quote Originally posted by jstricker: Yes, let's turn down the sarcasm. You start. do you own stocks in Archie's business or are you just in love with him ? If you took 30 minutes to do a little research on your own, you'd know why people are so defensive. I wasn't being the least bit sarcastic previously. You have come here stating how bad you felt the kit was. It's old, outdated, and you could do better. Fine. Do it. Advertise it. Sell it. Support it. Put Archie out of business. If yours is better than Archie's and I ever desire another SBC Fiero, I'll even buy one from you. Seriously. Oh, but you don't want to do that, do you? Tell me, instead of coming on a forum, did you ever just call Archie and list all of these deficiencies along with suggestions on how to make them better? Type them up like you did here and send them to him via email or snail mail? I didn't think so. Oh, but you shouldn't have to do that. Everything should just be delivered by UPS at your door, the day after you order it, exactly the way you would have designed it, and you shouldn't even have to go buy a nut or bolt. (you want to see sarcastic???) You want an opinion, fine. Don't buy an Archie kit. They haven't changed that much and he doesn't need the aggravation. You talk about HIS integrity. I've done a lot of business with him over the years and I can certainly vouch for his integrity. But because he doesn't bend over and kiss your butt, you say "From my little dealings with him anyway. It only takes about 30 secs to sum up a man's integrity. Even on the phone. " That's your basis for judging a man's ingegrity? I hope you never get called for jury duty. Archie's not an investor in the forum. The forum is owned in whole by Cliff Pennock and is based in the Netherlands. If Cliff decides to tomorrow, he can pull the plug and walk away. I don't think he will, because that would be out of character for him, but I don't know that he and Archie have ever met. If they have, it was just to exchange hellos at some show somewhere over the years. That's it for me, I'm outta here. Do what you like, it's a free country. The kit hasn't changed enough to suit you. Don't buy one, you won't be happy. John Stricker

What is wrong with you ? I joined here to get opinions other than the person selling me the product. Really.....is there something wrong with you mentally that I should know about ?

As for others I have started to research a little bit about the swaps and I'm not sure what I'm going to do yet. I do know that I regret this as being my first topic on this forum. What is wrong with people where they can't have an opinion and speak their mind on a public forum ? How can an opinion be wrong ? Do any of you know what DD or "due diligence" is ? I'm just doing my DD here and I get all of this "go out and start your own kit and sell it better than Archies" crap. "do it..you won't do it......oooh I bet you won't." What is that supposed to mean ?

Let me make it clear: I AM NOT GOING TO MAKE MY OWN KIT I JUST WANT INFORMATION !!! Geez. It's not that big of a deal. If there are problems with the kit, step up and state them. If not then tell me what I did wrong on my install. I don't think I did much wrong on my install but to make it better than the person selling them. I obviously didn't make this up now did I ? Some of you should go back and reread my post that started this topic. For those of you using common sense and the absence of personal belief or commitment to a certain kit builder, thank you. For the kit builder (if that is really you) thank you and I hope you read everyone's opinions to better your kit. Including mine.

Just a few thoughts from someone with a V8 archie kit in progress. I purchased the master kit from archie several years ago and would do so again. However, I also have some issues with the kit. First let me say that Archie has always been available and helpful with any questions I had. However I have two issues with the kit. The video is VHS and has many sections where the quality was poor or missing. I would also like to see more details on carbed projects.
Second, the exhaust kit had several issues. One of the pipes from the header had an interferance condition with the cradle [which archie replaced when I contacted him Thanks...] but the 90 degree bend pipes are unaceptable. The bends when cut to fit without the trunk removed are too generous. The correct position to mate with the down pipe places the joint in the deformed radius section. I am afraid that I will have to find a local shop to form new pipes.

In summary, I would recommend Archie's kit with the caveat that many things presented are "guidelines" and you will make the assembly your own by doing things to suit your needs and desires.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: What is wrong with you ? I joined here to get opinions other than the person selling me the product. Really.....is there something wrong with you mentally that I should know about ?

For someone who didn't come here to bash anyone or troll, you have a strange way of demonstrating it.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: If not then tell me what I did wrong on my install.

Just a guess, but you didn't follow Archie's instructions. You deviated to correct what you saw as flaws, and in doing so may have only created more problems. People have suggested you make your own kit because you come on here clearly stating what you consider to be obvious flaws and how you had to correct them. Well, if it's that clear cut, why would you even consider another Archie kit? For someone with as much fabrication experience as you claim, you certainly don't need a swap kit. An adapter plate at most should be enough.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: I obviously didn't make this up now did I ?

We have no way of knowing other than your word, and since you just signed up, we really have nothing other than the benefit of the doubt that you're telling the truth. But you could dispell any of that skepticism by giving Archie the info to look up your purchase. Or posting pics or video of your car and the improvements you've made.

Many people on here have started with a basic kit and customized it to their own desires. There's nothing wrong with that. Feel free to share the improvements you've made; however, when most of your discussion is 'why did Archie do it wrong?' and 'do you have a mental problem?' you're not going to get much support. How about a discussion more along the lines of "here's some areas where I improved on Archie's kit" and offer suggestions on how to implement these improvements. I think you'll get a lot more positive response with that.

Any bets on how long it'll take this thread to land in the trash can? By page 3?

Whew. Just a wee bit of anger in this thread. I've looked on Archie's website, and it looks like a creditable kit. I haven't any personal experience with kits like this, just minor tinkering. That being said, logically, nothing will ever be completely perfect. Comes with the territory of doing it yourself I suppose.

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1986 SE V6, stock, auto, fastback. GT Trim and Body panels.

Troll? Read this.

Like a few others, I have no dogs in this race. BUT, I would like to say that I have read this post over twice.
From start to finish, twice. I'm not a mechanic, nor have I bought anything from Archie, but I have talked to the man a few times.
Archies is without a doubt a proffesional, he is direct, and VERY,VERY busy. He also is willing to answer questions from a guy who may or may not become a customer about his kits. ( I asked about his interior, V8, battery tray and asked if The WHITE GHOST could be remade for the cost he sold it)

Here's the skinny, GTquick, you did nothing wrong here, but just as you have misunderstood Archies directness for rudeness, the same has happened to you here in a slightly different manner. And to clear the air a bit, you are welcome here.

Jstricker, i'm not going to bash you about rushing to Archies defence. You did the same as anyone would who feels that a friend, collegue or mentor has been attacked. But just as I said above, I think you misunderstood what GTquick was trying to say.

Lets try not flame this post and let people discuss the OP questions and opinions.

Thanks all
Michal

I suggest a Northstar. You have control over the build quality and there is no install kit needed. Bolts up to the fiero transmission and uses a fiero flywheel. Spec even sells an aluminum flywheel with the northstar boltpattern. This is what I did after having a bad deal with Archie. I had an LT1 for my fiero but had to move on.

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Buy a fiero, become a mechanic
3.4 dohc Install
Sub Install
Northstar Install

GT Quick, welcome. You probably are a nice fella who's worth having around here and -- like we all have done in life -- may have said more than was fair saying. Time to fix this? Let me explain.

- I was NOT going to read further than your initial post but then I got to the "chop top" part and it became obvious that the stated objective (get feedback) was not the real one, at least not consciously.
- Being the owner of a 1986 Notchie with an IDuke myself, I reread it all and then scratched my head. Whoa! I had wanted a V8 (from Archie) at one time...but the forums feedback made it clear that I would loose some things I like about my lighter car. (So, I am waiting for a lighter, peppy option. Still, ohhh that glorious V8 torque!)
- I also learned that Archie was it, if I still want the V8. (And yes, I heard that Archie could be a bit rough around the edges at times. I remember thinking., who wouldn't! He must be getting calls all the time. Commendably, he answers himself most of the time.) As imperfect as his products may turn out to be for some situations, he is there. For a V8 kit, I would buy from an outfit like Archie's. If only he chose to adopt an additional nickname, something like ArchieEcotec!!!
- Anyway, later on you add "I can see a guy like Archie saying "buy it or don't buy it I don't care". From my little dealings with him anyway. It only takes about 30 secs to sum up a man's integrity. Even on the phone." And I think, "Something just doesn't add up here... again it seems FEEDBACK is not really the objective"
- Then, you add above (among other things):

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: Do any of you know what DD or "due diligence" is ? I'm just doing my DD here...

GT Quick, you wrote without actually doing the "due diligence" you mention. All it takes is asking (without agendas) and searching the bountiful archives. If a moron like me can do this, a bright kid like you can get mounds of useful information in no time.

If you want another Fiero, this forum can help. If not, then, we all wasted time. We all say things we should not have. It is very hard to deal with it properly but you may have it in you to proceed accordingly and we will all gain if you do.

---


Edit to add:
Kind of liked the sound of "ArchieEcotec" until I read my own posting...how about ArchieTec? Yeah, I know, no chance in...

[This message has been edited by Jdlog (edited 10-06-2007).]

quote Originally posted by aaronrus: I actually Majorly disagree with you here John, everything this guy has shared has been appropriate enough, he is sharing his experience with the Archie Kit, and to be honest, I always thought the kit was rather outdated, and it certainly isn't idiotproof. All the gripes this guy has about the kit are rather genuine and not the first time i have heard complaints about these issues( and wont be the last either ). As to Archie's demeanor over the phone, well, i called him ONCE ages ago when i was thinking about doing an SBC in my citation rather than the 4.9L caddy( the citation shares the same drivetrain and suspension in the front as the fiero has in the back ), and he was rather rude to me too. Maybe i caught him on a bad day, but that's no way to deal with customers. I asked him basic questions about his kit and he was put off even talking about it. I wasn't decided yet on my choice of engine, but wasn't sold on the idea of an SBC because of the weight, and his attitude made up my mind very quickly for me. I chose the caddy V8, and couldn't be happier, it maintained the integrity of the handling of the car while greatly increasing the acceleration. As far as his technical knoweledge goes, he certainly has a plethora of technical knoweledge, i guess he just doesn't feel like expressing it over the phone. Lately his posts in the forums have been less tech and more rubbish, especially his lurker e-thug battle with Darkhorizon over in the thread that Chuck started about his timeslips with his LT1 turbo setup. I personally think alot of the major players in this forum have fragile egos and they need to man up and stop being so sensitive. Don't get all bent out of shape when you or someone from your little clique gets called out on something. And i will give Archie this much credit, he is not getting bent out of shape about this, because i'm sure he's heard it before.

I am a Technician at a GM dealership. GM mass produces cars. I feel that a hand built car can have better quality, but they never do. Conversion vans are junk. Limo's are junk. I still feel that a hand built car can be a better car. Is a hand built Ferrari a good car? I am not sure. They have too much clout. How about a Panoz? you see my point. I feel I am an above average tech and I know why every nut or bolt needs to be in place. I know the reason why the proper fastener are used in the location instead of hardware store nuts and bolts. It is the details and appearance. The dealer ship I work at does alignments for a good sized Corvette repair and restoration shop. If I had my $150K Corvette done at this shop I would sue. The quality in the detail is bad really bad. All the wrong fastener all the time and they have an excuse every time.
So is a hand built car better than a mass produced car?
On an assembly line they can not throw what ever in a car. Except Excalibur.
I think I would say a superformance is a hand built car, but it has an assembly line.
http://www.superformance.com/factory.aspx

Can Archie build a great car? I would say yes he is capable.
Can Archie design great parts? I would say that he can.
The big question is how much would it cost to have Archie spend the time for all the high quality detail?
Is the cost of the kit purchased from Archie comparable to the quality?
Are all the pieces billet and polished. NO. If they were would the kit cost more?

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: Are you THE Archie ? If so then no offense my friend but if I wanted to contact you about this already I would have done so. I came here first to poll the people like I said. snip

What you wanted to do is come here and complain, not get opinions, just get people to swing from your nuts and turn this into an archie bashing thread. I have never purchased a archie kit, nor am I interested in doing a SBC conversion so I'm not in love with archie.

quote For the money I paid Archie it wasn't worth it.

Case proven.

quote To be honest with you I don't think people know any better

So you're calling all his other customers stupid?

quote I just want input.

No you don't, you came in here like a $hit chucking ape trying to stir crap.

quote It only takes about 30 secs to sum up a man's integrity

another character jab showing your intentions. Took you 30 seconds, took me one post to read you.

quote Just noticeing in 30 posts I only got one welcome.

Now you're jabbing at the whole forum. Troll. Hi, welcome. Now STFU.

quote What is wrong with you ? I joined here to get opinions other than the person selling me the product. Really.....is there something wrong with you mentally that I should know about ?

again, you're a liar. And now you're insulting others.

Dude, you come here saying "I don't want to bash anyone" then you use sarcasm and flat out attacks. You're a troll, wouldn't suprise me if you were a reg of RFT. "Oh I don't know what a troll is" Again, liar. These guys have a lot more patience than me. I'm not a nut swinger of archie, but I hate people coming in here just to stir up crap is what you are doing.

quote Originally posted by RandomTask: again, you're a liar. And now you're insulting others. Dude, you come here saying "I don't want to bash anyone" then you use sarcasm and flat out attacks. You're a troll, wouldn't suprise me if you were a reg of RFT. "Oh I don't know what a troll is" Again, liar. These guys have a lot more patience than me. I'm not a nut swinger of archie, but I hate people coming in here just to stir up crap is what you are doing.

Task, you are being a jackass. Seriously, grow up. I am a VERY discerning and critical person, but even I didn't get any of those impressions from the poster of this thread. Stop making a mountain out of a molehill.

[This message has been edited by aaronrus (edited 10-06-2007).]

I'm a Archie customer, purchased a master auto kit a few years ago. And happy I did. I'm happy he offers this service. I see no other company out there offering kits for engine swaps of any kind. You can purchase parts and pieces but not kits. I don't understand how the parts in Archie's kit get outdated, no matter who makes them they are still adaptors and mounts. What GT Quick did was go out and replace some hardware parts with name brand summit stuff , both work the same, some just cost more, or look prettier! It's not Archies fault how the car handles or runs after you build it, he just supplies parts so you can.
JMO. and welcome to the forum, where have you been all this time?
Good Luck on your next project
Gary

I would say he is actually asking questions of the Forum, in addition to telling his story.

Basically he wants to know:

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: Have any other swap people here had these problems ? I mean I don't want to get off on the wrong foot but I'm wanting to "poll the people" here to see if I am the only one that had to redesign the V8 Archie kit to get it to function correctly ? For the amount of money spent.....I want your opinions if the kit has changed any or are these problems still there ?

Basically, was his experience with the V8Archie kit typical or not?

Is the kit really outdated? It obviously functions, but is it actually a good design?

Also the impact on handling, will V8 installs necessarilly cripple the Fiero's performance?

I don't have the kit, so can't answer his questions. I do understand he may be frustrated if he feels he paid for a duct tape V8 install kit with only a few real parts, hence the background story. Sure the kit will make it fit, but for the money you would hope it would fit well.

I personally am a Fan of the 3800SC swap, if I do I swap myself this is the route I'll be going.

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www.FieroDomain.com
Over 120 Fiero Links, Articles, Images, Diagnostics

"If any car is both the parade and the rain, it is the Fiero"

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 10-06-2007).]

My question is "What part did he redesign"
Do you take the turn differently because you have a 200# passenger with you? Or you stand on it like you always do?
Thanks Gary

[This message has been edited by GKDINC (edited 10-06-2007).]

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: What is wrong with you ? I joined here to get opinions other than the person selling me the product. Really.....is there something wrong with you mentally that I should know about ?

Not that I'm aware of. Take a look at my feedback. That came from HELPING people, not barging in and bashing them, accusing them of mental problems, calling anyone that bought and is satisfied with their kit from Archie stupid, or calling Archie stupid, all the while making unsubstantiated claims and acting like you just are so innocent and don't know any better. You did all of those things.

And for 3K all I used was the adapter plate and the pulley.

No, all you used UNCHANGED was the adapter plate and pulley. You used the rest of it as well. Funny you never mentioned the water pump drive or electric pump. Whatever.

I have built a few hotrods and engines myself ranging from SCCA cars to drag cars to show cars to lowriders.

Still waiting for some pictures, links, specifics, anything. You make wild assumptions about Archie and his customers, but we must take you, an unknown, at face value? I think not.

I am just trying to see if they have been addressed before I drop another 3K on a kit that I thought was primitive in design

I answered this question for you at least twice and yet you keep coming back, a sure sign of someone with an agenda other than what you're stating. I'll say it once more for the hearing/reading impaired:

THE "PROBLEMS" YOU IDENTIFIED ARE FOR THE MOST PART STILL THERE. DON'T BUY THE KIT. YOU DIDN'T LIKE IT LAST TIME, YOU WON'T LIKE IT THIS TIME. IF YOU DO DECIDE TO GO SBC, USE A STICK SHIFT AND ALUMINUM HEADS & INTAKE TO SAVE WEIGHT AND THE ECONOMY KIT, THEN YOU CAN DO WHATEVER THE HECK YOU WANT WITH THE REST.

Hopefully, this time, you actually read it. But I doubt it because you didn't really want an answer anyway.

How many times can a business offer grumpy customer service and expect repeat customers ? That's just poor business sense or stupidity.

So Archie is a poor businessman and/or stupid. Never mind the fact he's outlasted all the rest, and has just moved into new facilities in the last couple of years. You, of course, can do better. Well, to be honest, maybe you can. Archie isn't perfect. But he's also not a poor businessman and he's definitely not stupid as you claim.

To be honest with you I don't think people know any better. Either that or I'm just one picky mofo.

And Archie's customers are stupid too. You forgot option 3. You're just trolling.

Thank you jscott. And to jstricker....do you own stocks in Archie's business or are you just in love with him ? Yes people do seem defensive here and I was not expecting that.

Another personal slam to me and it appears you did NOT due your "DD", at least with regard to this subject at PFF. There's a button at the top of the page that says "search". You might try it sometime, there's a wealth of information there.

As stated above for a man with no competition and the only other builder of a kit went out of business..........why has he not solved alot of simple problems ?

There have been several kits out over the years, most of them copies of Archie's. As for why aren't the "simple" problems solved, maybe because they're only really problems to YOU and/or they're so simple most people don't have to go on a rant about them.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: As for others I have started to research a little bit about the swaps and I'm not sure what I'm going to do yet. I do know that I regret this as being my first topic on this forum. What is wrong with people where they can't have an opinion and speak their mind on a public forum ? How can an opinion be wrong ? Do any of you know what DD or "due diligence" is ? I'm just doing my DD here and I get all of this "go out and start your own kit and sell it better than Archies" crap. "do it..you won't do it......oooh I bet you won't." What is that supposed to mean ?

Good luck finding ANY kit for any of them. WCF sells parts for some of them and if you think Archie's customer service is bad you ain't seen nothing yet until you deal with them. Ed Parks used to sell 4.9 kits but he quit doing that except to just a few, experienced installers of his kits that he trusts.

If you really need an explanation of what you wrote "do it..you won't do it......oooh I bet you won't." which you put in quotes (not sure why, nobody said that to quote, but whatever, it's your fantasy) then I'll spell it out for you.

You have a big mouth. You come in calling names, making accusations, and throwing out unsupported claims. If you can do it better, fine, do it. As another poster pointed out, but you ignored, tone is everything. Your tone is one of a troll.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: Let me make it clear: I AM NOT GOING TO MAKE MY OWN KIT I JUST WANT INFORMATION !!! Geez. It's not that big of a deal.

What a shock. You know everything is wrong. Archie's customers don't know any better. Archie is a bad businessman and an idiot. But you just want information. What information? You've got what you asked for and keep coming back.

DON'T BUY THE KIT!! YOU WON'T LIKE IT!!

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: If there are problems with the kit, step up and state them. If not then tell me what I did wrong on my install. I don't think I did much wrong on my install but to make it better than the person selling them. I obviously didn't make this up now did I ? Some of you should go back and reread my post that started this topic. For those of you using common sense and the absence of personal belief or commitment to a certain kit builder, thank you. For the kit builder (if that is really you) thank you and I hope you read everyone's opinions to better your kit. Including mine.

What you did wrong was not follow the instructions because you think you knew better. Maybe you did, maybe you didn't. Either way, you didn't do it the way the kit was designed. That's your choice, but you wanted to know what you did wrong and there you go.

As far as you "obviously not making this up", how do we know? What have you offered to substantiate that you ever even owned a kit? Archie came in and asked who you where and when you bought it and you said basically that you didn't want to talk to him. Huh? That's really productive.

Troll away, grasshopper, troll away.

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by jstricker: WCF sells parts for some of them and if you think Archie's customer service is bad you ain't seen nothing yet until you deal with them.

quote Originally posted by jstricker: You come in calling names, making accusations, and throwing out unsupported claims. If you can do it better, fine, do it.

This is about the time I would type something about practicing what you preach, but these are your words, not mine.

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Recanizin' Flat-Buns Since 2001

Eric Nelson
Internet Sales Manager
Power Ford Valencia
nelsone@autonation.com

Sigh. As you wish. Do you really want me to pull up all the dates, emails, etc.......................

Your conduct with customers is indefensible.

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by Chicken McNizzle: This is about the time I would type something about practicing what you preach, but these are your words, not mine.

You will get no where on this Forum talking bad about the one and only V-8 kit out there. There are vendors that are not to be talked about or you will get bashed for doing so, learned that years ago.

Do yourself a favor and drop the OLD SCHOOL V-8 swap and step into the present with a nice 3800SC/65E or LSX swap. Times have changed, its just some have decided to live in the past.

Where in Tx are you? Anywhere near the Dallas area?

You want advice and input? Okay here is some advice and input. Like I said in a previous post I purchased a master build kit from Archie in June of this year for my 84. Could the kit be updated? Yes it could. But even if Archie updated the kit the cost would not remain the same and it still would not fit everybodys expectations. Everybody has their own way of modifying things to suit there own needs. I should know, because I did modifications to the kit to accept my needs. I don't know what happend to the install you did, but I can relate to the fact that you had high hopes of your Fiero once the conversion was done, and it seems like it was a big let down for you. I think it was you that mentioned Archie should get a tech line. How many times have you called a company up to ask a question and it takes 15 minutes of pushing buttons on your phone just to talk to a live person? Then the representative gets his book of protocol out to answer your question. Being a fellow hotrodder you of all people should know that it would be best to talk with the designer of the product. Since Archie does this day in and day out would'nt you rather speak with someone who has his hands dirty doing the work rather than someone that probably has never even seen the kit? You have to remember this kit was invented for your average novice mechanic to do the install.
I think you got off on the wrong foot in the forum. I hope the fellow members here are willing to overlook this and move on. Remember we are all here for one main reason.. Our love for the Fiero!!! I may have came accross a bit harsh in my previous post and I am sorry if I took your post the wrong way.
Welcome to our Loving Forum.

well said Craig

quote Originally posted by Xanth: Basically he wants to know: Basically, was his experience with the V8Archie kit typical or not?

If these are what he actually is looking for, Here are my answers:

From the many I talked to before I went with a V-8 and my personal experience after the V-8 went in, I would say "no" his experience is not "typical".

quote Originally posted by Xanth: Is the kit really outdated? It obviously functions, but is it actually a good design?

I really don't think "outdated" would be correct. Although the SBC has changed over the years, Archie has modified his kits to keep up with present engines. It would all depend on what engine you decided to use. LM1, LTx or LSx each have differences that the kits have addressed.

As for design, The kits have been around for many, many years and so far I have never heard of any of the kits failing. Usually a bad design would eventually show kit failures like the "Z" kit had issues with flywheel failures. As noted by many this was a design flaw.

quote Originally posted by Xanth: Also the impact on handling, will V8 installs necessarilly cripple the Fiero's performance?

I went from a V-6 auto to a V-8 4-spd on an already modified suspension and I had no handling issues. Although the suspension was modified a few years BEFORE the V-8 went in, I personally would not do any engine swap to a more powerful engine without at least updating or rebuilding the suspension. From the original post, he only changed things AFTER the swap.

It should be noted that many including Archie recommended to NOT use semi-solid mounts but he did them anyways. Considering the person who designed the kit and has been installing them for the past 22 years in many Fiero's should have some idea by now what is a good choice and what is not. Obviously he chose to ignore the voice of experience (which by his own account was confirmed from multiple sources) and this may have had an impact on the cars handling. Blaming the kit for short-comings because you ignored a recommendation and "modified 90% the kit" doesn't really say a lot for the person doing the install. It's like he wanted to build a better mouse trap and when it didn't work as expected he blamed the original mouse trap.

quote Originally posted by Xanth: I don't have the kit, so can't answer his questions. I do understand he may be frustrated if he feels he paid for a duct tape V8 install kit with only a few real parts, hence the background story. Sure the kit will make it fit, but for the money you would hope it would fit well.

As noted by a few different folks above who have actually used the kits, I would say the kits do fit well. Just because he has his own vision of what the kit "should be", does not make the kit bad, old, or outdated. It does appear he modified the kit and was unhappy with the results. The question is, Did his mods affect the function of the kit? Example: using semi-solid instead of solid mounting. What other "mods" did he do and how did they affect the original function?

Okay guys lets all calm down. As we all know Archie is a well-respected man in the line of aftermarket Fiero parts. But all this guy is doing is asking questions, I don't think he is bashing Archie, just asking questions and giving some input on Archies design. No offense GT Quick, but you are probably like me, if I spend money on something, I demand perfection. I am kind of a perfectionist, I like things to fit with ease and look like it could be there. In all honesty I think he is asking questions about a product and some of you are getting defensive about it, because you all think he is bashing Archie, because he is questioning his design. Now since very few people welcomed him, I would like to be one of those few to. Welcome GT Quick to the Fiero addiction and the Fiero community!!!!!!! So lets all calm down and offer him our assistance and advice, that is if we didn't scare him off.

My advice, Never mount semi-solid with pencil thin rod. You just asking for trouble!!!!!!

quote Originally posted by aaronrus: Task, you are being a jackass. Seriously, grow up. I am a VERY discerning and critical person, but even I didn't get any of those impressions from the poster of this thread. Stop making a mountain out of a molehill.

To quote Talldega Nights
"I'm saying this with the up most respect, but you're an idiot. . . but I said with the up most respect"
In my view, this guy was offered advice and opinions, he didn't like it, so he went as far as to blatently insult people. Then he has the audacity to criticize the entire forum. "Well only one person said 'welcome' " I am very discerning too, ask anybody. But he went passed bashing the product to bashing archies character, and I quoted that. In his original post, yes, it sounded like he was looking for advice. JStricker provided a LOT of info that I read also, with no jabs, then he starts jabbing at him? Then calling Archie stupid. JStricker has been nothing but cordial with him, but he's been back handing him on everything.

I agree with you on one sense, that yeah, I was being a brash and was being a jackass, but I don't deal with this sort of crap. He seemed to have posted here to not take the positive opinions, but only the ones that agreed with him.

[This message has been edited by RandomTask (edited 10-07-2007).]

I dont see any bad things in his original post, I think it should of been more of a "what did you do, I did this" thread, instead of a "this is all wrong".

You should have just explained things, and not messed around with bashing quality. A good troll (most say I am fairly trollesk) starts out good, and then sorta lays into the bashing after the fact.

quote Originally posted by darkhorizon: I dont see any bad things in his original post, I think it should of been more of a "what did you do, I did this" thread, instead of a "this is all wrong". You should have just explained things, and not messed around with bashing quality. A good troll (most say I am fairly trollesk) starts out good, and then sorta lays into the bashing after the fact.

+30 - And thats what I see him to have done. He started off well, then went ahead and started picking fights, insulting, and bashing character.

I'm not sure what some of you believe I am...a troll or whatever. Howabout a guy wanting to pretend he is in a group of people drinking coffee (or beer) and talking about Fiero engine swaps and their vendors ? I do get caught up in emotion from time to time but I have never seen any people act the way that some of you in this thread have. jstricker, I ignore you. I ignore you>infinity. It behooves me that people can be so mean when I am actually absorbing the advice and thread for what it is worth. It is my personal belief that adverse opinion makes the the world go round. Political correctness hides the truth. Ask yourselves here which are you ?

If I seem that I am egging on it is because I am now indisbelief that so many people can be against me when I came here stating actual FACTS that I had wrong with my Archie kit. I'm sorry...really sorry that I got sidetracked and lashed out at jstricker...but come on guys read the man's post..and his last post directed at me. And some others as well. If he is the Forum spokesperson for Archie or whatever then I renig on my registration right now. Leave me out. I'll go buy a Miata or something and do a TT V8 swap. I am searching now and have been searching for facts about the V8 swaps among others. I mean that's why I joined PFF. Not to be accused and bashed for asking a technical question in the technical section.

Some of these guys are replying like archie put their damn kids thru college. Why are people getting so damn worked up? This guy has gotten bashed a whole helluva lot more than you guys seem to say he did to archie. I've seen "nut swinging" on forums before, but this is rediculous.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: I'm not sure what some of you believe I am...a troll or whatever. Howabout a guy wanting to pretend he is in a group of people drinking coffee (or beer) and talking about Fiero engine swaps and their vendors ? I do get caught up in emotion from time to time but I have never seen any people act the way that some of you in this thread have. jstricker, I ignore you. I ignore you>infinity. It behooves me that people can be so mean when I am actually absorbing the advice and thread for what it is worth. It is my personal belief that adverse opinion makes the the world go round. Political correctness hides the truth. Ask yourselves here which are you ? If I seem that I am egging on it is because I am now indisbelief that so many people can be against me when I came here stating actual FACTS that I had wrong with my Archie kit. I'm sorry...really sorry that I got sidetracked and lashed out at jstricker...but come on guys read the man's post..and his last post directed at me. And some others as well. If he is the Forum spokesperson for Archie or whatever then I renig on my registration right now. Leave me out. I'll go buy a Miata or something and do a TT V8 swap. I am searching now and have been searching for facts about the V8 swaps among others. I mean that's why I joined PFF. Not to be accused and bashed for asking a technical question in the technical section.

I don't think you should close your membership because of this. I believe you were just asking questions and stating some facts that were wrong with your kit. If you look around at some of the members cars there are all types of V8 swaps, everything from a Chevy 350 to a Cadillac Northstar. I think the Northstar or the 4.9 liter Cadillac engines are the way to go, they have the power and the fuel mileage. The 4.9 liter Cadillac engine, I think, weights just a few more pounds than the stock 2.8 liter in the Fiero. So if you did do a 4.9 liter swap you would have a little more comfortable ride, than you have right now with the Chevy 350. Just ask some of the guys with the 4.9 liter engines in their Fiero's. I don't own a Fiero with a 4.9 liter engine in it, but I have ridden in one and it rides like a Fiero, just with alot more power, and a more aggresive sound. I am sorry you had such a bad start on the forum, but just look past this and stay with us. If I were you I would start another thread asking for advice on what swap would be best. There are a ton of people that will give you information and all kids of engine swaps. There is a guy on here that is putting in a BMW V12 in his Fiero. And there is another that was selling a Fiero with a Ford 302 in it. So as you can see there are all kinds of engines that are being put in Fiero's.

What "facts" are you searching for? Your initial post basically says you think his kit is crap and you want to know if others have had the same problem.

You want to know if Archie's kit still has the same problems you found with it. I would have to say yes. If you didn't like his kit before, you won't like it today. It's been updated and changed to accommodate new engines, etc., but you have a different idea about how it "should" be done. That's not necessarily bad - it just means you'll be fabricating most of your own parts rather than buying a kit you don't like.

Many times I've thought to myself, what the hell was GM thinking when they designed this car??? Sometimes things aren't designed the way WE might design them. There's too many possible variations and engineering compromises that have to be made for any kit to be perfect for everyone.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: I'm not sure what some of you believe I am...a troll or whatever. Howabout a guy wanting to pretend he is in a group of people drinking coffee (or beer) and talking about Fiero engine swaps and their vendors ? I do get caught up in emotion from time to time but I have never seen any people act the way that some of you in this thread have. jstricker, I ignore you. I ignore you>infinity. It behooves me that people can be so mean when I am actually absorbing the advice and thread for what it is worth. It is my personal belief that adverse opinion makes the the world go round. Political correctness hides the truth. Ask yourselves here which are you ? If I seem that I am egging on it is because I am now indisbelief that so many people can be against me when I came here stating actual FACTS that I had wrong with my Archie kit. I'm sorry...really sorry that I got sidetracked and lashed out at jstricker...but come on guys read the man's post..and his last post directed at me. And some others as well. If he is the Forum spokesperson for Archie or whatever then I renig on my registration right now. Leave me out. I'll go buy a Miata or something and do a TT V8 swap. I am searching now and have been searching for facts about the V8 swaps among others. I mean that's why I joined PFF. Not to be accused and bashed for asking a technical question in the technical section.

Honestly man, you came in here, asking for advice, people gave it to you, and then you started bashing other people. You did state facts, this is true, but at the same time, you were accusing people of having mental issues. Pennocks is actually quite a good place to come for information. Perhaps it would suit you to show a little more tact in what you type. I have nothing else to add to this thread other than what I've stated.

P.S. - Behoove means to suit well, not bewilderment as you used it. Just a friendly FYI.

What is wrong with you people ? Go forth and argue amongst yourselves. I'm done.

<music>"Whyyy canntt we be friends , why cant weee be firiendss"</music>

Ok from one noob to another, honestly ALMOST everyone in this thread went to far. And asking for less sarcasm while.............well..........giving sarcasm is childish. Archie is a professional and there probably are things that should be improved with the kit, but thats with any product; thats the measure of quality. However, to say the kit is outdated is redundant in itself. IT IS AN SBC KIT! LOL Like I mentioned the quality of parts and assembly is what gives flexability for improvement. Sorry if you feel like the responses that you received were more like attacks, as for the mere information you were seeking it seems the majority respect that Archie's kit is the premier "go-to" approach for SBC V8's, hence the verbal brick wall (or would it be a grammatical brick wall since everyone is actually typing) you recieved. It also seems that the majority feels you should also leave room for minor tweaking and adjusting and even slight modification with any kit, swap, or any thing other than factory because its just that, not factory. So in all what you posted originally was answered.

GT QUICK, the alternator bracket is a COMPLETE JOKE!!! I fully agree with you on this. The geometry of the mounting points on the bracket does not allow it to pivot correctly for adjustment. The bracket scissors itself to the screws when adjusting it. It should have been a two piece mount, that way the slots for adjustment could be manipulated for proper pivot. Also, it had to be spaced with six washers total to align properly! The funniest part about it was when the alternator needed to be replaced. Turns out instead of changing the design on the bracket to fit the alternator, one had to grind away at the alternator to fit it on the bracket. It was a horrid experience changing that alternator. I would never want to change an Archie kit alternator bracket again, it'll keep me up at night just thinking about it. The kit was early 2005 vintage if that will give you any indication of change.

I favor any engine that originally fits transversely in a donor car to transplant into a Fiero. I've never had any major problems with WCF. The only issue I had with them was a warped bottom plate on the front lower engine mount.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: If I seem that I am egging on it is because I am now indisbelief that so many people can be against me when I came here stating actual FACTS that I had wrong with my Archie kit. I am searching now and have been searching for facts about the V8 swaps among others. I mean that's why I joined PFF. Not to be accused and bashed for asking a technical question in the technical section.

The thing is there are many here who have used Archie's kit with great success. In your initial post you stated problems you had as "facts", but you are the one who admitted to "modifying 90% of the kit". The modifications you did were not "problems" but more or less your opinion of how to make things better by "redesigning the kit by my own standards." Like the semi-solid motor mounts. You were told not to use them but you went ahead "against the advice of many people including Archie" and then later complain that the kit caused handling issues.

You have gotten replies from at least 8 people who are using Archie's kit with success and disagree with your assessment of the kit.
One final note, There is a group of folks who use to be here that did nothing but bash anyone who has done a V-8 and although many in that group have been banned from here for a while, When someone comes out and starts out a thread bashing a V-8 kit many assume it is someone from the other group. Hence the replies you received may have seemed a little "strong".