That looks like the older 1 piece front cover. I know you put some good work into prettying it up, but I strongly suggest you switch to the later 2 piece cover (assuming thats possible). When your water pump goes someday, it will make your life MUCH easier. Had my dads Q4 Grand Am been 1 year older, the job would've cost 3 times as much.

That is the stock transmission mount. Although new, I did have some concerns with putting it on, as well as the stock rubber engine mounts. I'm considering solid mounting the whole engine, as much as I don't want to... I think I could probably use poly suspension bushings to make mounts, but I don't know where to find polyurethane for a universal application. If I am going to do something about it, I should do it before the engine goes in the car. I was planning on installing it tomorrow because it is my day off, but I may try to do something about all the mounts instead. Any ideas on how to make poly mounts? I have a welder and can get some scrap steel.

As far as the timing cover, how is the two piece cover different? Mine is technically two pieces, if you count the front plate as a piece. I wouldn't think the water pump would be a terribly difficult job. I can get to all three bolts that hold it onto the cover, and that aluminum elbow isn't hard to remove. Let me know! Thanks,

--Bryson

edit: The chain cover from the 92 with the single roller chain wasn't any different, except that the chain isn't as nice. That's the reason I went with the cover, chain, tensioner, and gears from the 1990 Olds.

[This message has been edited by bryson (edited 07-26-2005).]

This is going back a couple of years, so I don't recall specifically. My recollection is that GM went to the 2 piece cover because it made it very easy to replace the water pump. With the 1 piece, you have to take the whole cover off, which can be a serious pain in a cramped FWD engine compartment. Thats as much as recall, and you also have to remember this is GM we're talking about; if they didn't have a good reason to redesign the cover, they would've left it alone and not spent the money to change it.

The water pump is splined and plugs into a drive that is driven by the timing chain. Once the pump is unbolted it just pulls out from the back. There is no need to remove the timing chain cover to replace the water pump. However removing the exhaust manilfold I believe is a necessity to get at the water pump bolts.

If the bearing in the spline drive that drives the water pump goes, then the timing chain cover must come off to replace it.

[This message has been edited by sanderson (edited 07-26-2005).]

quote Originally posted by bryson: That is the stock transmission mount. Although new, I did have some concerns with putting it on, as well as the stock rubber engine mounts. I'm considering solid mounting the whole engine, as much as I don't want to... I think I could probably use poly suspension bushings to make mounts, but I don't know where to find polyurethane for a universal application. If I am going to do something about it, I should do it before the engine goes in the car. I was planning on installing it tomorrow because it is my day off, but I may try to do something about all the mounts instead. Any ideas on how to make poly mounts? I have a welder and can get some scrap steel.

Rodney Dickman and WCF both have bolt in poly trans mounts. Check them out for inspiration (or just buy a set).

Sorry I don't have any pictures -- I forgot to email myself the link to my imageshack account. I think I can get into it when I have more time, though. The engine is in the car, and now I'm just putting suspension pieces together and hooking everything up. I'm also doing all of the wiring over, because I didn't like how it was the first time. I'll be sure to post some pictures as soon as possible, maybe even tonight.

--Bryson

I must say that I admire your project in quest of 400 HP from only 138 cubic inches. The only reservation that I would have would be reliability. It sure sounds like the engine will be stressed to the limit so reliability from over 3 HP per cubic inch IMO is an agressive goal.

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87GT 3.4 Turbo- 0-60 5.2 seconds -Best
Engine Controls, ECM goodies, Chip
re-programming & odd electronics stuff

Dennis -- thanks for the comments, and I completely agree with the engine being pushed at 400whp. I am only going to run 10-12psi on the street, and high boost on rare occasions. Also, I don't race much, only autocrosses maybe once every month (which will need to be low boost), and a rare drag race.

I strengthened up the front motor mount using a bracket I had for the stock intake or exhaust manifold (I don't remember which), because it was flexing even with my weight pushing on the engine. I also made a little thing to hide the spark plug wires, which looks much cleaner in my opinion.

It's kind of difficult to see, but it goes on the side of the mount closest to the engine.

That's the cover I made. I still have to cut a notch for the oil feed for the turbo, but that's basically how it will look. I'm working on some wiring now, just trying to clean up the wires and get a nice loom. I am really leaning towards this loom, but it's kind of pricey: http://order.waytekwire.com/CGI-BIN/LANSAWEB?WEBEVENT+L0A15E5082C6684008660051+M37+ENG

quote Originally posted by bryson: It's kind of difficult to see, but it goes on the side of the mount closest to the engine. That's the cover I made. I still have to cut a notch for the oil feed for the turbo, but that's basically how it will look. I'm working on some wiring now, just trying to clean up the wires and get a nice loom. I am really leaning towards this loom, but it's kind of pricey: [URL=http://order.waytekwire.com/CGI-BIN/LANSAWEB?WEBEVENT+L0A15E5082C6684008660051+M37+ENG]http://order.waytekwire.com/CGI-BIN/LANSAWEB?WEBEVENT+L0A15E5082C6684008660051+M37+ENG[/ URL]

Link no workie.

Dude, ditch that cover. Q4's look SOOOOOOOO badass with the cam towers exposed.

Wel, I don't know how to show the link --- it's basically a split braided wire loom, like you would find on a lot of newer cars. Also, I think that the spark plug in there look really goofy without the cover. If I could find a nice set of plug wires, I wouldn't mind having the cover off at all.

I know the fuel rail is in the way, but you can kind of see...I like the way the cam towers look, but hate the plug wires. Any ideas? Thanks!
--Bryson

I don't agree .. looks good with the cover. I don't like wires/plumbing/etc crap hanging out all over.

Nice and clean !

DLD

I like the look with the cover... good to see that you are making some progress with the project. Are you going to be in the shop this weekend? I might have a little spare time Sat night/Sun afternoon, and would love to take an up close look.

TC,

Good to hear from you!

Bryson will be out of town until at least Sunday afternoon. I'll probably be down at the shop Saturday afternoon as well as Sunday. Unless you're just out riding around, give me a call to be sure I'm there.

Bill

Get some 90 degree boots for the plug ends and transplant. That will clean up the wires a lot.

I'm all for showing wiring and plumbing in an engine swap. After all, you went to a lot of trouble to get it in there in the first place, SHOW IT OFF.

Besides, it takes much more thought and creativity to do wiring and plumbing NEATLY and ATTRACTIVELY than it does to just do a messy job and cover it up.

Update -- car is together, ready to be driven. I'm really happy with how everything turned out, and I expect to see a significant increase in power at the same boost on this engine. The head has a nice port job, the stainless header with merge collector is on, the issues with the unbalanced crank trigger wheel have been fixed, the turbo has a nicer intake, and I'm going to get to tune the car more. Also, the cams in the car are designed to make power up to 8000rpm, so I think that after eliminating most of the restrictions causing the car to run so poorly (max power at 5500rpm), I should be able to shift the powerband up a little more, giving me more horsepower. The same 370 ft-lbs of torque at 6500rpm equates to about 460hp, which I doubt I will see. Even so, it is nice to dream about

Anyway, I tried to start the car last weekend and after a huge fiasco finding a laptop with a native serial port, I figured out that there was a crank trigger problem. I don't know what it could be. The sensor is fine (checked with a multimeter), the air gap between the sensor and wheel is fine, and the sensor is lined up with the wheel. I guess next chance I get, I'll just start at the trigger wheel and work my way back up the wire to the ECU. I will probably hit the wheel with some sandpaper, which shouldn't make a difference, then go up the wire to the plug for the sensor and take both ends apart to inspect the pins. After that, I guess I will make sure the pins going to the ECU are all alright. Also, my dad said he would put star washers under my grounds while I'm at school so that we're sure everything is grounded well. If all of that doesn't fix it, I have no idea what will.

It's not that tough to make the plug wires look good:

Good to hear it's back together and almost running!

Those do look really good -- maybe I'll pick up a set of those little things.

After a tough couple of weekends, I finally got it running! The engine was spinning over and the TEC3 wasn't recognizing the crank trigger signal. I sent the ECU and crank trigger sensor to Electromotive, and they tested fine, so I was getting a little frustrated with trying to get the engine to run. I spent a lot of yesterday on the phone with tech support at Electromotive, checking resistance at all my grounds, and tracing all my wires, and the tech support guy said that it may be electrical noise from the starter, which I found hard to believe. Anyway, I changed the starter out and the car started right up! I made a quick video today -- it doesn't sound much like a 4 cylinder

http://media.putfile.com/IMG_000227

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88 Fiero GT Quad4 Turbo =) 396 whp!

quote Originally posted by bryson: -- it doesn't sound much like a 4 cylinder

Maybe a 4 cylinder IMSA car.

Congrats on your success!

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Raydar
88 3.4 coupe...........

Praise the Lowered!
Read Nealz Nuze!

Congrats... I need to meet up with you soon to take a look up close. My weekend and all of next week is shot already! Movers bringing household goods this weekend, so I know what I will be doing all of next week...

Holy sh**!!! No, that does not sound like a four-banger! Sheesh!

Nice work.

Just bumping this because I don't know how long it takes for a thread to be archived...

I've been tuning a lot, and running about 5psi (the wastegate spring). I am having some problems with my solenoid for the wastegate, and when I tried to run 10psi, I accidentally went up to 24psi briefly I immediately pulled into the garage and checked the datalog, and there were no problems other than a little knock when it hit a higher boost. I pulled some timing from 5psi and up, because the first sign of knock showed up at around 15psi. The car also made 24psi by 4000rpm! It starts to build boost at about 2600, and makes 5psi by around 2750. I'm really pleased with this, considering the car has about a 7600rpm redline right now. I need to make a better turbo intake system because the old one split. I'll try to keep you guys updated, and maybe even get a video sometime.

Good deal. Idles like my v8...

very nice work! please keep us posted. Can't wait to see that thing on the dyno once you have it fine tuned!

I don't like 4-bangers much, but that sounds wonderful. What a monster. My hat's off to you.

Bump because I want my quad to grow up and be like yours someday soon.

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Hey bryson where are some updates, also can you provide any pictures of your oil pan i need to plumb an oil return fitting into the pan and have no idea where to do it, considering there is nothing flat.

when does it come out to greenville? bryson join or local forum www.gvillecrew.com

quote Originally posted by LAMBO: Bump because I want my quad to grow up and be like yours someday soon.

Mybe it will just mutate into a quad 6 , like mine

quote Originally posted by Comealongway: Hey bryson where are some updates, also can you provide any pictures of your oil pan i need to plumb an oil return fitting into the pan and have no idea where to do it, considering there is nothing flat.

Hey -- I'll try to get under the car and get a picture of the oilpan tomorrow when it's light out. Which oilpan do you have? The oil pans were different from my first engine and my second. On this one, I ended up having to drill a hole out in a curved section, put the fitting in, and have it welded. If the welding is on the inside of the pan it looks pretty good. Keep in mind the location of the axle, though. I forgot about it, and ended up having to add some hardline to the drain in order to avoid the axle.

Taurus -- I don't know when I'm coming to Greenville next. I don't go back to school until Fall semester, but I may end up visiting Clemson to see my buddy who is taking summer courses. I'll sign up for that forum, though.

bump

4 months and no updates, i hope this project is still on the roll. It has been my motivation to build my quad 4 up,

And is there any way possible i could get ahold of the file that is no longer at this link?

http://media.putfile.com/IMG_000227

Cool project. A boosted Quad4 is a really great engine choice. I rode in a 350+hp Quad4 turbo Beretta and it took off like a rocket ship....and got over 30mpg on the highway ride home.