That's a nice center dump. Looks like a vintage piece. Business is business. Dedication to customers and to your product is why these guys love you! Most of us will still be here for the next chapter. jp
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12:00 AM
Mach10 Member
Posts: 7375 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Registered: Jan 2001
Page 6. Damn. Time to give this thread a nice bump.
------------------ The Black Beauty (85 GT) - Bustedato (86 SE, Parts car) Don't sweat the petty things, and don't pet the sweaty things AOL IM: KSSouter MSN IM: I_R_Sootah@hotmail.com
I can't believe that they didn't use any dowel pins at least with that flywheel mounting scheme.Yipes. It looks like those guys were just out to make a buck,and Archie's goal is just to enjoy his life! Look what produced a better product.
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10:14 PM
May 1st, 2002
MODIFIE Member
Posts: 238 From: Scoots Hill TN USA Registered: Apr 2001
Give it up !! This thread has a page and a half of "bump"!! Just let this thread rest in peace ,it died over a month ago. It's cold up north maybe Archie got stuck in the snow!!
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04:51 PM
Jun 13th, 2002
voyagerspe Member
Posts: 561 From: Binghamton NY USA Registered: Feb 2001
Originally posted by Bob_in_NH: Give it up !! This thread has a page and a half of "bump"!! Just let this thread rest in peace ,it died over a month ago. It's cold up north maybe Archie got stuck in the snow!!
------------------ Ben Cannon 88 Formula, T-top, Metalic Red. (2:13.138 at Sears Point) "Every Man Dies, not every man really Lives" 88 Formula, Northstar, Silver, In-Progreess. -Mel Gibson, "Braveheart"
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05:32 PM
Old Lar Member
Posts: 13797 From: Palm Bay, Florida Registered: Nov 1999
Why is it the forum attracts a$$holes who pi$$ off guys like Archie or Ed Parks, screwing up the learning curve for others. Pretty soon there will only be turn key versions for V8 machines, for those skilled in their creation will only build them, and not aid the incompetant.
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10:35 PM
Dennis LaGrua Member
Posts: 15455 From: Hillsborough, NJ U.S.A. Registered: May 2000
I'm not joining the debate on which V8 kit is best by comparing the features of the Zumalt and Archie kits. My thoughts on the subject are well known and I believe that both designs have their flaws. I was brought up drag racing V8 cars and still own a V8 Mopar w over 500 HP. Having raced V8 cars; I used to think V8's were the only answer to performance until I saw Angela Proudfoot of Washington, DC run a 10.3 sec. 1/4 mile in her 1.8L Honda Civic. I never hit the tens with my SB V8 Mopar and I was trully amazed. Kind of shot down the old argument that there is no substitute for cubic inches. However, some people still cling to the old reliable SBC and that fine but it also gets me to my next point. V8 Archie continues to make V8 Fiero kits and Gary Zumalt does not. Gary was not a good (and perhaps unethical) businessman who went out of business two years ago....he's gone finito!!!! Gary Zumalts kit could have been great or it might have been junk but does not affect us now. Gary has left the Fiero community. Archie is still in business and making some pretty nice kit cars I might add. If we wish to open up the debate about making a legitimate comparison of two different V8 kits; doing it with two kits presently on the market may make for better knowledge and understanding, How about comparing the V8 Archie Kit vs. the Hi Tech development SBC Fiero V8 kit. Both of these kits will apparently do everything that the manufacturers say they will do (attach a SBC to the Fiero tranny and cradle) so why are we discussing what is not available instead of focusing on what is available.
[QUOTE How about comparing the V8 Archie Kit vs. the Hi Tech development SBC Fiero V8 kit. Both of these kits will apparently do everything that the manufacturers say they will do (attach a SBC to the Fiero tranny and cradle) so why are we discussing what is not available instead of focusing on what is available.
[/B][/QUOTE]
The HTD kit is basically a Zumalt kit. It is a copy of it. HTD was on here claiming he made changes to the kit, but has yet failed to show any proof.
There is another tread about the HTD kit, I just forget what it is called. Try a search for HTD Eliminator or something like that.
That would be a nice option, except that HTD got all huffy and decided not to release any info to the forum. The only thing we have to go on is the design that became the HTD kit. If HTD wants to tell us what they changed, we'll listen. This thread was started to clear up the misinformation about the Zumalt kit. It also gave the history of kit and how the auto and manual versions came to be.
Zumalt is out of business. Several people make kits or parts of kits in the same style as Zumalt. If Archie went out of business and someone else made a V8 kit like his or even if someone made a copy of this style, we'd refer to it as Archie-style. This dicsussion topic has formed two main parts/replies. One part contains what Archie thinks/believes about the Zumalt kit and the other main part is "bumps" to keep this topic alive. When anyone supports anything different in this discussion, they get jumped on. Why can one person make a point, yet when another person makes a counter-point, it's viewed as "a$$holes". Why must one person's thoughts be accepted yet another's are viewed as "crap"? If I were HTD, I would not get mired down in this negativity either. Archie had problems/mistakes in the beginning, as did Zumalt. Archie improved his product. Zumalt got out of it. Isn't it possible that the idea/design of Gary Zumalt could be improved/corrected to create an alternative/competition to the Archie kit? This list has hundreds of skilled mechanics, engineers and general tinkerers. The problems with Zumalt style kits can be overcome. Let's open our minds to the possible instead of lock-step marching to the loudest drum. If these discussions must be single sided, what's the point? I don't blame Archie for trying to extinguish all competition. We all prefer to see the world from our own perspective. If someone decided to publish their version of V8Archie, like he did of Gary's history, I wonder if tempers would flair? Turnabout is fair play? This topic started out to describe one person's view of his competition's product. Sort of like a Ford dealer talking about the Chevys. You have to expect some different opinions. You must also expect that most will be overstated, exagerated and filled with myths. If ever there was an example of "believe half of what you see and none of what you hear (read) this topic is it. I'm working on my own design V8 adapter. I don't like the clunky starter arrangement on the Archie adapter. I don't like the flywheel arrangement of the Zumalt style kit. Making an adapter plate isn't difficult. Running the hoses and wires isn't too difficult, either. Mounts are easy. I'm troubled by an unsupported main shaft that isn't even near the crankshaft's pilot bearing. Plus, the Fiero has the longest right side axle of any GM FWD, so moving the engine over just increases this length, increasing shaft flex that leads to breakage. To make this a discussion of the design elements of the Zumalt-style kit, how about some details on the flywheel? How thick, how far does it set out from the V8 block? Can a V8 flywheel be turned down and a smaller ring gear installed? What size?Would there be an advantage to use a ring gear from a 280Z to match the starter or does GM make a starter that will bolt easily to the adapter plate? If the transaxle is "soft-mounted" would the Zumalt style rubber engine mount be better or worse than the Archie style "hard-mount" If the engine can't move, but the transaxle can, would that create a problem? Non-judgemental comments and related ideas welcome.
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02:08 PM
artherd Member
Posts: 4159 From: Petaluma, CA. USA Registered: Apr 2001
"why are people with different opinions called assholes?"
I dunno, why should I design your V8 kit for you?
Honestly, you come on here all PC and willy-washing around about how everyone's opinion should be cherished and fed, even if it's stupid, and then in the last paragraph, you're designing your own V8 kit, and any engineer worth his salt will pretty much tell you to emulate what Archie's already done.
What is it with you guys?
------------------ Ben Cannon 88 Formula, T-top, Metalic Red. (2:13.138 at Sears Point) "Every Man Dies, not every man really Lives" 88 Formula, Northstar, Silver, In-Progreess. -Mel Gibson, "Braveheart"
