Hi All, I own a 86 GT

I jumped a ford truck, took about 15 minutes to get him going.
I leave that scene and go back to myold house to check the mail. Turn the car off get the mail come back...I put the key in the ignition turned it and the dash lights were on fine...I go to start it at that point and the car loses all power and of course doesnt start.

I have to car towed to my new house and then jump it with my roomates car, it started almost imediately and i drove it for like twenty minutes to recharge.. the batt gauges on dash was showing 13volts while i'm driving around

I get back home shut the car down then try to restart again i get the dash lights coming up but when i turn the key to start I loss all power. I turn the key back then try again and again no power no nothing at all.

I go to meijer here in michigan to get a brand new battery put it in. Go to start the car and the dash lights came on then tried to start and lost all power again. Turned the key back and tried to start and NO POWER no lights no nothing as if there was no battery in the car.

All the connections on the batt are tight, I checked all fuses on drivers side and they are fine.

Alternator is brand new and installed a month ago...

Any ideas at all? I hope I explained this correctly....is it a fusible link???? Not well versed so hope you guys can help

New Screen name not entirely new to board thanks

Scott in Ann Arbor Michigan

It's a loose connection somewhere. Sounds to me like on the battery itself, but you said they were tight. Are they clean? Check (remove, clean & tighten) all connections between the battery & starter, the battery & ground, battery & feed to the car, & engine ground (engine to body). That should do it.
~ Paul
aka "Tha Driver"

Driver thanks for your response.....
I just went outside and turned the key halfway and nothing and of course car wouldn't start either.
I took off the cables and put them back on again jumped in the car turned the key and the dash lights were on but then when i tried to start absolutely no power. I turned the key back and tried again and no power no dash lights no nothing.

Check the ground cables.
The battery ground attaches to the corner of the front head, nearest the right hinge. You also should have a copper braid running from the right hinge to the engine. Check the small black wire from the battery connector, where it connects to the frame, in front of the shock tower.

Also check the fuseable links. They connect to the terminal between the battery and the shock tower.
The big one that goes forward and disappears under the right side of the body is the one that feeds the whole rest of the car. It has caused me problems in the past. Killed my car dead as a hammer in the middle of downtown ATL.

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Raydar
88 4.9 Formula IMSA Fasback..........................88 3.4 coupe -soon to be something other than red

Read Nealz Nuze! Praise the Lowered!

you did clean the battery connectors ? tight doesn;t cut it, they like to get a layer of corrosion that will act like that.
if that isn't it, you may have blown your alternator, a common thing when jumping another car, especially if their battery is stone dead. alternators don;t like charging a dead battery.
try removing the heavy red wire form your alternator (the one on the stud in the back). put a charger on the battery overnight to top it off. car should start then. let it sit a few hours alt still disconnected, verify it still starts. put a votlmeter on the battery and try touching the red wire back to the lug on the alternator, if you get a spark, and you see a noticable voltage drop at the battery,your alternator is likely shot.

You've probably burned up your alternator, that's a classic scenario that I'm familiar with from my automotive repair sales days. " I gave someone a jump yesterday or whenever, and now my car won't start.". When you jump start another vehicle especially something as load demanding as a truck it puts a tremendous load on your charging system which is probably already running at about 20-25 amps load with your engine running, then add to that the drain of his battery plus the load that's going to sky rocket his total amp draw on your system when he turns the key and his starter kicks in to spin his probably V8 motor over. You are getting closer and closer to a direct grounding load on your ~105 amp alternator which is being asked to produce a total amp output well over its peak output.

You'll probably find that the battery wire on the back of the alternator has probably burned through and is no longer connected to the alternator. When I give a jump start my car is either not running or I unplug the side terminal from the alternator to turn it off so all they get is battery power. Some people have become upset with me for not cranking and reving my engine to give them a jump, but that's because they are not aware of what I described above. I have seen starter amp draws in excess of 100 amps, and after repeated start attempts you can be sure your alternator wires are good and hot from the amp load.

replace both your neg and pos battery cables especailly if they are old. They may look fine on the outside, yet be very corroed on the inside near the battery and you cant see it. All that jumping may simply burnt what few good strands were still there. You're always taking a chance when you give someone a jump. Also as mentioned, could be just a poor connection to ground, again the extra load of jumping mayhave jsut made it worse.

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[IMG]



Trueleo.com/fiero.htm
RSpiderII@aol.com

What Joseph said.

Get a voltmeter and check your battery voltage before and after you get it started. If it does not go over 13 volts when running the alternator is cooked.

Side post 101..............THEY SUCK! If it is an AC Delco battery, most likely the inside of the screw in terminal has separated, I have seen this MANY times. Also, corrosoin is somthing that is VERY hard to clean on a side post. I suggest a new battery (go have it tested, OUT of the vehicle), and then act accordingly.

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carpe diem

I missed some important bits of info in your first post, there is a bad connection probably caused by a wire contact overheating somewhere.

You installed a new battery after the initial incident so that should rule out a poor terminal connection.
It takes longer than 20 minutes to kill a fresh battery with a bad alternator, unless you bought a remaned battery so it's probably fine.
Once a fusible link goes that's it, you'll loose power until it's fixed so that's probably not it since the car started when the battery was replaced.
Usually when the power suddenly shuts off on a start attempt it's the battery cable connection at the terminal, you may have an internal cable break, or possibly an intermittent fusible link responding to cable movement.

Have some one manipulate the cables at the battery while you try to start the car since it responded when you did something with the cable; jump started and cranked when you installed the new battery. If that doesn't work after check the battery cable connections at both ends, by-pass the positive cable with a connetion to the starter and see if you get it to wake up that way.

[This message has been edited by Joseph Upson (edited 07-09-2007).]

I missed something too, like the installing the new battery part sorry....

Okie dokey, thanks for all your responses........

This is the deal as of now

I replaced both batt cables and its doing the same thing.....

There is a new batt in there now to.

When i connect the cables to the battery i have to move the cable around just to get power to the lights then when i attempt to start all goes dead..there is nothing...odd thing is that when i take key out and put back in there is no power at all even though the cables are connected.

The only way to re-establish power is to tinker with the batt cable till i see the lights go on. I just find it incredibly odd that when i try to start the car the is no power at all and when i turn the key back there are no lights no power no nothing....

I checked for corrosion and changed the cables however still the same thing going on.

Batt is brand spankin new along with the remaned alternator.....

Funny thing is when i jump it it starts right up!

I just don't get it......

Sorry for not explaining things clearly in my earlier posting I apologize for that and really appreciate you guys helping out thus far.

Any other feedback is totally appreciated...

i think you just answered your wn question. if fiddling with the cable causes the lights to go on or off then you have a bad connection somewhere. its possible you have a bum battery or you damaged the terminals when installing it or you have faulty wiring somewhere else along the lines. id take a better look at your battery and cable connections. did you clean up the engine block,starter post, and any other connection or simply swap out new cables?

Have you looked at the connector by the C500? Its the one by the battery where the red lead coming off the positive battery cable connects.

Where does the positive battery cable go in a stock Fiero? To the alternator, to the 2-post connector block thing, or to the starter solenoid? If it goes to the starter solenoid, possibly a bad connection there since if you wiggle the battery wire it's moving that connection...? Just throwing out ideas.. Not even sure if that's how it's run. Been a while since I worked on a stock Fiero... Edit: Ugh, I should have re-read the above post... LOL Sounds like it goes to the 2-post thingy...

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Bob Williams
Working on the next 3800 swap - it works!!!

[This message has been edited by Riceburner98 (edited 07-09-2007).]

Since I/we can't see it and anything could have been done (hacked) to it in the past 20 years here are a few things that might be possible in various situations.

Where are you putting the jumper cables when you start it. Is the negative jumper on the body, engine, or battery of the Fiero? Maybe when you replaced the bat to engine cable another ground wire fell off to the body. Are the engine to body grounds still intact? Is it possible the battery cables are backwards on the battery (don't laugh it has happened with bad results)?

Do you have a voltmeter? What is the voltage before and after you jump it at the battery. It may help us help you.

The positive cable goes to the starter solenoid. The small lead wire off the positive cable goes to the 2 post block under the C500. The alternator charging wire connects there too. It feeds the car power directly from the alternator as well as charges the battery.

Check your grounds from the engine to the car if you haven't already. You keep loosing power because the amp load during start up attempt is overheating the short in your system and causing it to open.

Don't forget that it may not be the positive cable. in fact I would suspect this is a ground issue, when you jump a car most people put the neg on the block, not the battery.
On the negative battery connector, there is a small black wire that goes to the fenderwall over the wheel. that connection is notorious for corroding and getting loose.
one easy safe way to see if it is a ground issue, clip a jumper cable to the battery neg, and the other end to the block, if it starts, you have 2 problems: that balck wire to the fenderwall is not connected, and the braided ground from the front of the block to the hinge plate is also broken

I learned NEVER to jump start another car the hard way. I will hook up cables and charge someones battery to see if it will start. But I disconnect before the key is turned. Worked fine in the old days, but cars have too much electronic stuff that can mess up now.

I was also going to suggest checking the nut on the red wire under the c500. I can move when your mess with the cables and be very intermittant.

im with the burnt alt exact senario when mine went out. to the tee

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The Mad Scientist
86' Se 4sp - converting into a 3800 sc II GT
alive again

There is a Diode in the original alt that is prone to blowing when jump starting another vehicle. Replace it with a CS-130 because I have jump started my girlfriends rx7, my friends rx7 turbo, and my fathers 4.3 s10 MANY TIMES and I will actually help random people broken down on the road. But your volt meter will show volts but there is very few if any amps to it.