Hi am new to the forum so if this question has been covered before please for give...

I have been study Power to weight ratios try to figure out what the level of horsepower to plan for.

Factory Hp for the was about 165 hp? if so and the car weighed 2750 the P/W was 16.6. The Dino 246 weight was 2350 and had 195hp for a p/w of 12/1. The Z06 corvette weights 3130/505hp for a P/W of 6.2!!

So Fiero lovers, gear heads and engineers what would the ideal P/W for the suspension of a 1988 Fiero?

SE or GT? if SE, v6 or 4 banger? auto or stick? vin #? frivers license #? SS #? blood type? retna scan?

ok, i went a lil overboard. put what you feel is necessary. too much sug...or not enough. *twitch*

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First LX9 Fiero GT, 1987
If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem
Fiero's are people too. We pay just as much attention to them, if not more than our loved ones
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First, have you ever driven any car you felt was really quick enough?
With 13" corvette brakes swapped on, you can stop whatever power you can install, and if you do your suspension right, replace the wear items, proper alignment, etc., you can turn without stopping first.
Bottom line, it's up to your budgeting.
Me, I figure I want to s6tay ahead of all the Camrys ans Accords, and those lame 4 doors have 280 crankshaft horsepower V6s, albeit attached to automatic transmissions. I decided I had to have at least 280 horses at the tires.

It's simple. The old hotrod saying "too much horsepower is just about right"
"

Factory horsepower rating for the V6 was 140HP... the 135HP number used in the later models just reflected a changed RPM where the measurement was taken for emissions rating.

1 to 1.

quote Originally posted by Tha Driver: 1 to 1.

i must dissagree the best power to wieght is 1 pound per infinite horse power
but i would say a good balence is a subjective thing im almost happy with my duke so im gettting a v6 and i think that will be enough (never is tho) so its a personal choice jsut remember before you build the 2000 horse fiero traction is only so good

Yes I have driven "quick" vehicles... My 1979 KZ1000 is a speedy little moped. The Kaw Concourse was peppy
In my youth a 1976 Trans Am with a 400cid kept me on first name bases with the local law enforcement. A little MGB was heck of alot fun for only having 85hp/

Guess the question should be. If a LS motor ( low weight, great power and control) is used at what point does the extra hp start causing more problems than it is worth?

Cobra clones, Z06 are tooling around with 5.5 to 1 power to weight numbers and Some mothers son wanted to play in traffic would a 1988 Formula be up to handling 500 hp?

Or is 375-400 hp more in tune with what the Fiero can safely handle?

Speed cost money... Doing the homework helps in only spending the money twice.

Gary

I have three Fieros, one bone stock 87 GT five speed, one 3.4L 88 GT with 440t auto and an 88 IMSA widebody coupe ZZ4 V8, five speed. A fun car to drive is my 87 stock GT, as it can run through the gears with enough HP to chirp tires in second gear and cruise all day gettng 30 mpg. The 88 GT auto is another nice cruiser. The 88 coupe is scary fast, may be nice for spinning tires, but is an expensive to run,(18 mpg of premium) and loud inside.

Too much HP may lead to driving the car in a stupid manner (the testosterone kick). You need to ask yourself what do you want the car for, street racing, road racing or cruising, then determine how much power you need and can afford to meet those needs.

quote Originally posted by dratts: It's simple. The old hotrod saying "too much horsepower is just about right" "

I've ridden in a 4:1 HP:weight car ... and it's no longer a car. it's a different animal that must be driven far differently and you have to expect it to try and bite you.

A normal car, even a Z06 vette is a domesticated dog. Does what it's told, you an get into trouble but it will obey for the most part.

A high horsepower car is like a pet tiger.. It's pretty, it's fast, and it will at any moment turn around and attack you, and probably eat you and leave nothing but a pile of guts.

That said, Horespower = money. Lots of horsepower = lots of money. I'm helping a buddy with his hotrod dragstrip car and he has at least $14,000 into the motor alone. and he's only at ~780HP (no girly HP power adders like NOS, Turbo or Superchargers... Pure raw carbeurator HP... He's adding the supercharger later.)

a 400Hp fiero is easy to attain you can easily do it with a now cheap LT1 engine swap and a few parts upgraded. But your transmission will eat it's self if you use that HP very much. (has anyone even found a tranny that will work for 350-400+hp?) and your tires, brakes, suspension, etc all willl need upgrades before it's "safe" that said, a 400hp LT1 fiero will pull it's front wheels off the ground, snap axles like they are plastic rods (yes I've seen it twice) and get out of control easily if you slap one in the fiero and do not upgrade everything else.

[This message has been edited by timgray (edited 01-21-2009).]

quote Originally posted by Blackbird71:would a 1988 Formula be up to handling 500 hp?

Funny you should ask! Click me for more!

Old Lar and Timgray have it right.
most 10lbs per 1 HP ratios can get 22MPG or better in town (depending on driving style) and still put the car in low 13 second 1/4's every time. and It won't brake the bank to do this.

quote Originally posted by Blackbird71: Hi am new to the forum so if this question has been covered before please for give... I have been study Power to weight ratios try to figure out what the level of horsepower to plan for. Factory Hp for the was about 165 hp? if so and the car weighed 2750 the P/W was 16.6. The Dino 246 weight was 2350 and had 195hp for a p/w of 12/1. The Z06 corvette weights 3130/505hp for a P/W of 6.2!! So Fiero lovers, gear heads and engineers what would the ideal P/W for the suspension of a 1988 Fiero?

The ideal ratio is: MORE power, LESS weight

A famous race driver once said "If I can leave black marks from the apex of one corner to the brake point for the next, then I have enough power". I agree.

Years ago I had a 66 Nova that was about 5.25 #/HP. It would outrun durn near anything (except for a 69 GTO on Highway 37 between Bloomington and Martinsville late one night), pull the front wheels hitting 2nd (if it hooked up), and got about 6MPG (if you kept your foot out of it on a good day).

It was perfect.

(Except it didn't go around corners and couldn't hardly stop..........)

quote Originally posted by timgray: a 400Hp fiero is easy to attain you can easily do it with a now cheap LT1 engine swap and a few parts upgraded. But your transmission will eat it's self if you use that HP very much. (has anyone even found a tranny that will work for 350-400+hp?) and your tires, brakes, suspension, etc all willl need upgrades before it's "safe" that said, a 400hp LT1 fiero will pull it's front wheels off the ground, snap axles like they are plastic rods (yes I've seen it twice) and get out of control easily if you slap one in the fiero and do not upgrade everything else.

If you take frequency of occurance as approximating how easy it is, then it's actually NOT that easy.

I'm not talking about the number of people CLAIMING 400 HP, I'm talking about the people who can PROVE that they have 400 HP.

I put my Northstar car into the 12's and I only have proof of 250 WHP. If someone actually has 400 HP (like Matt Hawkins), then he should be running LOW 12's if not 11's.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 01-21-2009).]

Porsche 917-30: The 917/30 could go from 0-60 mph (97 km/h) in 1.9 seconds, 0-100 mph (160 km/h) in 3.9 seconds, 0-200 mph (320 km/h) in 10.9 seconds, and on to a top speed of 257 mph (414 km/h). 1,100 HP in racing trim and over 1,500 HP in qualifying trim. 1,871 lbs. That's a P/W ratio of 1.25. I'd say that's about right.

http://www.ultimatecarpage..../Porsche-917-30.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_917

JazzMan

I'm not sure that every one here on the forum would agree with this but there are a fair number of Fieros that are running 300-400 HP, (give or take a little) , and most of them would tell you that the car is fun to drive with that kind of horsepower.

So using 2750lb as the weight of a Fiero, I guess you are looking at a power to weight ratio somewhere between 9.2lb:1hp -- up to about 6.5lb/hp.
If you had a 505 hp LS7 in a Fiero, you would have a 5.4lb/1hp power to weight ratio.

You might want to keep in mind that there are other factors beside just power to weight ratio that effects a car handling, and how forgiving/unforgiving the car handles.

Remember, its always better to build the car on paper first, before you build it in real life. (Much cheaper, and easier to make changes.)

Good Luck.

~Bob

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"Its nice to be important.
Its more important to be nice."

quote Originally posted by FieroBobo: I'm not sure that every one here on the forum would agree with this but there are a fair number of Fieros that are running 300-400 HP, (give or take a little)

Everyone certainly would not

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 01-25-2009).]

quote Originally posted by Blackbird71: Yes I have driven "quick" vehicles... My 1979 KZ1000 is a speedy little moped. The Kaw Concourse was peppy In my youth a 1976 Trans Am with a 400cid kept me on first name bases with the local law enforcement. A little MGB was heck of alot fun for only having 85hp/ Guess the question should be. If a LS motor ( low weight, great power and control) is used at what point does the extra hp start causing more problems than it is worth? Cobra clones, Z06 are tooling around with 5.5 to 1 power to weight numbers and Some mothers son wanted to play in traffic would a 1988 Formula be up to handling 500 hp? Or is 375-400 hp more in tune with what the Fiero can safely handle? Speed cost money... Doing the homework helps in only spending the money twice. Gary

There are Fieros out here making well over 800 horsepower on an otherwise stock frame. Since it's transverse, and it's all mounted on a single subframe, the limitation of the horsepower is more with respect to the transmission. You can always completely weld up the subframe where the factory put only spotwelds every few inches... but it's really not so much of a big deal.

You could easily drop an LSX motor in there with a 4T65E-HD, and get as much power as you want.

An LS7 in a Fiero would be good for 11 second quarter mile times, and that would only be due to the fact that you'd have a hard time getting traction.

The Fiero is as strong, if not stronger than the construction of a 4th gen F-body.

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Todd,
2006 Pontiac Solstice
2004 Volkswagen Beetle Convt. (Wife's)
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6
1981 EZ-GO Xi875-A "Miami Dolphins" Medical Cart
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme 350

Using the Skip Barber book "Going Faster" (great read btw.) as a guide I'd say 1.2 G's in every direction. 1.2G brakes 1.2G turning and the elusive 1.2G acceleration
Maximize the amount of thrust tire adhesion will let you.

quote Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: There are Fieros out here making well over 800 horsepower on an otherwise stock frame.

HAH! Show me ONE.

IMO, the optimal power / weight ratio is whatever your tires can handle. So make sure to have some good tires.

you can never have to much power. just not enough traction!!!

I can't say I've driven many cars, but I can tell you this. A 10:1 feels right to me. Not only is 10 a nice number, but it's just enough power to do... whatever. My Trans Am WS6 weighs about 3650lb and has about 365hp. If I want to slide the car, I have the power. If I want to spin the tires, I have the power. If I want to run the quarter in the 12's, I have the power.

It's not too much power, though. I can drive it tame on the street. I can even be a slow poke. However, that power is enough to surprise you. 10:1 is what feels right to me. I can't wait to do an engine swap and make about 280hp in my '88 GT.

[This message has been edited by Rolling Thunder (edited 01-25-2009).]