After looking through the archives and seeing the success that 'cowans' had with a Dodge Dakota power rack, I thought that I would give it a try. The first thing I did was to turn my car over to a friend who has the time and mechanical ability to pull this off. Here is what he has done so far- You need to go junk-yarding for an '87-89 Dakota rack for 2 reasons. Number 1- the core for a rebuilt rack was $125, but one from Pull-A-Part was less than $50. Use the junkyard rack as the 'mock up' tool and when you are done, take it to the parts store as a core. Number 2- you need the universal joint off the Dodge rack. It has a slip joint that holds it on the steering shaft and will look like this:
While you have it off, there is a small indention in the double d end that needs to be straightened out. I used a punch to bump most of it out and then a file to smooth it up. You need it nice and slick because.....
That top shaft is the stock Fiero one. The one on the bottom is a stock Fiero shaft that has had the rack end cut off where it starts to get larger to meet the universal joint. On the Dodge truck, the shaft slips inside the lower joint and now your Fiero upper shaft will do the same- it fits nicely into the Dodge lower joint. You need the Fiero shaft about this long:
The rack mount is a simple piece of 1/4 inch thick angle that has an extension welded onto it at a 22 degree angle.
I'll get some better pic's of the mount when we take it back off to make some 'adjustments'. The Fiero tie rod ends will fit the Dodge rack, but may be a little on the short side. Special thanks to Lee at Held Motorsports for sending me a set of tie rod extensions so quickly. I am not sure if we need them, so I will let the alignment shop make that decision. What about a pump? Its a Fiero and it should have an ElectroHydraulic pump, right?
I am not real sure what the pump is for, it was an eBay score. We filled the system with fluid tonight, ran a couple of cables to the pump and......it worked. Steering effort is probably about 1/2 the effort as before adding the power rack. Nice and smooth, but the pump makes some noise. If the 1988 Fiero had this kind of pump, I can see why they pulled them off. We are still getting the bugs worked out, but hopefully it will be roadworthy next weekend for the trek to The Fiero Factory. I'll post more pic's and details as we get it together. Cheers!
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11:51 PM
PFF
System Bot
doublec4 Member
Posts: 8289 From: Oakville, Ontario, Canada Registered: Jun 2003
I am suprised that not too many people have gone with this rack- it is amazingly close to a bolt in. I don't see this electric pump staying for long, so if anyone has a good idea about an engine mounted pump, I am open to suggestions.
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12:08 AM
Steven Snyder Member
Posts: 3324 From: Los Angeles, CA Registered: Mar 2004
That looks pretty good Cooter. Do you know what the steering ratio is? What about the total throw of the rack? If it's a quick ratio rack that would be verrryyy nice!
quote
Originally posted by jscott1: If only someone could market a bolt-on kit. Or least a kit period...
WCF has had a kit for the F-body racks for awhile. All you need to do yourself is the pump, since that depends on what motor you're using.
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12:22 AM
BMTFIERO Member
Posts: 1187 From: Beaumont, TX Registered: Dec 2007
brain storming (ok more like lamebrain drizzling). do you think you have a bad pump or any such pump would be noisy like that? maybe move it? if you wrapped it would that do any good or dose it need some air flow around it?
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08:19 AM
Xanth Member
Posts: 6886 From: Massachusetts Registered: May 2006
I for one really want to add power steering to my Formula. Not because it needs it per se, but what modern car doesn't have it. I think it would add quite a bit to the drivability of the Fiero.
Any specific reason this doesn't work on an 88?
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08:45 AM
TG oreiF 8891 Member
Posts: 776 From: Cleveland, Ohio; USA Registered: Aug 2004
I have the same problem with my electro-hydraulic pump. I have an MR2 pump installed in my 88 GT pushing the Corvette steering rack, and the only problem I have is the noise is a bit high at idle. Since I put in all the MR2 power steering electronics, at speed it runs slower and you cannot hear it, but at red lights and such, it is noisy.
I would guess that it needs airflow to keep cool. My pump was expensive (I bought a new one from a Toyota dealer) so I'm not yet willing to wrap it and see. Also, with it positioned under the passenger headlight, I haven't yet been able to feel if it is hot after running for a while. I'll have to check that this week.
Looks like a nice install job Cooter. I think power steering is catching on in the daily driver circles, despite the arguments always raised about it. Are the ends of the inner tie-rods at the exact same location as stock? If not, you'll introduce some amount of bump steer, but how much and if it will really affect anything, who knows?
You may need to isolate the pump from the chassis with rubber mounts. Old convertible top pumps were mounted with rubber isolators. Just a thought, if the pump is quiet when removed from chassis.
Otherwise, this is cool!
J.
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10:11 AM
Will Member
Posts: 14252 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
I for one really want to add power steering to my Formula. Not because it needs it per se, but what modern car doesn't have it. I think it would add quite a bit to the drivability of the Fiero.
Any specific reason this doesn't work on an 88?
For an 88, the C4 Corvette rack is very nearly a bolt in. It uses one custom mount, the other side uses the stock Fiero mount, and 2 tie rod adapters. Run hydraulic lines and that's about it. I'll try to find the thread on this setup and post a link later.
[This message has been edited by Formula88 (edited 04-16-2008).]
Things like this scare me. I'd be Really worried about the pump giving out and the steering becoming VERY HEAVY Right NOW (!).
With the pump off, the steering effort is the same as it was without power assist because the rack ratio is the same as the Fiero was (3.25 turns +/-) The trunk pan had to be modified to clear the rack, so the spare will sit in the garage or in the rear cargo area. Bob had the mount off today and was supposed to take some more pictures of it for us. I'll check in a bit and see what he has done.
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06:58 PM
rjblaze Member
Posts: 1159 From: Bethlehem, Pa., United States Registered: May 2006
Do you have a pic of how much of the pan was modified? I'm guessing a front-mount battery would be out of the question then? The bottom of the battery box would be about even with the front sway-bar.
Sweet. nice way to find something that fits rather then modding the front end. BTW hows the sliding door sports car doing?
Stock rack mounts are gone Kind of funny about the old van. I sold it and the guy who ended up with it pulled the engine and tranny to put into......his Fiero. The circle of life is complete
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07:23 PM
skoon Member
Posts: 411 From: charlotte nc Registered: Feb 2008
can we get a drawing with dimensions to make this bracket and where holes were drilled to mount and any luck figuring out what the pump is from thanx skoon
------------------ 84 gt project 84 daily The junk yard is my zen garden Future build "Ghost of Indy" i hope
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10:55 PM
Apr 18th, 2008
Rickady88GT Member
Posts: 10649 From: Central CA Registered: Dec 2002
Stock rack mounts are gone Kind of funny about the old van. I sold it and the guy who ended up with it pulled the engine and tranny to put into......his Fiero. The circle of life is complete
I may be wrong but seems like the WCF mount bolts to the stock steering rack mounts? Could that be possible with your bracket?
I may be wrong but seems like the WCF mount bolts to the stock steering rack mounts? Could that be possible with your bracket?
Looking back, that could have probably been done. Our concern with that was that the rack was no longer 'in line' with the outer tie rod ends and would have probably made for some twitchy steering, or it may not have done anything at all. Hard to say on way or the other. This has been a learning experience and if we do another, it may be "improved". I was hoping that everything could be a true bolt on so that at any time, it could be returned to stock.
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05:28 PM
Raydar Member
Posts: 40962 From: Carrollton GA. Out in the... country. Registered: Oct 1999
Things started off well today. Got the terminals on the cables, battery tray mounted, relay and fuse installed and was ready to test it out. Turned on the switch and..... nothing happened. Strange, the top terminals on the battery were showing voltage, but the side terminals were not. We thought a bad connection, so everything came apart, cleaned and back together. Kind of had power, but it came and went. Checked the grounds, everything looked good. Tried making sure the battery was charged, turned the key and:
I've never seen this happen before. The internal connection between the top terminals and side terminals had failed. When charged, there must have been some hydrogen built up and the internal arc caused a bit of a case failure. It was loud! Thankfully, no real injuries- other than a pair of shorts.
It would have been much worse. A new "side post only" battery, and it started easily, steers nicely (in the driveway at least) and the pump seems to not be as loud as before. Tomorrow gets started with a new oil pan gasket and an alignment next week. Should be fun
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06:03 PM
PFF
System Bot
Richjk21 Member
Posts: 2228 From: Central Square NY, USA Registered: Feb 2006
A suggestion would be the MINI Cooper electric pump. It's noticeably loud, but not unbearable. As a matter of fact, after a while one doesn't even notice it. It's only really noticeable from the outside.
I don't remember dealing with ehps equipped cars at Hertz (I know we had them, but I never payed attention), so I can't compare the noise, sorry. I think the noise is "just the nature of the beast" though. If you post a video, I can tell you if it sounds different than the MINI pump.
My mother-in-law has a mini S. I have not been allowed to go near it though. I don't know why. The ratio is the same as the Fiero rack, just noticeably easier to steer in the driveway.
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10:37 PM
Dennis LaGrua Member
Posts: 15526 From: Hillsborough, NJ U.S.A. Registered: May 2000
The original design of a power steering setup that was planned for the Fiero was an electrically driven unit that was later used on minivans. A picture of this unit shows in the 88 catalog. Since GM originally designed it for the Fiero this may be the unit to use.
------------------ 87GT - with 3800SC Series III engine, 4T65eHD 87GT - 3.4L Turbocharged engine, modified TH125H " I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
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11:25 PM
Apr 20th, 2008
Patrick Member
Posts: 37846 From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Registered: Apr 99
The original design of a power steering setup that was planned for the Fiero was an electrically driven unit that was later used on minivans. A picture of this unit shows in the 88 catalog. Since GM originally designed it for the Fiero this may be the unit to use.
This sounds like the way to go for a bolt-in instalation(as close as you can get it) for the DIYers. I never really thought about converting to PS but if it wouldnt be too difficult then I might be up for it.
Went for an uneventful test drive today. The pump is almost undetectable while the engine is running. Steering is smooth and effort is 'modest' for power assist. I wanted one finger steering like the Caprice but ended up with one hand like most everything else with a power rack & pinion. Parking lots will be much more manageable now. Hopefully, I'll make the drive to The Fiero Factory swap meet and some of y'all can drive it and see what you think. Me? I think O'Reilly's sold me a bum rack though- it has a little more 'play' in it than the old rack did. Kind of like an old Dodge truck...oh, wait....crap....nevermind.