The fiero cruise control is vacuum operated. If it was me, i'd get an aftermarket one that is electronically operated. i think it would be easier, probably cheaper and maybe even work better.
. If it was me, i'd get an aftermarket one that is electronically operated. i think it would be easier, probably cheaper and maybe even work better.
I agree. Trying to retrofit 20 year old cruise control is going to be a nightmare. Most of them don't work at this point anyway. The aftermarket system will work much better and be easier to install.
Audiovox makes a unit that's almost identical to stock, except that all the electronics are contained in the servo rather than a separate module. As I recall, the wiring color code on the control stalk is the same as on the GM control stalk, so a stock-appearing installation is easy. (I put ond into a SAAB 900 once, and I've put 'em on Fords, Chryslers, and even on my old MGB.) The unit can be triggered in three ways- magnets on the driveshaft, a speed signal out of the ECU, or by sampling the current drawn by one of the coils. The first way is a little unlikely, but the speed signal method should be easy.
Incidentally, I think what J C Whitney sells is all the same unit, with different optional controls. However you could wire in a stock GM signal stalk for a factory install.
Hummm...these aftermarket option seem interesting...sure I want "stock" look with all the parts that are visible, like the stalk at the steering wheel. The other item, are hidden so, not much of a concern. I will look at these...but in the mean time, if someone can answer my first questions
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07:58 PM
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
Hummm...these aftermarket option seem interesting...sure I want "stock" look with all the parts that are visible, like the stalk at the steering wheel. The other item, are hidden so, not much of a concern. I will look at these...but in the mean time, if someone can answer my first questions
If you want a true "stock" installation you'll need the main wiring harness and the rear wiring harness from a cruise equipped, manual transmission car. Pontiac did not include the cruise control wiring in the cars that didn't come with it. In addition to the parts you mentioned, you'll need the switches that mount on the brake and clutch pedals. It's a big job, but not an enormous one.
------------------ Rod Schneider, Woodstock, Ga. "You can't have too many toys!" 1988 Fiero GT 1966 Porsche 911 Van's RV-6 airplane-under construction
If you want a true "stock" installation you'll need the main wiring harness and the rear wiring harness from a cruise equipped, manual transmission car. Pontiac did not include the cruise control wiring in the cars that didn't come with it. In addition to the parts you mentioned, you'll need the switches that mount on the brake and clutch pedals. It's a big job, but not an enormous one.
I was fearing that...this will make easier the decison to go aftermarket if I cant find a cruise equipped part car.
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08:55 AM
Sep 4th, 2007
PaulJK Member
Posts: 6638 From: Los Angeles Registered: Oct 2001
i don't think you need those switches - it would be VERY easy to just tap into the brake lights to dis-engage with the brakes. Before i started to worry i think i'd simply see what the instructions said ... a manufacturer COULDN'T sell you an aftermarket unit without making allowances for the thing to dis-engage with the brakes and clutch.
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12:06 AM
PFF
System Bot
fierosound Member
Posts: 15183 From: Calgary, Canada Registered: Nov 1999
I'd say, first choice is to go aftermarket. I've just switched my cruise equipped car to a newer non-vacuum cruise unit (haven't tried it yet - car not running). Just involves rewiring, but it still takes a bit of time trying to get everything right. MY LAST choice would be to go "all original" because the work invovled would not be worth it.
I installed a factory setup on a non-cruise car, it's not too bad, but it is a little involved.
Parts list: Vacuum canister (coffee can) Servo brackets for above cruise control throttle cable (attaches the TB to the servo) Rear wiring harness (tail light harness) Cruise module (sits under the carpet by the gas pedal) cruise-control turn-signal stalk with pigtail brake and clutch switches (I don't have the clutch switch, my cruise came from an automatic car) A little bit of vacuum hose
The only really annoying part of the installation is the rear tail light harness. I ended up just removing my rear bumper cover. You disconnect the harness at the C500 connector up by the battery, remove the old and replace it with the cruise equipped one. This was not a bad thing for me in the end though, my original harness was kind of a hacked up mess.
Then you mount the canister (any vacuum reservoir will work, I used an OEM one) and servo.
In the passenger compartment you pull the carpet back from the center hump next to the accelerator pedal, and there will be a plastic piece under the carpet. The plastic piece will have a "slot" for the cruise module. The hookups for the module should be under the dash, they should be easy to find.
Fit the switch in the hole in the brake pedal bracket, fish the wire down through the steering column for the turn signal stalk and plug everything in (everything only plugs in one way).
It's a easy afternoon's work. I found my setup on Ebay, although it would probably have been easier (and about the same $) if I had just bought an aftermarket kit.
If you want a true "stock" installation you'll need the main wiring harness and the rear wiring harness from a cruise equipped, manual transmission car. Pontiac did not include the cruise control wiring in the cars that didn't come with it. In addition to the parts you mentioned, you'll need the switches that mount on the brake and clutch pedals. It's a big job, but not an enormous one.
DISCLAIMER: Looking back, the only car I did a cruise addition on was an 84, and the main harness was different. It's possible the main harness in later year cars may have had the wiring already in place. Just one more possible "84 only" thing..........
------------------ Rod Schneider, Woodstock, Ga. "You can't have too many toys!" 1988 Fiero GT 1966 Porsche 911 Van's RV-6 airplane-under construction
If you are installing your own cruise you can use whatever stalk you want including a genuine GM stalk. The only difference between a cuise stalk and a non-cuise is the 4 wire switch for the cruise in the stalk.
It doesnt matter how much I wrote...take time to read (from your own word)....all I said was written in two sentences only. Not very much...
But anyway, the cruise kit from jscott link, will cost me less and I will have all I need (with the correct stalk model included)...
Also I'm lookin for an Audiovox CCS-100 (box open never used)...no stalk included (only a dash mounted control), but with the purchase of the stalk (on my previous link) it will still cost me less than the one from Air'n'sound.
Still waiting for some aswers from the sellers before making a decision.
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11:43 PM
Oct 7th, 2007
jscott1 Member
Posts: 21676 From: Houston, TX , USA Registered: Dec 2001
I ended up with the vacuum kit and mounted it in the stock location, even though I have a V8 and I'm not worried about looking stock. It worked great and was easy to install myself.
What is written on your electronic cruise control module (the black plastic box under the driver side carpet) ?
I found a cruise module here...part No 25074710. I didnt remember from which vehicule it came from. But maybe its a good model to use in my non cruise 1986 GT.
For now it looks like I have a good part to start with when I look inside the P22 manual.
Where I can find GM part number application chart for parts?
I tried GM part direct...but they didnt list all application it seem...
@squisher86SE : You have a PM
[This message has been edited by perry rhodan (edited 09-30-2008).]
But I'm still wondering about some of the wiring harness question.
I know that squisher86SE wrote here that on a non cruise car, we only need the rear tailight harness....
But....I have a non-cruise '86 GT. And I dont seem to have any unused connectors under the dash (just a big black two row loose connector near the accelerator.) So no brake or clutch cruise vacuum release switch connector, and no electronic cruise module connector.
When we take a look inside the shop manual (I have the '87 helm), we only see the rear harness...they never show the underdash cruise harness or at least the connectors (just a very small part of the electronic cruise module connector)
And when we look at the P22 manual the only thing we see its the "jumper" under dash cruise harness. (jumper is the name of the harness) but no mention of the rear harness difference (cruise and non-cruise) and no detail also of it.
Its very weird and confusing...
So the electrical part still confuse me...anyone else who have done the conversion can help me?
[This message has been edited by perry rhodan (edited 09-30-2008).]
I think a harness from the passenger compartment is required as well.
I have been considering doing this as well, salvaged, the vac can, control module, servo and cable from a donor car. I did not save the rear tail light harness since the car was "pack rat" chewed at the engine compartment. Made a mistake not taking all the interior cables, but I did pull all brakes switches.
I am not sure it is worth the trouble going factory, seems much easier with aftermarket. My 85 has aftermarket cruise but it is not working, the plastic vac canister is collapsed so I need to sub with the metal one I salvaged.
The big problem I do have is the Vacuum Release Solenoid, I didn't grab that, and I don't recall even seeing it. It is suppose to be located at the left shock tower.
First hope is to get the existing aftermarket system working, and then I still think a less painful option is to go aftermarket rather than resurrecting factory components. sparx22
[This message has been edited by sparx22 (edited 09-30-2008).]
From what I saw in the factory shop manual the solenoid is located at the same place as the servo (the UFO that drive the cable).
You talk about a pessenger side harness? I didnt saw nothing about that in either manual, but a small harness on the drivers side is necessary (at least it show in the P22) to cnnect all switch and the electronic cruise module.
But its only what I saw in both manual. I'm still looking for more info.
The '87 manual seem better at showing some thing than the '86 helm however.
If I can resolve this little problem I will be ok .
[This message has been edited by perry rhodan (edited 09-30-2008).]
I have an 85 GT and 85 Pontiac manual. There has to be wiring in the pass compartment since the control sets on the drivers side of the console under that plastic plate under the carpeting.
My question is can you make this http://www.jcwhitney.com/AU...+600000570_10101.jcw work with a GM type control stalk? I have a stalk with (4) wires which is factory type replacment. I sure would not want a dash mounted slab control. If my aftermarket unit is shot I would not mind spending $160.00 or so, but not eager to plunk down $200.00 I can also sell my GM cruise parts off since I would not need them. sparx22
I will try to post a scan of what I have for the wiring harness under the dash in the P-22. The only things I know is that the "jumper" harness as they call it have a different part number for '85, '86 and '87. So maybe your will be diffrent...I dont know.
this morning after work i'll post scan out of my factory manual and pics from my car. I wish i had taken pictures during install of factory cruise in my 86 SE, same set up as your 85 except # of taillights to share with you.
quote
Originally posted by squisher86SE:
I installed a factory setup on a non-cruise car, it's not too bad, but it is a little involved.
Parts list: Vacuum canister (coffee can) Servo brackets for above cruise control throttle cable (attaches the TB to the servo) Rear wiring harness (tail light harness) Cruise module (sits under the carpet by the gas pedal) cruise-control turn-signal stalk with pigtail brake and clutch switches (I don't have the clutch switch, my cruise came from an automatic car) A little bit of vacuum hose
The only really annoying part of the installation is the rear tail light harness. I ended up just removing my rear bumper cover. You disconnect the harness at the C500 connector up by the battery, remove the old and replace it with the cruise equipped one. This was not a bad thing for me in the end though, my original harness was kind of a hacked up mess.
Then you mount the canister (any vacuum reservoir will work, I used an OEM one) and servo.
In the passenger compartment you pull the carpet back from the center hump next to the accelerator pedal, and there will be a plastic piece under the carpet. The plastic piece will have a "slot" for the cruise module. The hookups for the module should be under the dash, they should be easy to find.
Fit the switch in the hole in the brake pedal bracket, fish the wire down through the steering column for the turn signal stalk and plug everything in (everything only plugs in one way).
It's a easy afternoon's work. I found my setup on Ebay, although it would probably have been easier (and about the same $) if I had just bought an aftermarket kit.
you'll also need the wire harness that hooks these switches the module and car together.
the hardest part on this install for me was running the wire down the steering wheel and retaping the new tail light harness and adding attachment clips from the old harness.
the harness connector in the passenger compartment for cruise control is on the left side of the center consule behind the radio. you shouldn't have to remove the consule to get to it.
the difference in the cruise/non cruise taillight harness is that the cruise harness continues into the drivers rear fender well up under the drivers inner sail pnl, behind the evap canistor, around the drivers strut tower to the servo and solinoid. oh yeah the trunk light part of the harness goes to the trunk on the drivers side of the servo. Forgot about the bonus of the trunk light.
@Tanlrat: This "jumper harness" , that connect the module and switch , which I'm looking for is "hidden" behind the radio /the center console in all non cruise car? or you need to get it from a cruise equipped donor car?
My center console is partially disassembled ... I will try to take a look further.
For the rear electrical part, no confusion here anymore. Still need info about the driver side electrical portion.
@sparx22: I dont know if you can use the fiero stalk to work with it, but I think its possible. I remember about some of the thing one of the vendor Ive talked with last your about my desire to install an electronic cruise in my Fiero. And I think he told me thats it's compatible. BUt not sure. You will need to ask directly the manufacturer of the kit or with JCs
[This message has been edited by perry rhodan (edited 10-01-2008).]
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07:49 AM
Tanlrat Member
Posts: 154 From: Buckeye, AZ, USA Registered: May 2008
my car was not cruise equiped. it is a lone connector hanging out there behind the consule on drivers side. I found it long before i though of installing cruise control when i was screwing around with my radio. I get you pics in about 4 to 5 hours. I'm still at work and the good 'ole DOD does not like us GI's going to photobucket website @ work.
It's sucks when you can't see all the pics that have been posted in a thread
