do you mean the modified rack is the last one available? Just wondering, because Autozone has them listed for $140 and a $90 core charge.

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by bwayne: The rack in the picture is the last one available from the source that's been supplying these for the past few years. This one is not for sale, as it is destined for my '84SBC. When they were last sold as a "kit", they were priced at $1250. For this amount you got a brand-new modified rack, new pump, new reservoir, custom pulley, custom brackets, custom hoses, modifications to your supplied intermediate steering shaft, and instructions. The first time you do it, this takes about 4-5 hours to install. After that, maybe 3-4. Used parts could reduce the cost somewhat of course. I won't comment for Rodney on whether or not he will decide to build this for sale. Personally, I'd like to see it available but it may not be feasible at a price that people are willing to pay.

Not the last one ever possible, John, but the last one that was available from the man who has built them for years. (He wanted out of the Fiero business). You CAN do this yourself, it's just that you can't buy one from him.

There are 4 special parts to this idea: The rack, the brackets, the steering shaft and the pulley.

In order to duplicate the rack, you'll need to start with the new or rebuilt unit. Then you need to shorten the shaft and rework the right side of the casing. Listening to the description of this part, it is more involved than it seems at first.

If you have a stock engine in your car, you'll need to come up with some way to mount the pump, which is where the special brackets come in. If you have swapped engines and you already have a pump, or at least a mount for one, this will be much easier.

Third, you must shorten the intermediate steering shaft. It must be cut in two places and welded back together.

Last is a pulley. For the stock V6, this "kit" has a custom billet aluminum one, but there isn't any reason why this function could not be re-engineered another way either. The bottom line is that the pump needs to be powered in some way.

There are essentially two problems with power steering on Fieros: The rack is one part, and powering it is another. This "kit" was engineered so that it would not change the geometry of the car so it will handle safely and predictably. There are probably several other ways to accomplish the feat.

In talking with the man that developed this idea, his feeling is that a Corvette rack might be a better solution. But he's never tried it, so it's still just a theory.

---Brian

Is the rack you're talking about the same one that Rodney has? Does it make the steering as fast as his setup?

Could you be more detailed about how it mounts? Maybe before and after pictures?

Do I grind off what's there, then bolt on two shaft collars to make it fit the Fiero mount system?

Dealing with the shaft doesn't sound too hard. I presume this rack is the same distance between inner tie rod pivots as the Fiero rack.

What have you been discussing with the guy, wrt the Vette rack?

quote Originally posted by DRA: All I did was ask a question, I didn't really mean to put anyone on the offensive. I just didn't think that there was any effort involved with the rack 'n pinion setup as far as driving the car, had variable assist on my Expedition and it was great when parking. It just seems to me that you get more feed back from traditional rack n' pinion than power assist. I have no experience with the particular unit you guys are talking about and wondered why it would be any better. Call me old fashioned but I like to get some feed back from my car. Give me a bad rating if you think I asked a bad question! I always thought the only bad question was the un-asked one.

I agree that the feed back in the fiero steering is good at normal driving speeds. Personally though I could do without quite so much " feed back " at parking speeds. What's needed really is variable assist power steering with the steering becoming less assisted as speed increases. I think I'd be more inclined to try and do it electrically rather than the old fashioned way like their suggesting here but that's just my opinion

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85 WS6 GT partly modified
87 GT Loaded resto project

Brian,

Thanks for clearing it up. In my case, I'm going N* and the pump is already there, mounted, and ready to go. The intermediate shaft change isn't of any great concern either since I have a lathe, mill, plasma cutter, welders, etc. in my shop.

My concern is finding an appropriate rack and for that I mean one that has the stock (or very nearly) stroke of the Fiero, correct width to minimize bumpsteer, a reasonable mounting system, and a way to put on the appropriate outer tie rod ends.

It sounds like the two best options are the Merkur rack or the power Chevette rack. I suspect the tie rod ends will screw on the Chevette rack, but I don't know. I guess it's time to hit the junkyards or spend some money.

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by bwayne: Not the last one ever possible, John, but the last one that was available from the man who has built them for years. (He wanted out of the Fiero business). You CAN do this yourself, it's just that you can't buy one from him. There are 4 special parts to this idea: The rack, the brackets, the steering shaft and the pulley. In order to duplicate the rack, you'll need to start with the new or rebuilt unit. Then you need to shorten the shaft and rework the right side of the casing. Listening to the description of this part, it is more involved than it seems at first. If you have a stock engine in your car, you'll need to come up with some way to mount the pump, which is where the special brackets come in. If you have swapped engines and you already have a pump, or at least a mount for one, this will be much easier. Third, you must shorten the intermediate steering shaft. It must be cut in two places and welded back together. Last is a pulley. For the stock V6, this "kit" has a custom billet aluminum one, but there isn't any reason why this function could not be re-engineered another way either. The bottom line is that the pump needs to be powered in some way. There are essentially two problems with power steering on Fieros: The rack is one part, and powering it is another. This "kit" was engineered so that it would not change the geometry of the car so it will handle safely and predictably. There are probably several other ways to accomplish the feat. In talking with the man that developed this idea, his feeling is that a Corvette rack might be a better solution. But he's never tried it, so it's still just a theory. ---Brian

If you don't mind, how about a few shots of the tie rod ends. And, what is the black tube shown in the second picture?

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Roy :D
Blue 87 GT w/ 4th generation Firebird interior.
Suncoast Fieros

Just a thought...Has anyone looked at the PS system used on the Saturn VUE? It's an electronic system (good for fiero use)but I'm not sure if it would work dimensionally. It could be worth looking into.

MrFixit58,

The black tube would be the equalizer tube. This allows the air pressure from the sealed bellows to be equalized between the two when turning. No pressure build up in the bellows equals less boot failure and no dirt from a breather hole.

The answer to the question about the shafts would be an important one. The length of the shafts would be important. Also, the threads on the shafts need to match up to the tie rod ends. I'm curious too...

Jim

[This message has been edited by Jim Porter (edited 12-12-2002).]

quote My concern is finding an appropriate rack and for that I mean one that has the stock (or very nearly) stroke of the Fiero, correct width to minimize bumpsteer, a reasonable mounting system, and a way to put on the appropriate outer tie rod ends.

That's the reason for using the Merkur rack. It is the same length as the Fiero rack. The Chevette is easier to mount, and C4 Corvette has the correct input shaft, but the lengths of both of those are way off. I suspect that at the time these kits were developed (mid 80s?) there was nothing better available. It's quite possible that there is a late model GM car that has a more suitable rack, but it would take lots of research to find it.

It looks like they are using threaded adapters on the tie rods. I have a ZF rack from an '86 XR4ti. The one in the kit is a TRW rack. They are interchangeable on the Merkurs, just two different manufacturers. The ZF tie rods have the same thread size and pitch as the Fiero tie rods, but they are gender opposite. The Merkur rack and the Fiero tie rods both have female threads. To put the Fiero tie rods onto the Merkur rack would just require a threaded stud between the two, I think it was M14x1.5. Maybe this isn't strong enough, and that's why they used the adapters on the Merkur tie rods?

I keep hearing that the one rack that fits like a glove on the Fiero and without any modifications is the one in the GM EV1.

• Steering Type: Electro-hydraulic, power rack-and-pinion (speed-sensitive, variable-effort)
  
• Steering Ratio: 16.5:1
  
• Turning Diameter: 32.5 ft (9.9 m)
  
• Steering Wheel Turns: 3.0 (lock-to-lock)
  

I don't think the EV1 is still in production but, there might be some new racks stored somewhere that can be looked at.

just my .02

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Winston Ojeda
88 Fiero Formula LT1
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
http://www.FieroLT1.com
Home of the Fiero LT1

quote Originally posted by FieroLT1: I keep hearing that the one rack that fits like a glove on the Fiero and without any modifications is the one in the GM EV1. Steering Type: Electro-hydraulic, power rack-and-pinion (speed-sensitive, variable-effort) Steering Ratio: 16.5:1 Turning Diameter: 32.5 ft (9.9 m) Steering Wheel Turns: 3.0 (lock-to-lock) I don't think the EV1 is still in production but, there might be some new racks stored somewhere that can be looked at. just my .02

If I remember correctly. I heard the GM is not renewing the leases on the EV1 anymore, and are going to crush them. I think it was from poor sales. Now if someone could get the racks from the EV1 before the crusher. Anybody in California want to scour the JunkYards for one of these vehicles?

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1988 Fiero Formula T-Top # 1008 of 1252 (5 Spd White/ Grey)
Click here to go to my Web site

Rockcrawl,

Thanks for the information. This is the first time I've heard someone really explain what the situation is with the tie rod ends on the rack.

I've also wondered about custom Mustang II racks. They are common in street rods and almost like the small block Chevy, you can buy one that doesn't have any Mustang II parts in it, all custom. Custom lengths, input shafts, tie rods, power or manual. The only problem with them is, of course, price. They are substantially higher than the Merkur rack even when figuring in the core charge that you'd have to pay.

Thanks again, interesting information.

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by rockcrawl: That's the reason for using the Merkur rack. It is the same length as the Fiero rack. The Chevette is easier to mount, and C4 Corvette has the correct input shaft, but the lengths of both of those are way off. I suspect that at the time these kits were developed (mid 80s?) there was nothing better available. It's quite possible that there is a late model GM car that has a more suitable rack, but it would take lots of research to find it. It looks like they are using threaded adapters on the tie rods. I have a ZF rack from an '86 XR4ti. The one in the kit is a TRW rack. They are interchangeable on the Merkurs, just two different manufacturers. The ZF tie rods have the same thread size and pitch as the Fiero tie rods, but they are gender opposite. The Merkur rack and the Fiero tie rods both have female threads. To put the Fiero tie rods onto the Merkur rack would just require a threaded stud between the two, I think it was M14x1.5. Maybe this isn't strong enough, and that's why they used the adapters on the Merkur tie rods?

Some more information and comments:

On the subject of the VUE unit, this vehicle has an electric motor that is actually part of the steering column. In talking with the local saturn parts guy, he thinks that the coupling could be modified to work, but there are no columns in the parts system yet to see what other mounting and application problems we might encounter. Parts price for this is 917.84. There were zero in the national saturn inventory the last time I checked. It would be an interesting experiment, so I hope somebody tries it.

On the subject of the EV1, GM has never sold this vehicle. All of them in use are leased and each must be returned to GM at the end of the lease. Recently GM also announced that in addition to canceling the project, they would not be extending any of the current leases. So . . . there are none in any junkyard to go look for, and anyone that has a car now must return it to GM when their lease is up. From everything I've read, this part may have done us well for our purpose, but it does not sound like there will ever be one available through readily accessible channels.

On the Vette rack idea, this is just an idea that could be researched. I believe the C4 rack is too narrow, but maybe the C5?? It's certainly worth looking into if someone has one around they can inspect.

On the price of this rack, assuming we could get new or rebuilt racks from AutoZone or someplace for about $250, we could get completely modified racks (with steering shaft mods included) for about $700 apiece. (That's $700 total, not $700 plus $250). For any of you that have swapped motors and have a way to supply the necessary hydraulics, this option is available.

Why did Zimmer choose this way to do things? Because they were trying to build a car for sale that had to be reliable and safe and did not create a huge liability for themselves. The Merkur rack is so close to the Fiero that it was a logical choice. In the Quicksilver application, the frame is stretched, so the steering shaft did not need to be shortened. Also, they were charging some $50-60k for the car, so the cost wasn't quite as much of an issue as the quality of the finished product.

On the tie rod ends: The standard Fiero tie rod ends work fine. The end screws into the threaded adjustment sleeve, and then the sleeve screws onto the rack just as it does on the Fiero rack.

quote Originally posted by DRA: No offence meant to anyone using the power steering or looking into it, but why on gods green earth would you want power steering in a Fiero? Just curious as to why anyone would want to replace the rack n' pinion on any sports car with power assist.

There are options on a car that cater to the sick the elderly and the weak. If you are a midget, severely crippled or Richard Simmons, power steering would be very nice to have.

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87GT 3.4 Turbo Best 0-60 5.2 seconds
http://turbofiero.fierojoe.com/turbo.htm

quote Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: There are options on a car that cater to the sick the elderly and the weak. If you are a midget, severely crippled or Richard Simmons, power steering would be very nice to have.

... Or maybe you autocross and the quicker steering and ability to steer with one hand could come in handy. (Ya know, for us manual drivers)

I'm not crippled in any way and I'd damn near put power steering on before I did an engine swap. I just drive my car too damn much.

quote Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: There are options on a car that cater to the sick the elderly and the weak. If you are a midget, severely crippled or Richard Simmons, power steering would be very nice to have.

Dennis,

You weren't always an A$$. What happened?

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Roy :D
Blue 87 GT w/ 4th generation Firebird interior.
Suncoast Fieros

Dennis,Have you ever needed or wanted something that other people thought was a waste of time?If you haven't,that is a surprise.If you have,you should know better than to critize people who want something you deem unnecessary.You are entitled to your opinion,but you are not entitled to shoot down someone else's.

quote Originally posted by mrfixit58: Dennis, You weren't always an A$$. What happened?

Don't you just love it. The subject of this post seems to bring out the best in people.
It is certainly any Fiero owners right to install any of the add on's that they want. I just don't see the point, especially on a road racing Fiero where you want to maintain road feel, limit oversteer and not use precious horsepower.

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87GT 3.4 Turbo Best 0-60 5.2 seconds
http://turbofiero.fierojoe.com/turbo.htm

All the people on this board that HAVE driven a Fiero with the Zimmer aftermarket steering are eligable to say if they like it or if it a waste. All the rest have no clue as to if it is good or bad. : )

I have it and it is more than good. One of the best things I did to my car. I welcome any of the others on this board that HAVE driven a Fiero with the Zimmer power steering to offer their feelings on it. I feel the rest have nothing to say. But they do.

Well........I can say this! I don't have it, but I'd LIKE TO HAVE IT. Close enough?

Phil

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GTDude
OVER 25 years GM experience

quote Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:The subject of this post seems to bring out the best in people.

It's not the subject! Care to guess again?

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quote Originally posted by Rodney: I have it in my 88 Mera and the difference is night and day.

If you have it can't you remove it for a bit and reproduce it? Since the other guy is no longer reproducing it you wouldn't figure it'd be a problem...

Why bother? Everyone will think you are either sick, elderly, weak or severely crippled. Plus everyone else that does not have power steering will tell you what a waste it is to have in a Fiero.

Rodney,

Fortunately, since I care not what others think, it doesn't apply to me. My next project will have power steering, and out run Dennis' Turbo V6 to boot. (yes, even with that darn PS Pump sucking down almost 2 whole hp)

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by Rodney: Why bother? Everyone will think you are either sick, elderly, weak or severely crippled. Plus everyone else that does not have power steering will tell you what a waste it is to have in a Fiero.

quote Originally posted by bwayne: On the Vette rack idea, this is just an idea that could be researched. I believe the C4 rack is too narrow, but maybe the C5?? It's certainly worth looking into if someone has one around they can inspect.

If the rack is too narrow by a large enough margin, then extenders could be machined to make it the right length. These would be pieces that screw in to the ends of the rack where the inner tie rod ends would go, and in turn the inner tie rod ends would screw into these adapters. Making the adapter half as long as the difference in length between the racks would put the inner tie rod ends the correct distance apart. Also, the adapters could be set up to use Fiero inner tie rod ends, if the Vette ones aren't compatible.

The EV1 is based on a Geo Storm?

I have an 88 which went from a 2.5 to v6 this fall, but alas, no power steering.

The EV1 electric rack is nice, but if somebody wanted to use an electric motor to power the pump and mount all that weight up front, which would help the f/r weight distribution, might that work?

I was contemplating an electric powered car and the Fiero looks like a great platform. Now I just need to talk my supreme commander into buying another car.

FJ