This may seem like a strange thing to want to do, but I'd like to paint the outside of the glass on my 84's sail panels. You might be wondering... "Why?"

For those of you unfamiliar with the '84 sail panels, the glass part is actually glass, not plastic like the '85-'88 notchie sail panels. The glass comes from the factory coated black on the inside. What happens over time though is this black coating degrades in different areas and shows through on the outside as greyish stains. I don't believe it's possible to eliminate these greyish marks as to do so, the glass would have to come out of the surrounding structure/frame, and I don't think that's possible.

So I thought the next best thing to do would be to mask off the frame and paint on the outside of the glass to cover up these greyish imperfections/stains.

So... is there a particular type of paint which can be used on glass?

This is just my opinion on painting glass......not necessarily just sail panels. The only real way to make paint stick to glass permanently is to etch the surface first. I know you can damage glass by scraping it so I don't know if you can wetsand the glass to rough it up. There may be a paint that sticks to glass but I doubt it is permanent without some sort of glass prep beforehand.

If you head to the hobby shop, there are specific paints for painting glass. Though such paints will give it a "colored glass" look (think stained glass. May have to be applied with a brush). You can paint with spray paint, but it will scratch off fairly easily (yet it is cheap).

I wonder what stain glass would look like against a black background.... hey, running lights behind (or beside to shine in the side of the panel) the glass.... custom artistry on the sail (think 70's van) http://www.michaels.com/art...le?articleNum=ae0034 .... this might have some other interesting custom possibilities... sorry, let me put out the bud.... (kidding)

What type of "painting" do you want? A solid match color?

Myke

EDIT: added link

oh and the link is a "how to" for painting on glass

[This message has been edited by Myke (edited 02-19-2010).]

quote Originally posted by Myke: What type of "painting" do you want? A solid match color?

I'm pretty boring. I thought I would just paint it... black.

Yeah, probably gloss black so that it would be a little different than the flat (satin?) black of the surround/frame.

Thanks for the link on painting glass.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 02-19-2010).]

If you can access a heat gun....
http://www.michaels.com/art...ge?productNum=cp0286

Do you have a Michael's in your area? (We have them in Oklahoma, and when I was living in New Hampshire, they were all over)
Craft shops and hobby shops will have more of what you are looking for.

IMSA is on to something with the etching of the glass, but I would try it out on a storm window or something first. Also I would be careful about how deep you scratch up the glass; I think almost every scratch is going to show up in the finished work.

M yke

quote Originally posted by Myke: Do you have a Michael's in your area?

I never heard of them before, but sure enough I did a search and it turns out there's no less than four of them relatively near by! Thanks for the tip, Myke.

Yes, IMSA brought up a good point with the etching (thanks!), although I'm not sure what that process involves and whether or not it would possibly damage the surround/frame of the glass.

Keeping in mind that the sail panel glass is not really in a bad location for chips etc, it actually might not need to be touched up too often even if I just spray paint it.

It would be interesting to hear from someone who's painted their sail panels (I'm sure it's been done) to hear how well it's stood up.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 02-19-2010).]

If I recall I thought once the sail panel was off the car the painted backside of the glass was exposed? The only thing was if you were to strip and repaint the backside, that there is an edge about 3/8" thick that you cannot strip/paint due to the seal. Also the one mounting bracket is actually glued to the backside of the glass. So you cannot paint under that.

But just so you know, the glass does comes out of the frame.

You need to remove the frame from the car and using two small putty knives and WD-40. You carefully lift the outside of the seal with one putty knife and use the other to pull the glass up. The best spot to start is the top door side corner. Once you get the corner out, Work down the door side edge.
The WD-40 helps lube things up so it slides out and doesn't mar the frame. Of course everything is slick so it's very time consuming.

Big Caution Note: Do NOT chip the glass. If it gets chipped after a few bumps it will start to crack. I know someone who swapped a piece of glass and used a flatblade screwdriver. Chipped the edge and a few weeks of driving a crack started to form. Just like a windshield can do with a chip or stone nick.

To install the glass you need some string. Kind of the thickness you would wrap a package in. (Too thin and it will cut into the rubber seal, too thick and you won't be able to pull it out and fit the glass in at the same time)
Place the string under the seal along the bottom and the door edge with a good length sticking out. A seperate piece around the top. Slide the glass in to the rearward corner and the rearward edge. Line the edge of the glass up with the other edges and start pulling the string slowly. As the string is pulled it should pull the seal edge over the glass. Once you get that all done you may need to use a putty knife to help with the string at the very top edge.

While it is a huge pain to do this, It can be done. Took me about 1.5 - 2 hours to do 1 sail panel. (had perfect glass with faded frames and two frames that were near perfect but the glass was broken out of them.)

Painting the outside would require you to rough the glass surface or stain the glass. Another option would be to remove the glass and replace it with a metal or fiberglass piece. (the later plastic panels are too small to fit the glass frames.)

quote Originally posted by Oreif: But just so you know, the glass does comes out of the frame. You need to remove the frame from the car and using two small putty knives and WD-40. You carefully lift the outside of the seal with one putty knife and use the other to pull the glass up...

Geez, I dunno. The frame around the glass on my '84 sail panels appears to be awfully stiff. I don't think I'd want to try bending it to get the glass out. Something is bound to snap, probably my nerves!

Thanks for the info, Oreif. I'll keep what you've posted in mind. Maybe in really hot weather the plastic frame is more flexible, but right now it just seems too risky to try getting the glass out.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 02-19-2010).]

If there real glass, do what I do to glass all the time, just like chrome. Mask it and sandblast the glass, then primer and paint it like any other part. I did an extra sunroof glass with black laquer for my Ferrari kit. It never chipped or peeled.

I have an '84 as well. Drivers side got busted out. Bought another sail, but frame was faded. frame on mine was perfect. Cut old frame and removed glass. Lightly sandblasted inside of glass, washed with thinner, and sprayed with a krylon gloss black rattle can. Came out perfect, but was a pain to get it in the good frame. Reinstalled and came out great. Hope this helps.

How about really dark window tint?

quote Originally posted by Formula88: How about really dark window tint?

If you want to do it right -
A: Etch the glass first. You can find this stuff at a large art supply store. It is designed to put stencils on glass. Once the glass is etched, it will be a light milky white. Prime and paint with acrylic enamel or urethane automotive paint. (not from a spray can)
B: Another option would be to stop by a vinyl sign shop and buy a couple feet of black vinyl used for signs and just apply it. Ask the sign guy how to wet the surface and use a squeegee to get the bubbles out.

If you don't want to do it right.
Sand it with aluminum oxide sand paper. Which will leave scratches all over it. Pick up a can of some cheep crap spray paint and paint it black. It will look like crap but it will be black.

use 85 sail panels, replace the panels, save your stock ones. My wife did some tile with "glass paint" from that store. It had to be baked to be perminit. 350 degrees for 20 minets. just paint it.

quote Originally posted by MacGuyver: Sand it with aluminum oxide sand paper. Which will leave scratches all over it. Pick up a can of some cheep crap spray paint and paint it black. It will look like crap but it will be black.

Sounds good to me!

Seriously though, I really appreciate all these suggestions. Lots of good ideas to consider now.

Just thought I'd post an image of what these greyish looking marks look like that show through from behind the glass. The one to the left is actually a complete circle that was produced by a factory foam pad rubbing against the back of the glass over all these years.

I have a idea that I don't know if it has been posted because I don't want to read through all of that.

What about a vynil wrap on it? Or some limo black tint?

Edit: I guess I should have read the shorter posts before I posted, LOL.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: How about really dark window tint?

[This message has been edited by Khw (edited 02-21-2010).]

Tint would work, if you are removing the glass. (For some reason I was thinking you wanted to leave the glass in. I don't know why I was thinking that.) Not only that, but if you do not like the outcome (before you reinstall), you can easily strip the tint off and start over.

Removing the glass opens up a number of new options. The "black out" tint might be one of the better ideas. It will adhere to the backside of the glass, reducing the chance of anything showing between the glass and the panel behind it. This is the option that seems to have the lowest chance of failure.

Painting the glass has a higher chance of error. If you paint the front of the glass (not removing the glass from the car) You will lose the "SE" and chance the paint flaking/scratching off over time. Etching the glass (roughing up the surface) will reduce the chances of this, but also might reduce the smoothness in the appearance. Glossy paint will enhance any imperfections, where as flat will look out of place on the car. A semi-gloss will better match the paint, but it will still show the imperfections in the glass just to a lesser degree.

Removing the glass and painting behind the glass has the second lowest chance of failure. The main concern here would be to get an even coat with zero imperfections.

If you remove the glass, make sure you clean the glass PERFECTLY before you apply tint (if you use that option) or before you remount the glass (if you are painting behind).

I hope that you can show us the results when you are finished.

Myke

quote Originally posted by Myke: Tint would work, if you are removing the glass. (For some reason I was thinking you wanted to leave the glass in. I don't know why I was thinking that.)

Myke, the reason why you thought I wanted to leave the glass in was probably because you read my earlier post!

quote Originally posted by Patrick: The frame around the glass on my '84 sail panels appears to be awfully stiff. I don't think I'd want to try bending it to get the glass out. Something is bound to snap, probably my nerves! Maybe in really hot weather the plastic frame is more flexible, but right now it just seems too risky to try getting the glass out.

Regarding the potential loss of the "SE" on the sail panel, it appears that no matter what procedure I use, it's going to disappear. That's not really a concern for me though as this '84 SE has been converted to look like an '85 GT anyway.