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[This message has been edited by goatnipples2002 (edited 05-14-2006).]

When are the forum members going to see dyno results of this?

sean, give it up.

quote Originally posted by 1MohrFiero: This set up was at the Fiero Factory Swapmeet. A gentleman named Tom owned it. It is a one-off deal that he made himself. He had just installed it and did not have any hard data to go with it but was happy (very) so far with the way it felt. It looks very similar to the one above but more refined.

A little more info, from memory.
That engine is a 3.1 with an H-260 cam. It's driving through an automatic tranny.
The craftsmanship was absolutely first rate. (I'd buy one of those manifolds if he cared to produce them. No question.)
I don't know how much power it makes either, but as soon as he turned out of Ed's and nailed it, he was gone.
(People were doing that all weekend. The ones who made me look up and say "Holy smokes!" were few and far between. This was one of them.)

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Raydar
88 Formula IMSA Fasback.............................. 88 3.4 coupe................................................

Praise the Lowered! Read Nealz Nuze!

quote Originally posted by fierochild: I will post dyno sheets as soon as I can get the car back on the dyno. Hopefully within the next couple of weeks. Chuck

Any updates Chuck ??

Hey! I'm still lookin' and I'm interested! Why did this column die out??

Sorry to be so quiet guys, but the fact is that I'm still waiting too. The engine is back together and running smoothly. I am holding out for the Guru of dyno tuning. He tunes cars for the World Challenge Cup. Not just one or two, but all of them. Every weekend. He was hired by the WCC to tune the cars to keep the comptition as close as possible. I spoke with him this past week. I'm still on his radar. So hang in there a little longer. As soon as I have something, I'll post the dyno sheets.


Chuck

Chuck. Still looking forward to seeing this.
Would still like to go and watch if it'll work out.

Sent you a PM, also.

I'm also looking for your future result..Since I'm in the same position as you and other that want to keep the look of the engine stock, I'm eager to know the result. My own swap will be (I have the parts but I did not start working on it) a 3400 engine fitted with Focoa headers and a Darell Morse bored throttle body with all intake part port matched and extrude honed. I'm looking to do the "neck" mod to further improve the flow.

Keep us informed when you will be able to dyno your different setup.

[This message has been edited by perry rhodan (edited 06-27-2006).]

I'm still here too... although totall drunk right now, I'm still watching!!!!

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Todd,
2006 Pontiac Solstice
2004 Volkswagen Beetle Convertible (Wife's Car)
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 5-Speed
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 (3.2L) Auto
1984 Pontiac Fiero 2m4 SE
1981 Pontiac TransAm (Olds 455BB)
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

Shoukd have numbers for you by the end of the week. I,ve been in touch with the tuner, and we are supposed to get together this week.

Chuck

Sweet! Let us know, I'm still interested.

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Todd,
2006 Pontiac Solstice
2004 Volkswagen Beetle Convertible (Wife's Car)
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 5-Speed
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 (3.2L) Auto
1984 Pontiac Fiero 2m4 SE
1981 Pontiac TransAm (Olds 455BB)
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

quote Originally posted by fierochild: Shoukd have numbers for you by the end of the week. Chuck

quote Originally posted by Oreif: Fiero intake flows about 300 cfm stock Fiero intake bored by Darrell Morse flows about 336 cfm F-body 3.4L intake flows 360 cfm

Chuck intake flows.... ### !!! (add # here)

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quote Originally posted by fierochild: Shoukd have numbers for you by the end of the week. I,ve been in touch with the tuner, and we are supposed to get together this week. Chuck

Think you can stand a small audience? I'm off until Friday afternoon.
(Goza is doing my heads, BTW. Thanks for the tip!)

quote Originally posted by Alex4mula: What about this mod? More here; http://www.deadbird.org/swin/index.php?showtopic=206 http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/v6/347939-gonna-give-go-3-a.html

how much would you want to do one of these if i were to give you the parts to do it..just tell me what i need..oh and i would need mine to either clear the distrib by going over it or past it..id rather it go over it..would this cause trunk lid issues?..i really want one of these..ive been tracking down a set that cooter originally made several years back..i think i have found the current owner..waiting for replied pm..i think their name is 1fst2m6.now also how do you set up the oem tb?..wouldnt there be issues bout the throttle cables?

[This message has been edited by DEMONCHILD (edited 07-20-2006).]

quote Originally posted by fierochild: Shoukd have numbers for you by the end of the week. I,ve been in touch with the tuner, and we are supposed to get together this week. Chuck

Nothing yet EH?

[This message has been edited by Mister (edited 08-07-2006).]

quote Originally posted by Mister: Nothing yet EH?

ya know, I expect if you pay for the shipping, I am sure he can mail it to you, and you can take it to be tested.
or maybe do one of your own, and take that to be tested.
he owes you no numbers.

No nothing yet. I am scheduled for next Tuesday. I have been holding off for top rated EFI guru in the racing in Atlanta. Shpould have results up by Wensday. I am not getting a standard chip. My ECM has been converted to a flash chip, and he will do real time tuning via Moate's romulator and Tuner Cat. The chip will be tuned in 500rpm increments through out the power band. This includes fuel pressure adjustments.
I have already had this engine pulling over 6K and still making power. How much I don't know, but the car was still accelerating. It did NOT fall on it's face at 4800.
As for earlier efforts, Ed was trying to work me in between appointments. It did'nt work, so I made an appointment. Appointment = higher cost.

Chuck

[This message has been edited by fierochild (edited 08-08-2006).]

Sounds great Chuck, Thanks
~~~

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: he owes you no numbers.

Thanks for stating the obvious Pyrthian. it was just a friendly bump (sorry if you are offended)

[This message has been edited by Mister (edited 08-08-2006).]

This is great reading cant wait to see the numbers. Great work!!!! Im in the same boat of trying to look stock but squeeeeeze as much hp out of this little motor as I can.

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In loving memory of Harold Hummel (PFF 4WHEEL)
1936-2004

quote Originally posted by fierochild: No nothing yet. I am scheduled for next Tuesday.

Best of luck!
As badly as I want to come up and "get in the way", I don't think I'm going to be able to, due to my work schedule.
Thanks for the invite, though.

Well, the numbers are finally in. The 3.4 with the modified Fiero intake plenum dynoed at 172 hp and 211.3 Ft pounds of torque. First pull was 164.8 hp and 204.5 torque. I have the dyno sheet if anyone can post it for me. This proves that improvements can be had with at least a stock looking intake.

Chuck

FINALLY! Great work, when will you start offering this service ;-) I have a bored Darrel Morse upper waiting.

I can host it for you.

If you name it "FIERO.JPG" I'll copy it to this location:

http://stoney.lizardmaster.com/ImageHolder/FIERO.JPG


send it to me in an e-mail and you can post an image with that link (above) and after I've copied it, it will resolve.


Thanks!

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Todd,
2006 Pontiac Solstice
2004 Volkswagen Beetle Convertible (Wife's Car)
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 5-Speed
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 (3.2L) Auto
1984 Pontiac Fiero 2m4 SE
1981 Pontiac TransAm (Olds 455BB)
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

quote Originally posted by fierochild: Well, the numbers are finally in. The 3.4 with the modified Fiero intake plenum dynoed at 172 hp and 211.3 Ft pounds of torque. First pull was 164.8 hp and 204.5 torque. I have the dyno sheet if anyone can post it for me. This proves that improvements can be had with at least a stock looking intake. Chuck

Very good! Sounds like you're dangerously close to 200 at the crank!
Did you keep your before and after datalogs?

I would like to know the before and after please. Nice work. Yeah you made improvements with your stock looking intake, those numbers reassure my decision on the stock intake. Good work hope you find a way to gain more.

Very impressive. Please list all your mods besides the intake.

Thanks!

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Todd,
2006 Pontiac Solstice
2004 Volkswagen Beetle Convertible (Wife's Car)
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 5-Speed
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 (3.2L) Auto
1984 Pontiac Fiero 2m4 SE
1981 Pontiac TransAm (Olds 455BB)
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

The chart above shows the before and after. This engine was never run with any other intake setup.

Engine mods include:

3.4 from Camaro
.030 over bore
3.4 TDC pistons
heads and block milled to yield 9.5 compression ratio
crank machined for .005 oil clearance
rods balanced then rotating mass balanced to 10K
ARP rod bolts
windage tray
high volume oil pump
Crane h272 cam retarded 4*
Valve springs matched to cam and height set to Crane spec
multi angle valve grind
double roller timimg set
custom headers 3 into 1 on each bank. 1 5/8 X 26" primaries w/ 3" collectors
head intake and exhaust ports gasket matched
3qt Accusump (oil accumulator)
external fuel pressure regulator
inline fuel pump (feeds up to 300hp)
19# injectors
MSD coil
Taylor Thundervolt 10mm spark plug wires

That pretty well covers the engine mods. No porting or polishing was done inside the head. I did not expect the modified intake to flow sufficient air to warrent the expenditure. To justify that cost I would need flow numbers comparable to the Trulieo intake, and it just aint gonna happen.

Chuck

I have a roller cam block with a .020 over rebuild and the TDC pistons. Ported heads, intake. I shortened my intake between the middle and upper .6" as well as did as much polishing as possible.

What about exhaust?

lou, About the middle of the list of mods you'll find "custom headers 3 into 1 for both banks." Open exhaust. No muffler, tail pipe, or cat.

Chuck

[This message has been edited by fierochild (edited 08-16-2006).]

lol, missed that!

Wow, thanks a lot Chuck sounds great (I've got you with + a long time ago
We'll talk in our "Fiero Crew" about the results and see what's what.

Thanks again.

quote Originally posted by fierochild: Well, the numbers are finally in. The 3.4 with the modified Fiero intake plenum dynoed at 172 hp and 211.3 Ft pounds of torque. First pull was 164.8 hp and 204.5 torque. I have the dyno sheet if anyone can post it for me. This proves that improvements can be had with at least a stock looking intake. Chuck

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Yeah, those are stock 3.4 TDC in-a-Fiero numbers... I can't wait to get my swap done to compare...

.

[This message has been edited by L.I. Fieros (edited 11-22-2006).]

quote Originally posted by fierochild: I forgot to mention the middle and lower intake was ported and matched by Darrell Morse. I do not have actual flow numbers. However we cam come up with a fair approximation. Orief 200+ hp engine was with a 390cfm carb. Using a 15% loss this would be 230 at the crank. A stock 3.4 flows 360cfm and makes 160 at the crank. With a 15% loss this is 136whp. I dynod 172whp. Again using 15% loss I would have 197.8 at the crank. Flow should then come in around 375 to 380cfm. Chuck Just a wild guess

There are some things a little off with your flow. The 3.4L does require about 360 cfm at 6000 rpm, But at 160hp (stock) it really doesn't flow that. It flows around 324 cfm. The VE of the 3.4L is not 100% it is more like around 87 - 90%. at 360 cfm you should have over 200whp. So your flow is probably closer to 335 cfm. The carb'd engine I built with a 390 cfm carb did not flow 390 cfm but more like around 360 cfm. The EFI 3.4L with the trueleo I built was capable of 436 cfm (based on the intake and TB size) but it flowed about the same as the carb'd engine. (each had about the same flywheel horsepower) This is because of the iron heads even ported and polished cannot flow much over 360 cfm. On your engine it looks like you have the intake flowing at about it's max of around 335 cfm and the heads being ported are helping to get all that thru the engine.

Excellent job on matching flow. Looks like you did a great job on your build.

Just going to the Trueleo will give you a little more top end but most likely not enough to warrant the cost. If you were to do a full port job on the heads then I would suggest using the Trueleo intake as the increased flow thru the heads would require more intake flow.
The $1000 more (Trueleo and head work) would gain you only about 30 more horsepower. So then again it may not be cost efficient to tear it apart and do the work.

Thanks for the complement. My objective was accomplished. Make the maximum power possible with a Fiero intake. A few more ponies could be made with a full port, a larger throttle body, and opening the neck a little more.

Chuck

PS: The heads were not touched except for a five angle valve job. Not even port matched at intake or exhaust. This engine acts just like a 3.4 with a Fiero intake except instead of running out of air at 4800rpm it runs out of air at 6100rpm.

[This message has been edited by fierochild (edited 12-20-2006).]

Bump for a great job
Planning on soon following in your footsteps Chuck, any news or recommendations?

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