all in due time.... I have to get some more traction on the rear wheels first. Even with the LSD, it spins the wheels anytime the pedal is pressed to the floor. Probably have to start with bigger tires. Once Joey is 100% confident with the car, I'l add some boost to it. In the meantime, I have three other projects going on at the same time in the near future, so I'll be taking a well deserved break come November. Dave edit to add the video from page 10...
[This message has been edited by bmwguru (edited 09-27-2008).]
I got to drive it home from work on Friday..... AWESOME!!!
Then Dave and I went to Trenton area to go hang out with some good friends/fiero owners. The trip was only about 26 miles one way, but OMG, it was great to actually be able to drive the VR-6 Fiero!!
Dave followed me in our gold fiero, just in case we had a problem..... But it ran/drove great.
When the evening ended, we were supposed to stop and get gas before coming home.. but I forgot in my exciement of being able to drive it. So, when we pulled into the driveway and shut off the fieros, he reminded me. We then proceeded to argue over who gets to drive it to the gas station......
Originally posted by anonymity: OMG! OMG!! I love my car!! I got to drive it home from work on Friday..... AWESOME!!! Definitely a feat of engineering.....
No more swaps for at least 2 years!!
Joey (owner of the first completed VR-6 swap!!!)
Two years huh?!?! . . . Yeah, right!!!
Both of you are very fortunate, have fun, . . . Stay safe!
Norm
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08:41 PM
DeLorean00 Member
Posts: 4251 From: Sacramento, CA / Reno, NV Registered: Aug 2005
Dave, Congratulations on completing the build. It has been great fun following along with the progress and problems of the build.
Joey, I'm glad you are so happy with your new car. One question though, paint? Are you going to get it painted and if so what color(s) are you thinking about?
Good luck with the car.
~Bob
------------------ "Its nice to be important. Its more important to be nice."
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11:26 PM
Sep 29th, 2008
bmwguru Member
Posts: 4692 From: Howell, NJ USA Registered: Sep 2006
I want to something wild like my orange and black V8, but the final decision is Joey's. It will definitely be getting paint, bigger brakes and rims in the near future. Dave
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06:51 AM
bmwguru Member
Posts: 4692 From: Howell, NJ USA Registered: Sep 2006
Dave, Congratulations on completing the build. It has been great fun following along with the progress and problems of the build.
Joey, I'm glad you are so happy with your new car. One question though, paint? Are you going to get it painted and if so what color(s) are you thinking about?
Good luck with the car.
~Bob
It will be getting painted, and if Dave has his way soon, but I don't want anything too flashy.... I'm a cop magnet in any car... now put me in a loud car, thats just asking for it. Put me in a loud car with a flashy paint job... and you might as well just take my license now. LOL
I want the car to have a paint job that will compliment the build.... I would like to stick with silver, but we'll see what happens.
It definitely needs the bigger brakes, because it can move....
As far as rims... I'm not sure what I want yet.
Joey
ps I really really really really love my car!!!
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02:11 PM
ALLTRBO Member
Posts: 2023 From: College Park, MD Registered: Mar 2006
I saw that they were talking about my swap on VW Vortex. Maybe they'll let me into the VW/Audi show and go this year at Englishtown??? The paint won't be ready, but I'd like to get the car to the track. Here is the list of drivetrain mods (off the top of my head)...
Port and polish cylinder head slight compression increase (head was shaved) port exhaust manifolds from 1 7/8" to 2" Cold Air Intake A/C and power steering delete Fidanza 5.5lb flywheel Gruvenparts 500g crankshaft damper GIAC custom tuned software as per my specs Catless mandrel bent exhaust with free flowing mufflers Peloquin torsional limited slip differential 600hp custom axles
Next step will probably be a bigger brake kit, rims and tires and possibly (if Joey approves) a better set of camshafts (which can be changed in the car in about three to four hours) The flywheel and lightened damper I thought would be a driveability issue, but it feels perfect. The quickly revving engine is definitely fun. This car could be 50 state legal with the install of the secondary air, EVAP and Cat...and if need be I could add them in in a few hours. As of right now, I wanted it set up this way. For you tree huggers....I stuck the tail pipe with my emissions analyzer and also my stock 87 GT and the VR6 Fiero was a lot cleaner....even with the mods. Dave
[This message has been edited by bmwguru (edited 09-29-2008).]
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06:15 PM
PFF
System Bot
Oct 1st, 2008
Austrian Import Member
Posts: 3919 From: Monterey, CA Registered: Feb 2007
Well, It looks like the VR6 swap is done. The next step is the body work and paint, rims and bigger brakes. Joey and I took the VR6 to the GSF Road Rally and logged in over 200 abusive miles for the day on the VR6. She has been using it for her daily driver since last week and as of right now, we only had one issue...the clip that holds the shifter cable came loose (a 5 minute fix). Other than that, the hasn't missed a beat and is very fun to drive. I was driving it home the other day and had a Audi 1.8 turbo start revving his engine at the light next to me. The VR6 Fiero left him from the light and he never quite caught back up. I'd have to compare the power to that of my V8 Fiero....only not as torquey. Dave
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11:22 AM
AkursedX Member
Posts: 2890 From: Lackawanna NY Registered: Aug 2000
I saw that they were talking about my swap on VW Vortex. Maybe they'll let me into the VW/Audi show and go this year at Englishtown???
I mentioned your build over at michiganvw.org (Michigan Volkswagen Enthusiasts) and it got a really good reception. My one friend is pushing me to get another Fiero and start one of these swaps, lol. And if you want to make a trip to metro Detroit in June, I will make sure you get into the Motorstadt show next year.
Thanks for the good words. Joey hasn't stopped with this car yet. We have already started talking to the various hands that will be painting this beauty...and unfortunately as of today, the estimate looks to be double that of my orange and black V8....but we'll see what I can do about that. I'm gifted in making great deals. Not to give anything away, but the decision was to make her car silver....as for where the expense will be...wait until it is done and you will see. It will be much like my V8...."very unique for a very unique swap" quoted by my wife. Dave
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06:59 PM
topher_time Member
Posts: 3231 From: Bailey's Harbor, for now. Registered: Sep 2005
Not to give anything away, but the decision was to make her car silver....as for where the expense will be...wait until it is done and you will see. It will be much like my V8...."very unique for a very unique swap" quoted by my wife. Dave
Since she named yours the Gay Orange Fiero... what will you call her car? Just curious BTW, can't wait to see the paint job!
Yeah, Sixstrings is the first person to drive the VR6 other than Joey and myself. As of today, the car has been driven (hard) everyday. I drove it to work today and I do enjoy driving it more than my V8 Fiero. The car just keeps wanting to pull.
As for the Motorstadt show...Joey and I are still up in the air about whether we are going to any shows this year. The car will be going in for paint soon, so we'll see how that turns out. If we do decide to go, I'll shoot you a pm. Dave
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02:30 PM
Dennis LaGrua Member
Posts: 15458 From: Hillsborough, NJ U.S.A. Registered: May 2000
Dave: Congratulations on one of the most unorthodox and unusual Fiero swaps that we've seen. I believe that European engines have been put into Fieros before (in Europe) but not the VR6 Volkswagon engine. The video seems to indicate that the engine has balls and I believe that you will hold the distinction of being the only Fiero owner with a VR6 for a long while. The only thing that I noticed that was odd was that the car has no A/C? Is this correct? You know woman can get really crabby on a 100*F day without a working A/C in their car. Certainly a man of your talent can get the system working in no time. Might even work with the VR6 compressor and bracket. Let's make it a point to get the Englishtown track in 2009. I am curious as to how my GM 3800SC will stack up against a VR6. Enjoy it as you've got allot of hours in this swap.
------------------ 87GT - 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. 87GT - 3.4L Turbocharged engine, modified TH125H " I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
It was a blast to drive. I was amazed at how fast it was. This has to be one of the coolest swaps ever and has me thinking I need to buy a fiero soon.
Was absolutely amazing.
Looks like we hooked another one.
As for the A/C issue. I can't imaging it being too hard to install. I'd just use a compressor out of another VW with a six rib belt....I converted the VR6 seven ribs to all six rib pulleys. I could either have the VR6 computer control the compressor clutch or just have the Fiero A/C relay work it. I can make a custom line from the back of the compressor to the Fiero junction. We have A/C in our gold GT and all of our other cars...and I don't remember turning the A/C on in the cars at all this past summer. If it was warm enough, the sunroof glass was put in the front trunk and the wind was in my hair. But A/C would not be an issue to install on the car Dave
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05:29 PM
kevin Member
Posts: 2722 From: Elk Grove, CA USA Registered: Jan 2000
Dave, Outstanding inginuity. Your craftmanship is without compromise. Can we see the work you did on the inside? I think we would also like to get the new torque and h.p. figures, if you got them. I also believe you have the opportuniuty to make some good cash if you can offer this swap in a kit, similar to what Archie did in his V8 swap business. Think about it, hundreds and hundreds V6 VW Fiero's causing the cops, all over America, headaches.
Cordially, Kevin
[This message has been edited by kevin (edited 10-13-2008).]
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06:28 PM
bmwguru Member
Posts: 4692 From: Howell, NJ USA Registered: Sep 2006
Dave, Outstanding inginuity. Your craftmanship is without compromise. Can we see the work you did on the inside? I think we would also like to get the new torque and h.p. figures, if you got them. I also believe you have the opportuniuty to make some good cash if you can offer this swap in a kit, similar to what Archie did in his V8 swap business. Think about it, hundreds and hundreds V6 VW Fiero's causing the cops, all over America, headaches.
Cordially, Kevin
Kevin, I'll be taking it over to a dyno (for my own curiousity) with a friends exact same stock Jetta. I'd like to promote what we can do for our VR6 customers for a little bit of work. I am very curious as to what it is making at the wheels. As for a kit, I would rather not offer this as a kit due to the wiring and shifter nightmare. Now that is all figured out, maybe I'll do another at my shop after I get back on track here. I'd also be afraid of too much criticism. Archie pioneered the V8 swap and takes more abuse than I could handle from the younger crowd that was breast fed with a turbo. I'm lucky I am at that age where I still understand carburetors, but I'd be more inclined to use fuel injection. I used Webers in my V8 swap because I felt nostalgic building it and felt that overkill was the best way to go. With this swap, I went with what I know. I am very good at tough diagnostics, electrical systems and German engines in general. I understand CIS fuel injection and could probably teach a course on it. back on track....there were a lot of variables that I had to decide upon when designing the swap. What was good for me may be a no no for someone else. If I were to do a swap for someone else, i would have to sit down with that person and custom make the swap tailored to them. I went with solid mounts...and I like them, but someone else may want poly or rubber. I'd like to find out what they want the car to feel like. maybe a Jetta 1.8 turbo would suit them better. If they want a 50 state legal car, I would have to make sure that everything meets the criteria. I don't think a kit would be right. I'd rather build it to suit the person. Dave ps...when you say "see the work on the inside", what part of inside do you mean?
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07:18 PM
kevin Member
Posts: 2722 From: Elk Grove, CA USA Registered: Jan 2000
that is a work in progress. Right now, the only parts out of place are the VW shifter and VDO gauges. We will be ordering a set of Mr Mikes covers soon, but paint will be first. If all goes well, it will be a one of a kind paint job. I'll shoot some interior pics later this week. Dave
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07:49 PM
85duke Member
Posts: 536 From: Sacramento,CA Registered: Aug 2008
Dave I think you should use V W wheels for this if possible I know some have the right pattern. They would just add a little more IMHO.
I sold the GLX rims, but bigger rims are soon on the add on list. We had our first kill on the way home this evening. We may need to add on a turbo after all. A Porsche 996 was four car lengths behind when I hit fourth gear. It was pretty obvious that he wanted to race from the start, but didn't seem to want to at the next light. Dave
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08:39 PM
85duke Member
Posts: 536 From: Sacramento,CA Registered: Aug 2008
Awesome I knew this car would be fast based on the V W's I have been able to drive. I would like to have an r32 engine in mine. Do you need a car to practice on?
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08:42 PM
bmwguru Member
Posts: 4692 From: Howell, NJ USA Registered: Sep 2006
As for the A/C issue. I can't imaging it being too hard to install. I'd just use a compressor out of another VW with a six rib belt....I converted the VR6 seven ribs to all six rib pulleys. I could either have the VR6 computer control the compressor clutch or just have the Fiero A/C relay work it. I can make a custom line from the back of the compressor to the Fiero junction. We have A/C in our gold GT and all of our other cars...and I don't remember turning the A/C on in the cars at all this past summer. If it was warm enough, the sunroof glass was put in the front trunk and the wind was in my hair. But A/C would not be an issue to install on the car Dave
Dave: I'm certain that you could get the A/C up and running by just making up a set of custom lines. The only thing that I'm not sure of is whether or not the VW compressor is variable or fixed displacement. As you know variable displacement compressors like to be controlled by the PCM while the Fiero that used an older design fixed displacement compressor ran off a cycling switch that turned on a relay that energized the A/C clutch. In the worst case I guess that you can Tig weld a switch port on the high side line for the refrigerent pressure sensor, wire it in to the PCM and also connect the A/C request signal. If you don't believe in A/C perhaps this is a trivial discussion, but on those long trips in 100* F days it seems to make the ride more comfortable.
------------------ 87GT - 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. 87GT - 3.4L Turbocharged engine, modified TH125H " I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 10-14-2008).]
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02:13 PM
PFF
System Bot
Oct 15th, 2008
bmwguru Member
Posts: 4692 From: Howell, NJ USA Registered: Sep 2006
A lot of the VW's don't use a variable displacement compressor. Finding a clockwise spinning compressor with a six rib belt shouldn't be an issue. I can even use a GM compressor. The screwed up thing is I grabbed the keys to the VR6 this morning and Joey told me that it is her car and I had to drive my gold GT to work this morning. Geesh! Time to start thinking of a swap for my gold GT. Also, should I start a new thread for the crazy paint job on this car or keep this thread alive? Dave
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09:54 AM
reapermedic Member
Posts: 173 From: Johnson City, TN Registered: Oct 2006
Once upon a time a guy named dave swapped an engine from an R32 into a gold fiero gt.
Sounds catchy doesn't it. Black notchie has a nice ring to it as well.
That does have a nice ring to it, but after Joey and I talked about it last night, it looks like I'll be pulling out the V8 from my orange and black car and swapping in a VR6 R32 engine...but probably not for at least a year or two. My gold GT I want to keep close to stock/slightly modded. After seeing the way the Fiero has come in the past fifteen years...a 3800s/c seems like a stock motor to me. It is almost expected to see it in there. Also after seeing Purple Reigns videos, I kinda want one. But, I promised Joey that I would take some time off swaps for a little bit... Dave
Dave I am just glad you are eventually gonna put an R32 into any fiero. I can smell the smoke now. That offer to use my car for practice still stands. I have to stop by your shop when i am out east again.
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07:22 PM
bmwguru Member
Posts: 4692 From: Howell, NJ USA Registered: Sep 2006
Dave I am just glad you are eventually gonna put an R32 into any fiero. I can smell the smoke now. That offer to use my car for practice still stands. I have to stop by your shop when i am out east again.
Let me know you are coming and I'll have the V8 and the VR6 there to give you some rides. The R32 should be a very similiar setup to the AFP VR6 I used in this swap. The only difference would be to use a Jetta six speed manual transmission instead of the AWD R32 trans....oh goody...more custom shifter work. I don't know how many times I wanted to take my life in the bathroom over that f*****g shifter.
quote
Originally posted by Winkie:
At the rate you work you could knock out a 3800 swap in about 2 days.
Ryan
Ryan, With enough planning and pre-prep work, I'm sure that Shawn and I could have the 2.8 out and 3800s/c installed in one day. There is enough support/products you can buy for that swap out there that it will be just like dropping a motor in and out. Dave ps...the little brown truck dropped off some body mods/parts, so it looks like the paint job will be started soon. I already have the name picked out for this car, but it will give too much away about the paint job if I reveal it.
[This message has been edited by bmwguru (edited 10-16-2008).]
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07:48 PM
Gokart Mozart Member
Posts: 12143 From: Metro Detroit Registered: Mar 2003
BTW, can't wait to see the paint job!
