quote Originally posted by Russ544: I see Harbor freight must love you almost as much as they do me Just curious if you've checked out if the emergency brake cables will still make it through the maze. when I did mine I found it to be very tight quarters to fit them in, and was glad I had planned ahead well. That rear mount looks great. It's nice to see someone thinking outside the box on a project for a change.

It seems like I can't go to Harbor freight without spending at least a hunderd dollars at a shot.

I do have to make brackets for the cables, but they'll clear nicely. Thanks again Russ.

Joe

Great work!

I can't wait to see this get finished.

Hey Joe, what grade steel did you use for that rear motor mount and what size wire did you use? By the way it s a work of art.

quote Originally posted by motoracer838: The next time your down from Fort Fun, you need to stop by. On to what everybody is waiting for, the latest update, the rear engine mount. Before I tore the car apart I took some measurments with the suspension fully extended in relation to the cradle to have a point of reference for determining where the axle would be during the mock up process. this allowed me to leave as much material in the side plates as possible. The rear mount tacked up. Fiting the rear brace. fitting the bottom. A couple of shots of the finished mount. Untill next time. Joe

Sir you have a new PM!

JG

quote Originally posted by THE BEAST: Sir you have a new PM! JG

Back at ya'

what Brown did for me today...



I just love UPS. the parts came from Summit.

Flowmaster # 43083 crossflow for F-bodies 3" in duel 2 1/2 out
Magnaflow 3" cat
U bends in 2 1/4, 2 1/2 and 3







The last of the mount fabrication






The engine sitting on its mounts.

Iv'e got a rough week coming up at work so I wont have anything to report on 'till next weekend.

Cheers Beers n Gearz. Joe

Great work as usual, Joe! It's nice to see you getting practice for my car ;-)

I'm exausted,
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laying pipe, Grin Reaper style,













I'll do the tail pipes in the car.

While I was working on the exaust, Don ( Klingon Fiero ) came over and lent a hand changing out the pedal assembly and shifter, helping to return the car from a auto back to a stick. thanks Don!!!

Things at work went better than expected wicth allowed me to take today off.

I should be doing the trial fit of the drive train in a couple of days.

Joe

Awesome job...I have to keep reminding myself that it's not as easy as you make it out to be...Very nice...

Bob

quote Originally posted by RCR: Awesome job...I have to keep reminding myself that it's not as easy as you make it out to be...Very nice... Bob

The scary part is just watching him makes it feel like it should be "just that easy"... It is amazing to watch him at work. A very creative mind!

-

Nice work Joe. As allways

Jim Youngs, the editor of Kit Car Builder has Just discoverd PFF.

I had bumped the thread to help him find it, we are talking about doing an artical when the swap is done.

Joe

[This message has been edited by motoracer838 (edited 03-09-2007).]

quote Originally posted by motoracer838: Damn, that things big!!!

ha ha. just wait til you get the rest put in there. it's positivly roomy now things like the dogbone, oil cooler, radiator purge system and charcole canister all need to go in there somewhere to ya know.
lookin good though.

i just started an intro to welding class and even though iv only completed the arc welding portion i just wanted to tell you your welds look really good motoracer. hopefully eventually i can be that good of a craftsman!

Reality check, or this is why you should tack weld every thing then test fit. There are a couple of things I don't like about how the drive train is fitting into the car, I know that with as big as this engine is there are going to be some compromises, but I'm just not comfortable with how it currently fits in the engine compartment.

I'll start with moving the new crossmember down and forward a 1/2 inch, this will open up the room I need to move the engine down to the point that the oil pan is even with the bottom of the crossmember, I'd be a lot happier with this if the pan was steel but thats one of those compromises that I'll have to live with. Side to side is good but I'll also move the engine back about 1/2 inch to give me a little more room at the firewall.

I knew better than to weld every thing solid but I let my confidence get the better of me and now I get to pay for it.

One of the reasons I'm giving so much info on this is to help other people trying this swap, to avoid some of the problems Iv'e encountred along the way.

Thanks for wacthing, and thanks to everybody for all of the positive comments.

Stay tuned for more fabrication. Joe

Wow!! Wow oh wow oh WOW!! Dream welds, Joe!! This is brilliant stuff..my oily old hat is off to you. Great to see such fabrication going on, and I wish I was there to witness it in the flesh ..could DEFINITELY learn some things from you.
Having just spent the last 18 hours on designing and building some more gates (2) and rejillas (3), it was nice to sit back and see somebody else's welding for once!!
The welder that I was given, which is an Esab 160 compact, has made welding fun again .It welds so cleanly, and I don't have to keep messing about with wirefeeds, gas joints etc.I can weld twice as quickly now, which saves/earns me more money The machine is 18 years old, but is still smooth as silk.
I will be keeping an eye on this thread every day from now on!! Keep up the excellent work, and thanks
Nick

[This message has been edited by fierofetish (edited 03-11-2007).]

Awesome detailing Joe...Any pics on what you didn't like about the fit? This way I can see what not to do when I do mine.

Bob

lol im still a lil new to this n i kno som ppl name their cars n so i ask this grin reaper style?...

quote Originally posted by DEMONCHILD: lol im still a lil new to this n i kno som ppl name their cars n so i ask this grin reaper style?...

I think he meant grim reaper style (just misspelled it ) since it will likely kill him before he's done!

regarding your remark "stuffing a Hemi in there" , Isn't the N* a hemi? Aren't all dohcs hemis?

Ah, technically, any DOHC engine with 4 four valves per cylinder ( or more ) are called pentroof combustion chambers. Very similar to a "hemi" but no cigar. There were some DOHC engines with hemi combustion chambers, notably Alfa's of the 50's 60's and 70's, but there are none today.

quote Originally posted by DEMONCHILD: lol im still a lil new to this n i kno som ppl name their cars n so i ask this grin reaper style?...

The cars name is Grin Reaper, ( alltho MrFiero just might have a point, thats funny Mike ) because of how much fun it's been to drive and that was with the 4.9 and auto. I could have named the thread something like, Northstar swap Motoracer838 Style, but I thought this sounded better.

On with tonights update.

I posted this pic in another thread but I'll post it here as well



Is there something wrong with this bracket? it doesn't look right to me.

Some of the rework, keep n mind some of what I'm doing here is simply to locate the engine in it's new place, 1/2" down and 1/2" to the rear.



This is a temporary mounting of the front trans mount, this mount and the crossmember will be replaced with new after I build a new rear trans mount bracket to accomodate the new location of the engin and transaxle



New holes to move the rear engine mount back, the old holes will be welded uponce I'm sure I like the new location.



Same here the new holes allow the engine to move down and the old will be welded up.



Here Iv'e trimed the lip away to clear the oil pan.

I'm tired and I'm going to bed. Goodnight.

Joe

Hi Joe, your install is looking great. I don't know if you can use an Aurora cam cover on the front bank for your N* but here is the clearance I am getting on my Aurora cam cover to passinger side hinge mount.



That clearance is with the engine pan about 3/8's to 7/16's above the bottom edge of the cradle, shown in the two pics below. This is an 88 also. I ended up cutting into the passenger side strut tower requiring the use of coilover springs. I did that so I could leave the trans in the stock location.





If you can make it work without cutting into the strut tower that may save some work.

quote Originally posted by motoracer838: I'm sorry that I didn't get some better pics while it was in but the biggest problems were that I had almost no clearance at the right hinge mount, even after triming it to within an inch of it's life, and I wanted a little more room at the fire wall. This is where my OCD anal retetive perfectinist tendencies manifest themselfs. I don't mind reworking the parts too much, as I tend to go by the thought that no matter how nice it looks or how long it took, that can't justify using the part if it's not right. when Iv'e got it where I like it and am happy with it, I will provide measurements for location. Joe

Hmm...
I'm going to revisit what I said before...
I left the trans mounts stock and put the Northstar crank bolt right where the 2.8 crank bolt had been, relative to the right cradle rail. Everything lined up just fine. The engine could probably move left a little bit and I may do that, but I think that overall just putting it in the same place that GM put the 2.8 is the best thing to do.

ok i see lol....the previous owner of my car named it the reaper as in grim reaper and he had vinyl decal things made up that say the reaper an he put them on the car

quote Originally posted by motoracer838: I'm sorry that I didn't get some better pics while it was in but the biggest problems were that I had almost no clearance at the right hinge mount, even after triming it to within an inch of it's life, and I wanted a little more room at the fire wall. This is where my OCD anal retetive perfectinist tendencies manifest themselfs. I don't mind reworking the parts too much, as I tend to go by the thought that no matter how nice it looks or how long it took, that can't justify using the part if it's not right. when Iv'e got it where I like it and am happy with it, I will provide measurements for location. Joe

[This message has been edited by DEMONCHILD (edited 03-13-2007).]

Worth the wait, worth the effort!!! Back in for the second fitting.









I'm much happier with how it fits in the engine bay now, plenty of room at the right hinge, at the firewall and enough room at the trunk ( whats left of it anyway.)

Here are the parts that did the job.















I also reworked the front engine mount, but I was in such a hurry to get the drivetrian back in the car that I didn't get any pics.



A note to my secret santa, I don't know how you knew to get them in large, but they fit great and are worn any time I'm in the shop, thanks.

Thats all for now. Joe

[This message has been edited by motoracer838 (edited 03-17-2007).]

Yep, tons of room now! I guess you did cut into the strut tower already, I did not notice before. The only thing that seems to have tight clearance on mine is the a/c pulley just over the right fore/aft rail of the cradle, not very much room there. If your not running a/c it won't be any issue.

[This message has been edited by cptsnoopy (edited 03-18-2007).]

quote Originally posted by motoracer838:

Nice job making that. I was thinking that the first one looked bent...

quote Originally posted by motoracer838:

The Northstar will destroy the stock one in a few months if you use the power regularly.

quote Originally posted by cptsnoopy: Yep, tons of room now! I guess you did cut into the strut tower already, I did not notice before. The only thing that seems to have tight clearance on mine is the a/c pulley just over the right fore/aft rail of the cradle, not very much room there. If your not running a/c it won't be any issue.

Very nice work Joe.

Has anyone done a N* swap without cutting the strut tower? What's the alternative? Is the fit different between the '88 cradle and the others?

quote Originally posted by Hulk: Very nice work Joe. Has anyone done a N* swap without cutting the strut tower? What's the alternative? Is the fit different between the '88 cradle and the others?

The strut towers are closer together on the 88's than the earlier cars, you could move the drivetrain to the left to clear the tower, but you'd need custom axles.

Thanks. Joe

[This message has been edited by motoracer838 (edited 03-19-2007).]

Well Joe....once again, you amaze. Your fabrication skills are some of the best I've ever seen. Will be sitting on the edge of my seat watching you bring this monster to life (once again).

Thanks for taking the time to document, photograph, and share.

Dan

I just wanted to say that you are doing a great job
Please keep on posting

quote Originally posted by motoracer838: Here are the parts that did the job. I also reworked the front engine mount, but I was in such a hurry to get the drivetrian back in the car that I didn't get any pics. A note to my secret santa, I don't know how you knew to get them in large, but they fit great and are worn any time I'm in the shop, thanks. Thats all for now. Joe

Joe you have a new PM!

JG

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Don came over last weekend to help me start stripping the GT to use for Countach body you see in the foreground, Don needed some parts off the car that I promised him last year, so into the shop it went, fourtunantly Iv'e got the hard fabrication done on the Northstar swap, otherwise I'd be hurtin' for room.

I should have some more from the swap by the end of the weekend.

Joe

What I learned today.

If the altenator fails while i'm in the middle of nowhere, I'm fracked! it's a pain to get in and out at home in my shop with a big floor jack and tall jackstands.



to get this thing out takes the following steps.

Remove belt
Unbolt the a/c compressor, let rest on cradle
Unbolt rear alt mount (not shown in pic)
Unbolt main bracket (swing alt up on upper bracket to gain room to accses hardware)
The remove alt from upper bracket.

(with as tight as every thing is, it's a lot harder than it sounds. I spent a good portion of this afternoon working out what it took to get the alt into the car).

All of that requires me to be able to get the car high enough off the ground to get to it, I think that a new alt is going in at final assembly. Rant off.

On to other things,



This looks like crap.



This doesn't look much better. definantly wasn't meant to be seen from this angle.



Now this I can live with. Here's how I got there.



Moved the coil pack off the valve cover, and onto the rear bulkhed.



Did a little triming on what was the right side to clear the throttle body.

Some more of the exaust.







Untill I find the tips that I like and fit, this will have to do.

Next on Northstar swap, Grin Reaper style. Wireing.

Joe

An update on the exaust, before moving on to wireing and plumbing.





I found some tips I like and fit the car (just baerley), whactha' think?

Joe

Those look awesome!

Awesome fab work. I am shoehorning a N* into a Fiero chassis for a Lambo replica and am concerned with the precious little room in the engine bay. I am thinking about separating the upper part of the firewall at the sides (maybe 5") and bending it forward to give me a few extra inches. I will then re weld and strengthen. I can afford to do this because the rear of the interior on a Lambo is vertical. What are your thoughts on this and also did you have a template or measurements when you mounted your x-bar and made your engine mounts? Is there such a diagram or template out there? Also, my tranny appears different from yours. the axles are much further apart coming out of the tranny. Instead of one long axle I will have 2 somewhat equal length ones. Any ideas?
That said, you are doing an awesome job here and thanks for sharing with us all.

Ron