Can anyone tell me if I need to get a longer right hand side axle for my v8 archie setup.I forgot to ask him and I dont want to bother him. This would be for the auto trans setup.
Thanks shawn

I do not know 100% for sure about the auto V8 swap, but I would guess that you are able to use stock length axles.

I have a manual trans with Archie's V8 kit and I use stock axle size.

quote Originally posted by luckesc4vett: Can anyone tell me if I need to get a longer right hand side axle for my v8 archie setup.I forgot to ask him and I dont want to bother him. This would be for the auto trans setup. Thanks shawn

Archie will be bothered if you DON'T ask him.....

Well I dont have to bother him now that I can ask all of you -lol
Anyhow I talk to him about the adapter plate I got on ebay and now im trying to get all the info I need to do this swap.
I need to get some more stuff from him just to complet it so I will be asking alot of ? over the winter so if anyone has done the auto set up chim in anytime.

Thanks guys

Not positive, but as far as I know, if you don't move the transmission you don't require new axles.
The regular SBC 5-speed swap uses stock axles. The LT1 5-speed shifts the engine and transmission over a little over 2" for clearance and that requires custom length axles on both sides.

Yes if you are doing the auto swap you will need the longer passenger side axle. I did a TH125 swap and I know this for a fact. It appears the factory axle will work, but under load and suspension travel the tripot will spin out of the housing and rip the boot. Then you will call Archie and he will tell you about the longer axle you need to buy.

I have a spare axle that you will need for this application. It is for sale in the for sale section. PM me if you want it. I no longer have a Fiero. That is if it is a TH125 swap. I have no comment on ony other auto swaps then the TH125 SBC Archie swap.

I can vouch about the LT1 axles.
Now that I have a G6 I am again using a custom set of axles. Another

I had to have a custom axle for the drivers side myself, cant remember if it was shorter or longer. Due to experience I can assure you T125 wont hold up to a V8 (4 times in 4K).

Yeah unless it gets beefed up they are short lived once you start playing with the V8's. If you can get one with the beefed up internals and a good set of intermediate bands then it might last a bit longer. I went through the first one quick and then installed the second one after getting it rebuilt. Then I sold the car.

Are you using the Fiero automatic transmission? If so, Archie's site clearly states that the stock axles work. In fact, he guarantees that if you buy his kit and break a stock axle, he will personally come and put a new one in. If you goto Archie's website, the instructions are pretty clear. You move the engine over about a half inch to the driver's side, but the stock axles still work. I just installed a V8 engine into my 1986 Fiero last weekend using the stock axles.

Ok so I can use the stock axles.Well thats good so what kind of problems did you have with your swap that I should look for.
Is there anything I should look out for or do.Im putting a 350 from a 84 vett in this car and its a 84 fiero with the auto trans.


Thanks Shawn

Don't know about V8's but I've used a modified TH-125H with a turbocharged V6 for several years without a single failure, and the stock axles did hold up. If you install a TH-125H use a longer clutch pack ( 1 extra disc) , increase line pressure, a shift kit ( Transgo not B&M) and HD high stall torque converter should allow it to work w all but the most heavily modified V8's and there have even been cases where these have been used with that box too However if you install a V8 with a 20+ yr old TH-125H that hasn't been touched; unless you are lucky I would not expect it to last.

------------------
87GT 3.4 Turbo- 0-60 5.2 seconds
2006 3800SC Series III swap in progress
Engine Controls, PCM goodies,
re-programming & odd electronics stuff
" I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

Gentlemen, without getting into another argument about YOU KNOW WHO........he's right the axles wont break. it takes alot to break the axle and likely something else in the tranny will fail prior to the axle snapping. But define "break".

What happens is the tripot has about 1- 1 1/4 inches play to slide in and out within the joint. If you are throttling up and making a turn the inertia twisitng the car's chassis and K member combined with the travel of the rear strut gives a great opportunity for failure by letting the tripot spin out of its housing. Add a few hundred HP and this amplifies. Think of an SCCA car when they are running a course and the wheels come up in a turn. That's when it happens. Plus we all know every GM stamped product such as a K member will have an inch or two margin of error. So will any brand new assembly line car.

Guys this happened to me personally. When I called YOU KNOW WHO he's like "yes you need this axle I've got one right here" and had it to me in 3 days. He told me keeps them in stock for certain swaps yet no mention was made of it. I thought it was odd that the subject came up AFTER I bought the kit and experienced the problem but hey I was happy with the axle and he only charged me like 100 bucks for it. It solved the problem so I got two. One is for sale in the mall by the way.

Please don't go talking bad about me again, I am only sharing the facts and aswering the question. I don't want luke to have to go through this the way I did. Walking home and then towing the car less than a mile form my house was not my vision of a first drive.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick:

The results of one does not equal the results of all.

The vast majority of the Archie SBC kits auto/manual have been installed without axle issues. This proves that axle replacement is not a requirement of the kit, but that is not to say that from time to time there will not be someone who ends up having axle issues. It has happened. Sometimes it is because the person mounted the engine in a different location, sometimes there were worn parts used, sometimes they had a non-stock fiero axle to begin with, sometimes they had a tweaked chassis/cradle, sometimes the cause is never known. These types of axle issues are not exclusive to SBC swaps and have shown up several times with a variety of the 4 speed auto swaps. There are multiple threads where people tell you what axles fit using different parts/length and there are other threads with the exact same setup just mounted alittle differently using a completely different set of parts (because the other set of parts did not work for them).

I have no issue with you sharing your experience, but your experience is just 1 data point.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 10-14-2007).]

Agreed.

So are the longer axels custom made or can you take them from a gm car . Im only ask because my dad has over 100 car in our junkyard and it would be nice if I could save some cash and use what I have.
Also what tranny should I go with and its got to be an auto because its my wife countach replica and this is what she want (dont ask me Y)

The swap was pretty straight forward using Archie's instructions. I would say that the placement of the front engine mount was the thing that gave me the most trouble. Archie's instructions state

17. To assure adequate clearance, the two transmission mounting points need to be modified as follows:
A. REAR MOUNT (the mount at the rear of the car).
Completely disassemble from the frame and transmission. The bracket that attaches to the transmission has two holes in it where it attaches to the rest of the mount. Drill the smaller hole out to the same size as the larger hole. This is the new mounting hole.
B. FORWARD MOUNT
There are two sets of slots on top of the frame rail where this mount attaches. You will need to elongate the set that is closest to the left side of the car. Make the slots 1/2" longer toward the left side of the car.
18. Attach both assembled mounts to the transmission.
19. Carefully lower the engine/transmission assembly onto the "K" member. Start the transmission mounting bolts onto their studs. Do not tighten yet.
20. Carefully finish lowering the engine/trans. assembly onto the frame. Do not disconnect the hoist. When placed on the frame, the assembly needs to be as close to the left side of the car as possible. (This is the reason you elongated the mounting holes.)
21. The fore and aft placement of the front mount on the right frame rail is very important. It is in the right position when there is a diagonal distance of 16-3/8 inches from the center of the crank shaft to the center of the forward right "K" member attachment hole.

What gave me trouble is that inorder to get the 16-3/8 distance you had to pull the front of the engine towards the left side of the cradle. This distorted the rubber transmision mounts and in essence negated the effects of the slotting of the k-frame. I would suggest that even when you think you have the angle iron in the right place, that you move it in about 1/8 inch. This should guarantee that the engine is over to left far enough. If needed you can always add a washer to make up that space.

You will have to cut off some sheet metal to clear the rear valve cover. I have a picture, but can't seem to get it to load in this reply.

You may also need to cut off the dog bone bracket, and the small heat shield brackets off the back of the engine compartment to clear your exhaust. I used the Sanderson Headers CC90 and they would have rubbed if not cut off. I was told that either the CC90 or rams horn exhaust manifold work. I chose the headers.

I had to put the engine in and out multiple times to get everything trimmed just right. It is somewhat of a pain, but really not too difficult if you have someone helping you.

If you want some pictures, let me know your email address and I'll send them to you.

Good luck.

Ok bella8075@aol.com Dont make fun its my wifes email.

Thanks shawn

Just be aware that Archie's kits require lot of modification to get them to perform correctly. That's my personal experience though and may not be yours.

quote Originally posted by luckesc4vett: Can anyone tell me if I need to get a longer right hand side axle for my v8 archie setup.I forgot to ask him and I dont want to bother him. This would be for the auto trans setup. Thanks shawn

A longer axle is not required on the right side.

Think about it for a few minutes. Nothing in my kits changes the left to right (seal to seal) length of the transmission. Wether it's a stick shift or an automatic transmission all the external dimensions of the transmission remain the same as the stock transmission because we don't supply or recommend the use of anything to externally modify the transmissions.

So, if the axles on your donor car fit correctly before you did the swap they should fit after the swap.

The only exception to this would be if the person installing the kit didn't follow the instructions & moved the engine/transmission assembly too far to the Left in the car. Then it's posible that the Right side axle that had fit before the swap would be short after the swap. OR if the axles he had originally were not the correct axles to start out with.

This subject was discussed in detail back in July in this thread https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/083993.html

quote Originally posted by Archie: #2 I suspect that when you put your car together that maybe you moved the engine 1/2" too far to the left in the car. Or maybe you have an AutoZone, Advance Auto (or other) axle assembly. It has been found many times here on PFF that some of these axles assemblies that are put together in sweat shops are actually assembled with the incorrect shaft lengths (see paragraph below) & thus you would have a short axle which would give the same effect as moving the engine to far to the right during assembly. You see the Inboard Tri-pots "Bell-out" a little bit towards the Boot. If the axle doesn't have the correct depth into the Tri-pot then there is more rotational slop in the axles assembly. This is the paragraph below....... The Right side Fiero axle assembly is supposed to have a shaft that is 17.938" long. GM has made 21 axle shafts that have the same shaft diameter & splines as the Fiero Automatic uses. Of those 21 lengths 2 of them are less than 1" shorter than the correct Fiero axle length. (& 2 of them are just over 1" longer) I don't know if you've ever been in a axle rebuilding operation but nothing there is measured real close & it would be real easy to grab an axles to assemble that is just a little short.

I hope this helps

Archie

[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 10-14-2007).]

Well just out of morbid curiosity why do you keep a ready supply of longer axles to mail out to customers then ?

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: Well just out of morbid curiosity why do you keep a ready supply of longer axles to mail out to customers then ?

From time to time a customer will not follow instructions correctly & whenever I can help him out I will. When i find a solution for a problem a customer has, even if it's because the customer couldn't follow instructions correctly, I usually get 2 or 3 of the problem solving parts made extra, just in case the problem comes up again.

Archie

Archie, are you implying once again that I did not follow your instructions ? Because I did. I can sense your insinuations in your post, yet you are so careful not to direct them to me.

Let's just agree that some of the K members are shaped a bit differently and this might account for the discrepancy from car to car. I would say if this guy measures his K member and performs the cuts down to the exact 32nd of an inch just like I did and still needs a longer axle,that it might be that the K member was shaped a bit differently ? Or maybe he didn't mount the angle iron in the right place too ? Because I did and I still neeed a longer axle.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: Archie, are you implying once again that I did not follow your instructions ? Because I did. I can sense your insinuations in your post, yet you are so careful not to direct them to me. Let's just agree that some of the K members are shaped a bit differently and this might account for the discrepancy from car to car. I would say if this guy measures his K member and performs the cuts down to the exact 32nd of an inch just like I did and still needs a longer axle,that it might be that the K member was shaped a bit differently ? Or maybe he didn't mount the angle iron in the right place too ? Because I did and I still neeed a longer axle.

Yep that's right, I'm talkin about you. Kinda like your "YOU KNOW WHO" comments earlier in this thread, seems you can dish it but you can't take it. The only thing is that you already told everyone that you didn't follow instructions.

Let's just agree that you want to ***** & moan about your build without backing up your complaints with your name. And I'll agree that I'm getting pretty tired of hearing about it.

Now, you've already got one guy booted from this forum with your crap, let's see if you can drag another forum member out with you when you go.

Archie

[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 10-14-2007).]

My left axle was not right stock in mine because the engine ended up mounted slightly too far to the right I think. I snapped 2 'axles' but not the axle themselves...they failed at the tripod. TH125 will work only if your very lucky. My transmissions were built by a local guy who builds drag racing autos for a living. He tried Kevlar and stainless bands, different valve assemblies, modified TCs and 8 disc clutch pack. None of the 4 lasted more than 1,000 miles. I didnt race it or do burnouts. I did drive it fast, but never from a stop. Mine did the same with the 383 stroker I originally put in (400 hp) and another ZZ4 350 (300 hp?). Id go with the caddy auto if I did it again. (ive been told the 4.9 auto is same bolt pattern as Fiero tranny)

Hey man I can take it haha. I just can't beleive you're on the name thing again. If you could get over yourself for a moment, I believe I stated that I performed your swap, in its entirety, by your video. Then I went back, pulled the cradle and redid everything by my own standards.

When I called you about the axle you said "oh you need a longer axle. Some of the swaps require longer axles" so I bought them from you.

How childish of you to imply that I didn't know what I was doing. I have a lengthy mechanical background and joined PFF to help and to read about swaps. Now because of this ratings thing I have to hold my head above water becasue of you ? I mean do you do this to everybody that has a little problem with your swaps ?

As for the rest of PFF....I am here to help you. I have extensive knowledge about bodywork, fiberglass, chopping tops, engine swaps, V6 and V8 rebuilds as well as hotrods and lowriders. I have air bag suspension experience in both cars and trucks, I have transmission and driveline tech experience as well as longitudinal V8 swaps in mid-engine tube chassis Lambo kits.

To the members of PFF, I am here to help. Do not be distrcted by the ratings thing or by people hwo try to make new members lookj bad. Please understand that I like to read this forum and reply to help others. I have loved Fieros since the late 80's and love to see them and drive them. I am here to help which is what I thought I was doing in this post and all of a sudden it is made to look as if I do not know what I am doing ?!?!?!

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: Hey man I can take it haha. I just can't beleive you're on the name thing again. If you could get over yourself for a moment, I believe I stated that I performed your swap, in its entirety, by your video. Then I went back, pulled the cradle and redid everything by my own standards. When I called you about the axle you said "oh you need a longer axle. Some of the swaps require longer axles" so I bought them from you. How childish of you to imply that I didn't know what I was doing. I have a lengthy mechanical background and joined PFF to help and to read about swaps. Now because of this ratings thing I have to hold my head above water becasue of you ? I mean do you do this to everybody that has a little problem with your swaps ? As for the rest of PFF....I am here to help you. I have extensive knowledge about bodywork, fiberglass, chopping tops, engine swaps, V6 and V8 rebuilds as well as hotrods and lowriders. I have air bag suspension experience in both cars and trucks, I have transmission and driveline tech experience as well as longitudinal V8 swaps in mid-engine tube chassis Lambo kits. To the members of PFF, I am here to help. Do not be distrcted by the ratings thing or by people hwo try to make new members lookj bad. Please understand that I like to read this forum and reply to help others. I have loved Fieros since the late 80's and love to see them and drive them. I am here to help which is what I thought I was doing in this post and all of a sudden it is made to look as if I do not know what I am doing ?!?!?!

Sorry man, I answered your 1st question to me in this thread in a civil manner.

You're the one who had to make it all about you by taking it to a personal level.

Archie

quote Originally posted by Archie: Yep that's right, I'm talkin about you. Kinda like your "YOU KNOW WHO" comments earlier in this thread, seems you can dish it but you can't take it. The only thing is that you already told everyone that you didn't follow instructions. Let's just agree that you want to ***** & moan about your build without backing up your complaints with your name. And I'll agree that I'm getting pretty tired of hearing about it. Now, you've already got one guy booted from this forum with your crap, let's see if you can drag another forum member out with you when you go. Archie

You call that civil ??

Oh for Christ' sake!

------------------
Recanizin' Flat-Buns Since 2001

Eric Nelson
Internet Sales Manager
Power Ford Valencia
nelsone@autonation.com

Im not taking sides here but from what i have seen of archie his work is top notch and his parts fit like a glove.I have placed a order with him a month ago and have had some questions,just last night i emailed him and he was quick to respond. When you buy something from archie dont be shy to ask him for help if you dont understand.I will be odering the v8 master kit next month with some other parts,and have no doubt im buying from someone who knows their stuff.

[This message has been edited by GTCONVERSION (edited 10-15-2007).]

Ya, mine was my mistake and Arch helped me out supplying a modified one.

quote Originally posted by trikerman: What gave me trouble is that inorder to get the 16-3/8 distance you had to pull the front of the engine towards the left side of the cradle. This distorted the rubber transmision mounts and in essence negated the effects of the slotting of the k-frame. I would suggest that even when you think you have the angle iron in the right place, that you move it in about 1/8 inch. This should guarantee that the engine is over to left far enough. If needed you can always add a washer to make up that space. .

Perhaps I'm reading this wrong, but this doesn't sound right to me. the 16 3-8 distance is measured from the crank centerline to the front right cradle mounting point, and is placeing the new engine in the same general front to back location as the original. how would that require moving the engine side to side to get a correct measurement??? what did I miss?

Russ544

BTW: Archie has always treated me right when I treated him right.

[This message has been edited by Russ544 (edited 10-15-2007).]

On the automatic TH125 conversions the rear tranny mounts catch hell because you have a solid angle iron front mount and soft rubber rear mounts. The stabilizer arm is there to control the tranny jump under heavy torque because the tranny mounts are too soft. My harmonic balancer barely cleared the inner frame rail and rubbed on hard takeoffs because of the twisting of the entire assembly but was never a real problem. Just nervous worrying not being familiar with a balancer pulley and all. I just massaged the framerail so it cleared better. The measurements were all correct by the way. I was just noting that the engine and tranny assembly, in some cases, may have to be moved over slightly which in the end may cause the outcome of the longer axle being needed. The rear tranny mounts will twist alot and might cause the front to twist with it.

[This message has been edited by GT Quick (edited 10-15-2007).]

GT Quick. I agree with Archie. You made it personal and he put you in your place. Take it like a man and get over it.

I bought my Archie kit from some Joe Blow on ebay and it was royally screwed up. Archie didn't owe me anything since I didn't buy the kit from him, but has helped me everytime I asked. To me, that is someone who stands by his product.

"GT Quick. I agree with Archie. You made it personal and he put you in your place. Take it like a man and get over it."


Look I can take alot and I can step up when I'm wrong. I am an adult like many others here. No offense friend but I don't care about who you agree with; this isn't an argument where one person is right and another is wrong. I stated facts and again, Archie asked for my name then again insulted my intellect by implying I did not perform the swap right. I hope your tripot slips out just like mine did so he can tell you the same when you call. Be sure to post up when it happens. It will.

quote Originally posted by GT Quick: I hope your tripot slips out just like mine did so he can tell you the same when you call. Be sure to post up when it happens. It will.

Sure sounds to me like "I am here to help you". With good wishes and help like you have, what more can a man ask for?

John Stricker

I am here to help but it seems that there should be a forum about V8's where only Archie can post the replies since everyone else is either:

1: wrong
2. lying
3. fake identity
4. not able to position a simple V8 block, drill a hole in a K member and weld up some angle iron

I mean what would I have to gain by saying I needed a longer axle for my swap ? I was just trying to help people out by sharing information. Sheesh.

I’m confused as to why you have an extra axel to sell so please help me get this straight, you bought a master build kit from Archie. You followed his instructions and built the car but weren’t happy so you pulled the motor and replaced 90% of his kit. At this time you needed a longer axel so you got one from Archie. After you finished the swap your way you then sold the car. So why do you still have a axel for sale?
I’m also confused as to why you won’t post any pictures of your work? Or provide any proof that you actually bought a kit or built a car.

Lets just say that I start a thread GT Quick is a hack and a RIP OFF. I bought this 86 Fiero V-8 from him and it turns out to be the biggest hack job I have ever seen. I bought it sight unseen because he said it was done with a V-8 Archie master build kit. When I get the car it turned out to be 90% hacked up any pretty much useless to me.

Now do you feel it’s all right for me to post that without having any proof to back it up.

[This message has been edited by DL10 (edited 10-18-2007).]

Yes I understand your point, but here's what happened for the umpteenth millionth time:

1. Installed Archie kit as instructed on a TH125 cradle. Battery relocated to the trunk. I am using an electric water pump.
2. test fitted engine, exhaust was junk so removed engine and lost the lower half of the trunk. Also noticed the hinge had to be notched at this time
3. new exhaust, motor back in, installed and tune for several days
4. check, double-check, recheck everything for a week before driving the car. Replaced alternator.
5. installed cutoff switch, next drive to adjust TV cable
6. noticed when revving engine, the rearend of the tranny/SBC350 jumps alot. Questioned the position of the stabilizer bar. Brainstorming about stiffer motor mounts or move the bar
7. test drive with slight rubbing of the pulley upon accelleration secondary to engine jump and/or K member or chassis twist. Video camera mounted to conclude this as stated before. Adjusted TV cable again. Adjusted valve lash on the SBC.
8. tripot slipped on a curve under accelleration secondary to either K member flex or tranny jump. I may have been told this by Archie or I may have concluded it on my own. I don't remember. But I damned sure didn't want it happeneing again.

Pay attention, here's the important part.

9. was told I needed a longer passenger side axle by Archie. "oh you need a longer axle. Some swaps do so I'll get you one out in the mail." At this point since I've gotta wait on an axle I decided to pull the cradle again, fix the pully rub, redesign the stabilizer bar location, install the longer axle and fabricate semi-solid rear tranny mounts becasue of the way the original ones were flexing. I installed poly K member bushings (throwing away the new factory ones I bought) and all of this together resolved my tranny jump issue. I went ahead and ordered two of the axles in case I still had tripot failure or something else. I already had a spare driver's side axle so I figured a spare of both axles would be of benefit.

Yet when I explain this to people it is like I don't know what I am talking about. Do you think I made this up ? I installed the kit, exactly as instructed, and then I needed a longer axle. The end.