Scales are 4 seperate computer scales made by Longacre. They were so sensitive that we couldn't get a steady reading when one car was running when on the scales.

Balance is calculated with driver.

The car. 1987 GT power everything, full tank of gas, no spare or jack, trunk cut out. 3400 5 speed Getrag with a turbo and intercooler in the trunk. (42.01% front, 57.99% rear)

Without driver:
LF: 563 RF:588
LR: 797 RR:805
Total:2752

With driver:
LF: 638 RF: 603
LR: 873 RR: 840
Total: 2954

1987 GT t-top, stock 2.8, 5 speed Getrag, about 3/8 tank. Power windows, spare and jack installed. (41.99% front, 58.01% rear)

Without driver:
LF:565 RF: 576
LR: 780 RR: 813
Total: 2734

With driver:
LF: 624 RF: 595
LR: 850 RR: 834
Total: 2904

1987 Coupe converted to GT (No power options). 3800 S2 NA Getrag 5 speed. I think 1/2 tank of gas. (40.31% front, 59.69% rear)

Without driver:
LF: 529 RF:568
LR:826 RR:822
Total: 2745

With driver:
LF:596 RF:589
LR:904 RR:851
Total: 2940

1985 GT, stock 2.8, stock auto, 17x7 wheels (41.45% front, 58.55% rear)

Without driver:
LF: 582 RF: 576
LR: 789 RR: 871
Total: 2818

With driver:
LF: 651 RF: 590
LR: 861 RR: 892
Total: 2994

1987 SE, stock 2.8, stock auto trans. (41.38% front, 58.62% rear)

Without driver:
LF: 555 RF: 601
LR: 822 RR: 850
Total: 2828

With driver:
LF: 616 RF: 618
LR: 877 RR: 871
Total: 2982

1987 GT 3.4 TDC, Getrag 5 speed, power everything, working AC, trunk floor cut out, battery up front, no spare, 1/4 tank of gas.
Without driver: (front 41.8 %, rear 58.2%
LF: 552 RF: 612
LR: 839 RR: 789
Total: 2787

(not weighed with driver, see below)




[edit]
I bought an 87GT with a '93 3.4 TDC motor in it. The previous owner had it weighed. Here are the results.



Found in the archives - https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Archives/Archive-000001/HTML/20060206-2-067600.html

[This message has been edited by SCCA FIERO (edited 11-10-2006).]

It amazes me how much these cars weigh, I always thought they would be quite light, considering the whole 2 seater and small car physique usually spells out a light car...whats so heavy about them...compared to similiar size cars like...a miata?

safety... and the steel space frame does not lend itself to lightness.. now if was an aluminum alloy space frame... mmmmm...

Thanks for the post, now I need to figure out, the difference from coupe to fastback, getrag to 4t65eHD , and go on a small diet....

Thank you for the good info! (I guess you don't have any 88 weights?)

JG

We didn't get an 88 on the scales, but we will do this again in the spring to set a couple cars up for the season. There were no 4 cylinder cars handy either.

Besides ripping out the interior, how do you lighten up a Fiero? I mean, 2800lbs is pretty light if you think about it. I weighed my 2002 Firebird Formula on a scale at the racetrack, and it weighs 3450 with out me in it. I did a couple of things to lighten it up as well. I know my '86 GT Fiero has power everything and an A/C, full weight, so 2800lbs wet I would think would be pretty light!

quote Originally posted by 02SOMFormula: Besides ripping out the interior, how do you lighten up a Fiero? I mean, 2800lbs is pretty light if you think about it. I weighed my 2002 Firebird Formula on a scale at the racetrack, and it weighs 3450 with out me in it. I did a couple of things to lighten it up as well. I know my '86 GT Fiero has power everything and an A/C, full weight, so 2800lbs wet I would think would be pretty light!

Compared to a muscle car, it's light. But compared to another sports car, it's heavy. The Opel Speedster (mid-engine, 147HP) weighs around 2100 lbs (I think). And it's a GM car.

quote Originally posted by moleman_in_a_FieroGT: Compared to a muscle car, it's light. But compared to another sports car, it's heavy. The Opel Speedster (mid-engine, 147HP) weighs around 2100 lbs (I think). And it's a GM car.

True! The lotus Elise is really light as well. I think it's in the neighborhood of 2000lbs. But yeah, I think I like the safety aspect that they added in! Makes for a little more comfort on the highways, LOL!

quote Originally posted by Cosco: It amazes me how much these cars weigh, I always thought they would be quite light, considering the whole 2 seater and small car physique usually spells out a light car...whats so heavy about them...compared to similiar size cars like...a miata?

Steel space frame.



That's also why it was second only to a Volvo in crash safety.

The Opel Speedster and Lotus Elise are also much smaller than the Fiero.
With an aluminum space frame and all aluminum engine, you could probably cut at least 500lbs off a Fiero's weight.

Look at the new Corvette. It is bigger than a Fiero, but it weighs over 3000 lbs. Even the Z06 is close to 3000 lbs and thats with Carbon Fibre fenders, balsa wood in the floors, aluminum frame and a magnesium engine cradle.

[This message has been edited by Formula88 (edited 09-24-2006).]

SCCA FIERO

I guess the fieros become more of a 40/60 weight ratio after the engine swaps. Is your engine all aluminum?

BTW this is a very valuable information, and guess what you weight 202 lbs

JG

quote Originally posted by THE BEAST: SCCA FIERO I guess the fieros become more of a 40/60 weight ratio after the engine swaps. Is your engine all aluminum? BTW this is a very valuable information, and guess what you weight 202 lbs JG

My 88 weighs out to 43/57 with one of the heaviest motors you could put in a Fiero, the 3.4 DOHC (it weighs nearly 500 lbs fully dressed). With an automatic transmission and a heavy motor it probably get to 40/60 though.

anyone ever driven around without the carpet and padding? is it very noisy? i think i read the carpet is something like 40lbs?

since i have a couple of fieros i'd like to try it on one, like a harder edged car. i'm wondering if there would be any advantage to taking out all but maybe the carpet on the back wall, spraying the floor with truck bed coating, then just having floor mats in front of the seats.

if nothing else it might offset the added stereo (not a huge system but more than stock), and larger wheels to keep it close to stock.

The wife had an intrepid some years back--I ordered new carpet--was 18lbs shipped, but that was cut pile, and Fieros have looped, so it would probally weigh more.

1988 ITA prepared Formula
2.8 with Getrag

130# Roll cage installed, small fire extinguisher, drivers window net, 6 point harness. 3/4 tank of fuel (about 80 pounds)

This car has been stripped of everything inside except the dash cover. Exhaust is only 4 feet long with no muffler, AC removed completely, hood latches replace with pins, etc.

Without 190# driver
LF 544 RF 546
LR 723 RR 731
Total 2544

Cross weight 50.1%
Left weight 50.7%
Rear weight 56.9%

With driver

LF 610 RF 569
LR 810 RR 742
Total 2729

Cross weight 50.5%
Left weight 51.9%
Rear weight 56.8%

I will lose another 30 or so pounds in the near future. Lighter mirrors, Lighter wheels, etc.

IMO if you want to lose some weight for race day and don't want to destroy your car for a few pounds, make up some mock doors out of fiberglass and lexon just for racing. It's been awhile since I've hefted a Fiero door but they have to go somewhere around 75 pounds each.

the fiero weighs a lot more than i had ever suspected.

I had my stock 87GT t-top there. I'm the second car listed. And I weigh 170, thank you very much. Marq is the fat dude (black shirt, back to camera in the pic with the red 85GT), but he's like 7 feet tall.

quote Originally posted by THE BEAST: SCCA FIERO I guess the fieros become more of a 40/60 weight ratio after the engine swaps. Is your engine all aluminum? BTW this is a very valuable information, and guess what you weight 202 lbs JG

quote Originally posted by triker: IMO if you want to lose some weight for race day and don't want to destroy your car for a few pounds, make up some mock doors out of fiberglass and lexon just for racing. It's been awhile since I've hefted a Fiero door but they have to go somewhere around 75 pounds each.

Rules are pretty strict regarding doors. I can remove the glass and gut the inner skin ONLY if I install a NASCAR style door bar section to the cage. The Stock Fiero door appears to have a pretty substancial door brace already, and I like the fact I can lock the car up for overnight security at tracks that host other events besides the road race crowd.

Moral of the story is if you strip your car of all the creature comforts and do not add race equipment like a cage, the best you will do is about 2300 pounds and still have the car driveable. The OE carpet weighs A LOT, especially after years of leaking heater cores that never dried out.

just for reference, my 88 duke , 5 speed weighs about 2600 lbs. w/o driver. JM

The mk3 MR2 curb weight is 2250lbs (approx.) Amazingly, It is around 550lbs less than the Fiero. That's like driving around with three 180 lb. passengers. Anyone know what makes the MR2 so light? If only the Fiero was as lightweight.

wow really really good thread. i'v been woundering how i can lighten my fiero to. i know that lotus someone mentioned up the thread is only 1650lbs and has 190 horse but doest the 1/4 mile in 12.7 smoking a stock mustang cobra that comes in 345 horse i think and does the 1/4 mile at 13.5 and weighs 3540 ish. so weight i would think would deffinatly play a big role in getting these cars to go fast. i'm doing a swap right now and i think i'm going to buy those lamborghini replica seats made from fiberglass and put those in there. should shave alittle weight. aslo going to see what i can get out behind the dash to. aslo going to go with aluminum rims. any one have any other suggestions for lightening these cars up?

brian

84fieroswap

How about a custom aluminum cradle? & swapping The steel bumpers with newer lightweight polycarbonate from another car?

quote Originally posted by Amida: How about a custom aluminum cradle? & swapping The steel bumpers with newer lightweight polycarbonate from another car?

Sure, that's possible. Or you could take a hint from the Z06 and use a magnesium cradle. Either way, all it takes is money.

Custom lightweight parts - that's easy.
Finding weight savings that don't cost thousands of dollars - that's hard.

Actually, there is a noticeable amount of weight to be shed from the interior. You don't necessarily need to gut it out to see a nice weight savings, either. You just need to swap in lighter parts. Some examples:

-- The stock carpet (with padding) weighs close to 40 lb. Aftermarket might weigh half as much, if that.
-- The stock seats (with rails) weigh ~35 lb each. You can buy racing seats from ebay that only weigh ~20lb each.
-- The rear console piece (the piece that covers the ECM) weighs 10 lb by itself. The rest of the console (including the skeleton) weighs about 10 lb more, for a total of 20 lb.
-- The dash (with ductwork) weighs about 13 lb. And the instrument panel weighs about 6-7 lb.

With aftermarket carpet and a pair of racing seats, you can probably lose around 50 lb. If you make a fiberglass console, you can drop another 10-15 lb. And instead of being stripped, you'll have a cool custom interior.

The dash and inner door skins are pretty lightweight. There's probably not much you can do to lighten them up, short of removing them. The instrument panel can be replaced with a digital gauge panel. But that would be an expensive way to save a couple pounds.

[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 11-01-2006).]

that's why i'm thinking about taking out the carpet. i know going for light weight is a lost cause, because on the particular car i'm thinking about i've added quite a few fiberglass body pieces (irm rocker scoops, chin spoiler, modded wing, etc.) and my wheel choice wasn't the lightest. if i can drop 50 or so lbs by taking out the carpet and hunting for a deal on lighter seats, maybe i can at least offset what i've added in other places.

quote Originally posted by Amida: The mk3 MR2 curb weight is 2250lbs (approx.) Amazingly, It is around 550lbs less than the Fiero. That's like driving around with three 180 lb. passengers. Anyone know what makes the MR2 so light? If only the Fiero was as lightweight.

MR2 is a smaller car.
It is 153" long and 66" wide where the Fiero is 165" long and 69" wide.

The 1984 Fiero with a 4-cyl is only 2450lbs with a cast iron 2.5L engine and the Mk3 MR2 has a 1.8L aluminum engine.
The Fiero has in itegral (sp?) roll bar built into the roof, The MR2 is a convertable, no roll bar and no roof.
The Fiero is a 5-star crash rating and the MR2 is a 3-star.

Between the 1984 4-cyl Fiero and the 2001 MR2 is only 200 lbs. Just being wider and longer plus the heavier engine is what takes up the weight.

This is why when they would do side by side comparisons of the earlier MR2's and Fiero's, The MR2 had the smaller/lighter car advantage over the Fiero.
The Fiero was more in line with the 80's RX-7's than with the MR2's.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Steel space frame.

Out of curiousity... Anyone ever weighed just this much?

How much does the naked space frame weigh all by itself?

-Bruce

NO CRADLE [or motor trans ect] 88 formula
no seats windsheild gas tank wheels rad
no quite bare frame but close 950lbs at the scrap yard scale

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

hey black tree, good info thanks. you gave me some more idea's. does anyone know which car would have lighter bumpers that could be switched with the fiero? great thread.

brian

quote Originally posted by ray b: NO CRADLE [or motor trans ect] 88 formula no seats windsheild gas tank wheels rad no quite bare frame but close 950lbs at the scrap yard scale

Thanks ray.

Did this Formula have all the plastic body panels still on, or had they been removed?

-Bruce

quote Originally posted by Amida: How about a custom aluminum cradle? & swapping The steel bumpers with newer lightweight polycarbonate from another car?

wasnt there a factory aluminum cradle being made for the 89 model?

I have yet to put my car on scales. But i just swapped in an Ln3 3800, removed the deteriorated insulation from the engine compartment (not much weight at all), cut out the bottom portion of the trunk to run exhaust, and removed the padding from the carpeting (that was a good 15lbs) the battery is now up front as well, and i have no spare, or jack. I also dont have a front or rear bumper...just the plastic body parts. My thoughts on making the cars faster is lightwheight rims, and lighten the drivetrain...the Unsprung weight is what kills the acceleration. And going for a lightweight flywheel, and halfshafts. I dont remeber the exact rule of thumb for unsprung weight, but i think it was something like 4 fold. So if you lighten your rims 5 pounds each, thats shaving like taking off 80 pounds...same goes for brake rotors. Thats why you can buy lightweight lugnuts (i think thats going a little overboard, but for the full race...or bragging rights) Other than that...i think we need to start making carbon fiber hoods, trunks and a roofs...the plastic panels are already considerably light. Well theres my two cents.

quote Originally posted by FTF Engineering: Thanks ray. Did this Formula have all the plastic body panels still on, or had they been removed? -Bruce

no hood , rear bumper cover, lites ,
most of the body still on the car but those bits are lite
heavyest bits still on were the doors
car came to me half striped with no title

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

Anybody weigh a bare cradle? How much lighter would it be if it were made of aluminum?

Well, grand prixs save 21 lbs by switching to the aluminum cradle. It would be similar savings.

According to page 22 of the Pontiac Fiero Performance Portfolio, the Fiero chassis weighs around 600 pounds by itself. The body panels add another 175.

FWIW I weighed my stock 1988 Coupe on the local goverment scales. (They issue fines to truckers based on the weights they record so they have to be accurate )

The car weighed in at 2601 Lbs empty with about 1/2 tank of gas.

I didn't weight the front and back because I managed to fit the whole car on the scale.

------------------

1988 Fiero Coupe 2.5L (Written Off in an accident in 2006)
1990 Trans Am GTA 5.7L

Bump.

I recently bought an 87GT with a 3.4 TDC from a local guy. While searching the archives I found this. He weighed it.
https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Archives/Archive-000001/HTML/20060206-2-067600.html
Info added to the list above.

Seems the 3.4 DOHC is not a heavy motor like everyone says it is...

[This message has been edited by SCCA FIERO (edited 11-10-2006).]