More "details"

I did not have much time so I slapped this together but you get the idea. I put it on the trans before paint and it looks like it will do the job as long as it does not bend or break.

Hopefully this will work. I still need to paint the welded part and cut off the excess threaded rod from the slave. Then I need to find the correct fitting to screw the clutch line into the slave. Anyone have an idea what size and thread pitch the clutch line is?

This is what it will look like ready to run. I bled the system but there is a small leak from the bleeder and inlet fittings on the slave. I will have to remove them and use Teflon tape per the instructions to get a good seal. I was surprised at how little effort is required to disengage the clutch.

damn N* waterlog is a steaming POS ..Chrfab has a electric wp that eliminates that problem

quote Originally posted by Erik: damn N* waterlog is a steaming POS ..Chrfab has a electric wp that eliminates that problem

Looks nice but comes at a large price tag. $653.90 plus $18.00 per fitting.

This pull style slave is not that bad if you have a welder handy. If it works out it may help solve the infamous bleeding issues with the stock setups.

I forgot to mention that the fitting on the slave end of the clutch line is on a 6mm hard-line and is M12 x 1.0 with a bubble flare. I ended up using a brake line extension instead of a 90 degree fitting (preferred) because the proper 90 degree fitting is not available. The brake line fabbed by "The Parker Store" cost just under $10.00. A better solution would be to cut off the existing metal braided flex line and putting an American sized flare fitting on the end and then fabbing up a new flex line that would fit into the fitting that comes with the after market slave.

Good news, it looks like the Teflon tape on the threads works. Now onto the plumbing...

quote Originally posted by cptsnoopy: Good news, it looks like the Teflon tape on the threads works. Now onto the plumbing...

sweet, you may beat me yet ..I still am fabbing up my headers and then its plumbing, and finally the wire harness

I've caught up, too, but I still have a long road ahead: plumb & mount oil cooler/exaust/suspension & axle mods/install hoses and fluids/see if it runs.

Bob

Took a while without PIP, but here's a pic:

[This message has been edited by RCR (edited 06-02-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Erik: damn N* waterlog is a steaming POS

What on earth makes you say that?

quote Originally posted by Will: What on earth makes you say that?

I have several reasons..one is its prevents one from using the isuzu or muncie without modding either and or the clutch arm, slave mount or the shift cable mounts
Also its a pain in the butt to deal with in the stock caddy for certain repair jobs

Isuzus and Muncies (and Getrags for that matter) were never meant to work with the engine. WTF do you expect?

The front manifold on a Fiero V6 is a PITA to deal with too. That doesn't make it a POS because it does what it needs to do.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 06-02-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Will: Isuzus and Muncies (and Getrags for that matter) were never meant to work with the engine. WTF do you expect? The front manifold on a Fiero V6 is a PITA to deal with too. That doesn't make it a POS because it does what it needs to do.

no kidding ..still does not make the waterlog attractive for the swap

PITA POS are one in the same

quote Originally posted by RCR: I've caught up, too, but I still have a long road ahead: plumb & mount oil cooler/exaust/suspension & axle mods/install hoses and fluids/see if it runs. Bob

Looks good but kinda busy in there!

Charlie

quote Originally posted by cptsnoopy: Looks good but kinda busy in there! Charlie

Yes, but it does fit.

Bob

quote Originally posted by Erik: no kidding ..still does not make the waterlog attractive for the swap PITA POS are one in the same

No, they're not.
It is a PITA because it's difficult to work with, but it is NOT a POS because it does exactly what it was designed to do and does it very well with a high degree of reliability. It is well engineered. Don't blame GM because they didn't design it to go into a car that ceased production 4 years before the engine was introduced, with a transmission that's rated to 1/2 or less of what the engine puts out.

quote Originally posted by Will: No, they're not. It is a PITA because it's difficult to work with, but it is NOT a POS because it does exactly what it was designed to do and does it very well with a high degree of reliability. It is well engineered. Don't blame GM because they didn't design it to go into a car that ceased production 4 years before the engine was introduced, with a transmission that's rated to 1/2 or less of what the engine puts out.

umm yeah, they are I had a POS give me a PITA and it was a crappy experience ..
Ok I'll compromise ..its not a POS for the N* ..it could care a less if a human has to suffer when dealing with it

[This message has been edited by Erik (edited 06-03-2008).]

It looks like my routing for the radiator return crossover pipe will work ok. I can't get pip to find the server so pics will have to wait until I have more time to figure out how to use my cox webspace again.

trying ImageShack for temporary use...

[This message has been edited by cptsnoopy (edited 06-04-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Erik: umm yeah, they are I had a POS give me a PITA and it was a crappy experience .. Ok I'll compromise ..its not a POS for the N* ..it could care a less if a human has to suffer when dealing with it

It does exactly what it was designed to do.

When your soap slides off the soap tray in your shower, the soap tray is a POS because it doesn't do the one thing it was designed to do: hold soap.

I decided to work on the fuel tank today and install the high pressure fuel pump. First thing was to check the output of the fuel gauge sender and as usual it was too high. I was able to look up some archived threads on calibrating the sender and was able to get it to show .2 ohms at empty and 96 ohms full. That should be close enough. The tank was pretty badly corroded when I dropped it down a couple of years ago and now it was just dry flaky corrosion crud. I poured a bunch of BB's in the tank and shook it around for several minutes. It is not perfect but it does look much better and usable. I was surprised at how fine the corrosion dust is after knocking it off the tank with the BB's. It went through my new vacuum filter and filled the garage with a coating of dust. Oh well, live and learn. Once I get the rest of the dust and BB's out of the tank, I will install the new pump and close up the tank. After it is installed I can verify the routing of the heater hoses because I am installing the surge tank behind the driver on the left side of the firewall instead of the right side as I had previously planned.

Got the fuel tank installed yesterday. Today I figured out a way to install the surge tank using the stock mount points on the tank. Seems to work pretty well.

Looking good Charlie. What make is the tank from? I'm going to use one from a Grand Am.



Keep up the good work.

Bob

[This message has been edited by RCR (edited 06-08-2008).]

Hi Bob,

Thank you, I think that the tank is from a 96 corvette. (I am pretty sure I got the idea to use this one from Rickady88GT) The one you are using looks like it will work well. I probably would have mine on the passenger side too but the surge and overflow nipples were too close to the electrical connector that is in front of the passenger side strut tower. The plumbing to the tank will go two directions. The small 5/8ths size line (hot water) will go from the rear of the water log, under the head and connect to the stock line on the passenger side just aft of where the harmonic balancer will be. The 3/4 size will run along the firewall next to the crossover pipe and then at the far drivers side by the fuel fill/vent hardlines it will 90 rearwards under the fresh air intake area and then up 180 to the upper 7/8ths nipple of the surge tank. The lower 7/8ths nipple of the surge tank will then go the warm water inlet next to the thermostat housing on the water pump. The actual surge line will come off the stock location of the water log (If I don't need to modify it like Russ544 did) and have a short run to the lower 3/8ths nipple on the surge tank.

charlie

[This message has been edited by cptsnoopy (edited 07-11-2008).]

quote Originally posted by cptsnoopy: The actual surge line will come off the stock location of the water log (If I don't need to modify it like Russ544 did) and have a short run to the lower 3/8ths nipple on the surge tank. charlie

There must be another way than what I did, but if so, I couldn't figure it out. you'll need a spot to put a second temp sensor into the water jacket, and the stock N* doesn't provide a convienient one.
The surege tank you (Snoop) used was used on all the C-4 Vetts. They are priced pretty reasonable from GM (Cheeper than what many wrecking yards want for them as a mater a' fact).

Looking good there Snoop !!

Russ544

quote Originally posted by Russ544: There must be another way than what I did, but if so, I couldn't figure it out. you'll need a spot to put a second temp sensor into the water jacket, and the stock N* doesn't provide a convienient one. The surege tank you (Snoop) used was used on all the C-4 Vetts. They are priced pretty reasonable from GM (Cheeper than what many wrecking yards want for them as a mater a' fact). Looking good there Snoop !! Russ544

Thank you Russ. I noticed that your N* has this plug in the water-log also. Is it not suitable for sensing engine water temp?

Charlie

[This message has been edited by cptsnoopy (edited 06-11-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Russ544: There must be another way than what I did, but if so, I couldn't figure it out. you'll need a spot to put a second temp sensor into the water jacket, and the stock N* doesn't provide a convienient one. The surege tank you (Snoop) used was used on all the C-4 Vetts. They are priced pretty reasonable from GM (Cheeper than what many wrecking yards want for them as a mater a' fact). Looking good there Snoop !! Russ544

There is a three wire temp sensor that has both the 5V resistance to dedicated ground and 12V resistance to engine block ground sensors in it. The ECM uses the 5V and the gauge uses the 12V. Use one of those and the gauge and ECM will both see the same temp (whether the gauge reports the right temp is the question...).

However, the overheat idiot light won't work without a separate temp switch.

quote Originally posted by Will: There is a three wire temp sensor that has both the 5V resistance to dedicated ground and 12V resistance to engine block ground sensors in it. The ECM uses the 5V and the gauge uses the 12V. Use one of those and the gauge and ECM will both see the same temp (whether the gauge reports the right temp is the question...). However, the overheat idiot light won't work without a separate temp switch.

That is what I used Temp sensor from a 1998 Grandprix GTP....Temp guage does climb but I'm uncertain if its accurate.

Thanks guys, I will keep that in mind.

charlie

quote Originally posted by cptsnoopy: I found the purpose of this plug in the engine book. Used for cleaning out the egr passages in the water-log. No help for water temp sensing...

I've seen them so clogged up full of carbon no port access via plug would suffice .it would take removal of the intake manifold

quote Originally posted by cptsnoopy: I found the purpose of this plug in the engine book. Used for cleaning out the egr passages in the water-log. No help for water temp sensing...

Corvairs had metal temp sensors in their cylinder heads. Maybe one of those could be used in that bung (as long as the EGR is not connected). With the 3 wire temp sensor in the cylinder head, all we need to fully interface with the Fiero chassis is a coolant temp switch, however.

quote Originally posted by Erik: I've seen them so clogged up full of carbon no port access via plug would suffice .it would take removal of the intake manifold

Intake manifold removal is only required on the early metal box intakes. The later composite manifolds introduce the EGR gasses through a TB spacer. They don't clog NEARLY as much as the early ones do.

I will either get the 3 wire temp sensor or add a fitting to either the surge line or the hot water outlet line to the heater core for the Fiero temp sensor.

I made a slight error in setting up the egr. I put the egr bung on the forward bank exhaust after the cat which may not be such a "hot" idea.... I am guessing that the higher temp of the exhaust gas plus the different chemistry of the gas may make it unusable for egr purposes.

[This message has been edited by cptsnoopy (edited 06-11-2008).]

After the cat? It ought to be cooler then.

The only requirement on EGR gas is that it be inert.

quote Originally posted by Will: After the cat? It ought to be cooler then. The only requirement on EGR gas is that it be inert.

I don't know much about how the cat works but I am under the impression that the cat actually increases the exhaust temp through the chemistry reaction taking place. The warnings in the car manuals about not parking in an area where vegetation or other combustibles are present near the cat gave me this idea.

I think this will work for the Fiero temp gauge sender. This is the hot water outlet from the water-log to the heater.

Hi Charlie,
What do you plan on using for a throttle cable? For some reason I thought the '84 cable (4 cyl) would work, but I'm finding it's not that close. FWIW, it worked with the 3800SC. Justr one more piece to the puzzle.

Bob

I used an '88 4 Cyl cable with slight mods to the bracket on the throttle body. I might have a pic.

Sorry it took so long to reply. I have not hooked up or looked at how my throttle cable will work. My guess is that Russ already has it set up so I can just attach my throttle cable (88 4 cylinder) and be good to go.

I did get a little more of the plumbing done. The 3/4" heater return line is run from under the belly pan of the car up and along the fire wall and connected to the upper 7/8" port of the surge tank. I just need to get more hose clamps and tighten it all up. I don't quite like the way I ran the 5/8" brass fittings for the heater line coming off the engine so I will get some more aluminum tubing and bend up another piece. I hope to use a rubber 90 on the passenger side near the frame rail to complete the connection. It will need enough room to flex for engine movement. Then the 3/8" surge line to the upper part of the surge tank (should be a fairly short run) needs to be connected and I will then be left with the wiring to do.

charlie

quote Originally posted by cptsnoopy: Sorry it took so long to reply. I have not hooked up or looked at how my throttle cable will work. My guess is that Russ already has it set up so I can just attach my throttle cable (88 4 cylinder) and be good to go.

yup. the 88 4 cyl cable should clip right into place like it was made for it. errrr.. it was actually

Russ

quote Originally posted by Russ544: yup. the 88 4 cyl cable should clip right into place like it was made for it. errrr.. it was actually Russ

Thanks Russ

charlie