i worked at ARI in the head shop for about 2 years. the engines that people used pensoil in had a lot of sludge built up in them from the high concentration of parifin wax. i'm not saying pensoil is bad, just make sure you change it on a regular basis
I know you didn't ask, but a friend of mine just bought a 130K+ mile 2.8 that was fed a steady diet of Castrol, every 3000 miles, for it's entire life. When he pulled off the valve covers, it was nearly as clean as a new engine. He was amazed.
Of the two that you mentioned, I would use Valvoline. I've also heard that Pennzoil (and Quaker State) use a paraffin base, and can 'sludge up' your engine.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 03-19-2005).]
i'd choose valvoline, i run maxlife 10w-40 in my 1986 160K 2.8 with no problems
on the other hand i had another fiero 2.8 rebuilt that had a life of Halvoline and the insides of the motor were nasty!!!! verry thick sludge,
the car was maintained on a regular schuedule, and the rest of the car was really well kept (near showroom condition) so i really dont think the motor was overlooked as a maitenance issue but i will never use Halvoline in anything because of that
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10:47 PM
Firefox Member
Posts: 4307 From: New Berlin, Wisconsin Registered: Feb 2003
They both meet SAE requirements for your engine. Both will do the same thing.
From reading around on websites about oil (yes I was bored lol).... I have heard penzoil is parafin based and can cause build up.
Do I believe that? Not really. All dino oil is the same stuff, more a less.
I've torn apart quite a few engines over the years, and the only ones that I find full of sludge are the Pennzoil/Quaker State engines. I've seen several where the sludge is so thick that the top of the cylinder head is sludged to match the underside of the valve cover.
I use Valvoline or Castrol GTX for mineral oil, but when I can, I run Mobil 1.
Mark
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11:18 PM
LZeitgeist Member
Posts: 5662 From: Raleigh, NC, U.S.A. Registered: Dec 2000
Wow, I may very well switch to Valvoline... I've been an absolutely religious Pennzoil/Fram user for pretty much as long as I've owned cars. What's the best way to get rid of the paraffin build-up?
Just change your oil regularly. The detergent in the oil should help get rid of any build up there is.
PC.....glad to hear it's coming along. I've got one in the garage now that I've been fighting for a month now, but it's almost ready for paint. It's a fiberglass rebody, and it's been hell to finish up. Hopefully yours is going easier than mine!
I used penzoil in my 88 Mony Carlo SS and it started smoking so I decided to take the valve covers off to tare the motor down and 1 quart of oil came out of it!!! True story. Both sides were full of slime. I used a coat hanger to clear the oil gallys and put the covers back on. It never happend again after I switch to cheap stuff. I baught the car new so I no it was not from changing the oil.
I caution you about physically cleaning the buildup on top of the cylinder head. I did it once, on Janes 84 when I decided one day to change the valve cover gasket. What a shock when I removed the cover!! The oil drain holes were completely plugged up, the area around the pushrods was just kept open by movement of the pushrods up and down. Sludge was built up to the bottom of the rockers. I was very carefull when I did it, and used a vacum to suck it up as I scraped itloose. Still, within a mile or 2, the low oil pressure light suddenly came on. Enough of that crap got down into the pan that it plugged up the oil pump screen. I do not know what oil had been used the 1st 13 yrs by previous owners but since it had a bottle of quaker state in the trunk when we bought it, that's what I used. Never again. We changed the engine about a year later due to excessive blowby and valve clatter, and now use Mobil1 in it. I use Exxon Superflo high mileage formula in mine, (112,000 miles) but the previous owner told me it had always had Valvoline. From what I can see thru the oil fill opening, it's clean as a pin in there. I've used Exxon for as long as I can remember, and have never had a problem with it.
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08:17 AM
1MohrFiero Member
Posts: 4363 From: Paducah, Ky Registered: Apr 2003
I haven't toorn down a lot of engines but I can say in the early years I used only Penzoil on one. When I found all the sludge and crap inside the valve cover, I switched to Castrol and sometimes Valvoline. I haven't found that sludge yet in one of those engines.
Wow, I may very well switch to Valvoline... I've been an absolutely religious Pennzoil/Fram user for pretty much as long as I've owned cars. What's the best way to get rid of the paraffin build-up?
This may stir up quite a bit of controversy, but I'll pass it along anyway. If anyone feels the need to disagree, that's fine. Feel free.
My dad (rest his soul) used to be a pretty good shade tree mechanic. (My granddad was a mechanic by trade.) One of the first things I remember Dad saying was that a steady diet of 'cheap' oil would sludge up the inside of the engine. He said that if you then used 'good' (high detergent) oil, the detergents would break the sludge loose, and it would plug up all of the internal oil passages. Not making any judgements as to what kinds/brands he may have been talking about. (Actually, gas stations used to sell different 'grades' of the same brand of oil, much as they sell different grades of fuel, now. The difference was in the additives, as well as the viscosity.)
The point is, you may do more damage by getting rid of the buildup than will be done by leaving it alone. Just passing along a bit of 'old-school' philosophy. Think carefully before you switch brands/type of oil.
<Pulling on NOMEX undies>
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 03-21-2005).]
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01:34 PM
BlackAz Member
Posts: 32 From: Tucson, AZ........USA baby! Registered: Dec 2002
I only use Mobil One now, but before I switched I always used Valvoline. Never had a problem.
I bought a V8 Monza from a guy who religiously used Quaker State. It had a bad lifter tick. Tore it down and found sludge all caked up inside and the cam and half the lifters were wiped. Couldn't even pull the lifters up through the bore they were so sludged up.
quote
on the other hand i had another fiero 2.8 rebuilt that had a life of Halvoline and the insides of the motor were nasty!!!! verry thick sludge,
the car was maintained on a regular schuedule, and the rest of the car was really well kept (near showroom condition) so i really dont think the motor was overlooked as a maitenance issue but i will never use Halvoline in anything because of that
$Rich$ - Did you mean Havoline or Valvoline? You wrote Halvoline twice so I'm confused...
------------------ -Rick Stewart 85GT 5.0LCaddyV8/Isuzu 5-spd in progress...
This may stir up quite a bit of controversy, but I'll pass it along anyway. If anyone feels the need to disagree, that's fine. Feel free.
My dad (rest his soul) used to be a pretty good shade tree mechanic. (My granddad was a mechanic by trade.) One of the first things I remember Dad saying was that a steady diet of 'cheap' oil would sludge up the inside of the engine. He said that if you then used 'good' (high detergent) oil, the detergents would break the sludge loose, and it would plug up all of the internal oil passages. Not making any judgements as to what kinds/brands he may have been talking about. (Actually, gas stations used to sell different 'grades' of the same brand of oil, much as they sell different grades of fuel, now. The difference was in the additives, as well as the viscosity.)
The point is, you may do more damage by getting rid of the buildup than will be done by leaving it alone. Just passing along a bit of 'old-school' philosophy. Think carefully before you switch brands/type of oil.
<Pulling on NOMEX undies>
That makes quite a bit of sense, actually.
Is it bad to mix brands of oil if they're the same viscosity?
Like, say with my next oil change, I go with one quart of Valvoline and three quarts of Pennzoil, then the next one two and two, then three and one, then all Valvoline? Just curious...
Originally posted by GT:$Rich$ - Did you mean Havoline or Valvoline? You wrote Halvoline twice so I'm confused...
These are two different brands. Maybe some parts of the country don't have Havoline but we have both here in the East. I believe he was supporting Valvoline and warning us of Havoline!
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06:25 PM
OldBob Member
Posts: 393 From: Ludington, Michigan, USA Registered: Oct 2004
Back in 1978 I bought a Cessna Skyhawk from an engine tech who worked in the engineering department at Oldsmobile in Lansing. He used Havoline in the plane's engine and recommended using it in auto engines. His job at Olds was to build, run, and tear down engines. Not just GM engines but others too. Some of the engines were run to destruction and others were put into harsh conditions and run for months. Olds tested various oils etc. in the process. The tech said the cleanest engines at tear down were the Texas oil engines (Havoline in particular) and the dirtiest and varnished were the Pennsylvania oils.
Before he started working in the engine area he always used Pennzoil. He had a Suburban he bought new and serviced it himself on a regular basis. At 100k miles it developed a lifter problem and he pulled the top of the engine for a look. Completely sludged/varnished up.
I have a 94 Plymouth Voyager (bought new) with 160k on it. At about 95k it developed a miss. The mechanic diagnosed a burned valve (wrong, it was the coil pack). Anyway, he pulled one head off and the inside of that engine looked like new - not a hint of varnish and the cylinder walls were perfect. The engine has never had anything but Havoline in it. Still runs great, uses no oil.
Havoline is my first choice, Valvoline second, Pennsylvania oils last choice.
Bob
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10:13 PM
Mar 22nd, 2005
5.0Vert Member
Posts: 287 From: Hurst, Tx, USA Registered: Mar 2005
In my Stang I have always used the parts store stuff, O'Reilly's 10w-30. Its worked fine so far and its really clean. Haven't changed the oil in the Fiero yet
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03:59 AM
css9450 Member
Posts: 5533 From: Glen Ellyn, Illinois, USA Registered: Nov 2002
