quote Originally posted by Jncomutt: This is what the bellhousing would look like sitting on the shelf at a recyclers... This picture has a lot more information in it than most people will realize.

For example: looks like the bearing bosses for the intermediate and output shafts are much closer to flush with the inside of the bellhousing, resulting in more pressure plate clearance and more clutch options. Fair assessment?

quote Originally posted by mera7: 2 more trannies today... 2002 vin 4 cavalier f23 and another 2010 cobalt f23

Please let us know if the bell housing swaps from the 2000 and the 2010 ecotec trans. It keeps getting said that they can be swapped, but I don't know of anyone who has said this who has actually done it with a 2010 trans. It has been done on the 00-02 trans. Lets get the fact that it works before we keep spreading that info. I'd hope it does, but has it been done yet?

[This message has been edited by Jncomutt (edited 12-22-2010).]

quote Originally posted by Jncomutt:

Did you guys have to tap the 3 holes to the left of the differential? Mine are hex shaped and aren't tapped.

Yes, had to do that on all my F23s. You're catching on, slowly but surely..

I will make my mounts out of allen keys.

quote Originally posted by Fierobsessed: I will make my mounts out of allen keys.

Make sure You include a birth certificate

tHIS IS FOR THE EUROPEAN MEMBERS looking for the f23 transaxle from my reseach the motors called ecotec in europe are not all ecotec engines

The 1.0 ecotec is a 3 cylinder twin cam suzzuki engine
The 1.4 ecotec is a 4 cylinder twin cam suzzuki engine
the 1.6 ecotec is a 4 cylinder twincam isuzu I mark engine as well as the 1.8
The 2.0 ecotec is the older 2.0 ecopower saab engine as well as some of the 2.3's
only the 2006 and up saab 2.3' turbo's are the same as the american ectec
us saabs all use the ecotec from 2002 and up

so be very caerfull when looking for the F23 transaxle in europe

the above engines except for the diesel are standard engine in Vauxhaulls Opels and Saab's are 2.0 2.0 turbo and 2.3 2.3 turbo and only 2006 up uses the same engine as America ectec

[This message has been edited by bubbajoexxx (edited 12-23-2010).]

What about the 3800 ecotec??

quote Originally posted by Jncomutt: What about the 3800 ecotec??

not used in europe the 3.2 and 3.5 are the V6 (and almost forgot the opel 2.8) of choise in the europen cars with V6 engines 3800 ecotec is used in australia and only a hand full ever see europe

a little note the 3.2 4 cam is isuzu and is also used in honda's

the honda passport is a isuzu made by isuzu the model used is the rodeo from 98 up

[This message has been edited by bubbajoexxx (edited 12-23-2010).]

I know, I was joking around, meant the term "3800 ecotec" in general, but nvm, lol.

quote Originally posted by Jncomutt: Please let us know if the bell housing swaps from the 2000 and the 2010 ecotec trans. It keeps getting said that they can be swapped, but I don't know of anyone who has said this who has actually done it with a 2010 trans. It has been done on the 00-02 trans. Lets get the fact that it works before we keep spreading that info. I'd hope it does, but has it been done yet?

Any further progress on this? Maybe I missed it in another thread...

quote Originally posted by schmoken: Any further progress on this? Maybe I missed it in another thread...

Mera7 was the only one currently planning to attempt to put the 2200 bell housing on the 2010 cobalt xfe transmission, he was banned over something petty, so until someone else attempts it we wont know for sure.

I plan to try the newer longer geared trans in mine when I can get the motivation and some spare time. But until then the normal f23 is working well enough.

quote Originally posted by FieroFiend: Mera7 was the only one currently planning to attempt to put the 2200 bell housing on the 2010 cobalt xfe transmission, he was banned over something petty, so until someone else attempts it we wont know for sure. I plan to try the newer longer geared trans in mine when I can get the motivation and some spare time. But until then the normal f23 is working well enough.

Can you elaborate more on the "longer geared trans"? (Do you mean the XFE trans?) Do by any chance know the specs on the gear ratios between that, the normal F23, and the getrag? Thanks.

The 09-10 Cobalts with the FY1 RPO code have a 3.63 final ratio.
The 282 had 3.61.

I'm not an expert, but I have done a bunch of reading on this lately. My 282 has seen better days.

[This message has been edited by schmoken (edited 05-03-2011).]

Apparently the earlier F23 from the Cobalts has a 3.84 final drive. I see the Cavalier F23 has a 3.94. The Fiero 282 Getrag has a 3.61.

So hold on a second... People have swapped in the earlier 3.84 and 3.94 F23s right? I thought the whole point of this apart from durability is cause the F23 has a taller final drive for better cruising rpm??

Ahh you edited when I was writing this haha.

[This message has been edited by nitroheadz28 (edited 05-01-2011).]

Have any of you put the F23 in yet if so can you pleas post pic's on what you did for the shift cable linkage and mounts

[This message has been edited by engine man (edited 05-02-2011).]

Did a quick look on Cars.com research and between the

2001 cavalier with 2200
2005 cavalier with 2.2 ecotec
2005 cobalt with 2.2 ecotec
and 2010 cobalt with 2.2 ecotec

they all have the same gear ratios but different axle ratios.

01 Cavalier has 3.94
05 Cavalier has 3.94

so either cavalier motor has the same "transmission" but different "bell housings"

05 Cobalt has 3.58
10 Cobalt has 3.63

so this means if you want the lowest cruising rpm you should find a 2005 cobalt with the 2.2 ecotec but bolt on the 2001 Cavalier 2200 bell housing. **This is assuming they bolt up together which people still want visual proof of**

**NOTE**
**This Is Assuming The Information Given On Cars.com Is Correct And That Each Of These Transmissions Is Even The F23. Please Correct Me If I'm Wrong.**

I want the 3.94 gear i could care less if it gets 3 more miles to the gallon i just want it to get up and go

quote Originally posted by engine man: Have any of you put the F23 in yet if so can you pleas post pic's on what you did for the shift cable linkage and mounts

Heres a picture of my original mock up of the modification at the trans mission to correct the shift pattern and the way I mounted and ran the two stock getrag select cables... Clearly not pretty but also was just a mock up Ive since made prettier brackets but dont have any available pictures currently. Ive had zero issues with this design in 7k+ miles.



Its a little hard to tell how the cables were ran exactly in the picture but it should give you a good idea. If you have any questions feel free to PM me as I tend to forget about these threads.

Damn this is a let down, I wasn't aware that the Cav F23s had such high final drives. 3.94? Thats pretty bad for highway cruising . Why would a bellhousing swap be necessary for the 05 F23?

quote Originally posted by nitroheadz28: Damn this is a let down, I wasn't aware that the Cav F23s had such high final drives. 3.94? Thats pretty bad for highway cruising . Why would a bellhousing swap be necessary for the 05 F23?

The only engine that came in the 2005 Cavalier is the 2.2 Ecotec which as stated does not use the common FWD bolt pattern.

quote Originally posted by nitroheadz28: Damn this is a let down, I wasn't aware that the Cav F23s had such high final drives. 3.94? Thats pretty bad for highway cruising .

I played with the calculator here (down at the bottom for manual entry). The F23's taller 5th gear helps a bit. At 70mph I came up with only a 150 rpm rise.

quote Originally posted by schmoken: I played with the calculator here (down at the bottom for manual entry). The F23's taller 5th gear helps a bit. At 70mph I came up with only a 150 rpm rise.

Is that over the 282 Getrag?

quote Originally posted by nitroheadz28: Is that over the 282 Getrag?

Yes I should have been more specific.

Thanks. Hmmm weighing my options here. I want to start a swap by mid june. Either the L61 with F23 or the 3800 and stock getrag, argh I can't decide! I really thought that the F23 would make a better tranny for cruising but eh, the more important thing to note is that the 1st-2nd shift comes later than the 282. City driving with the stock 5 speed is annoying when first gear barely gets you anywhere.

Consider the parts availability too. My 282 has a leaky input seal. The ONE place I found that has one is drivetrain.com.... only as part of their $450 rebuild kit. And they said it was their last one.

Unless plans fall through I'm picking up a 2000 cav F23 tomorrow.

[This message has been edited by schmoken (edited 05-04-2011).]

Got it!

The input splines are about a 1/4" shorter than the 282. Is this gonna be a problem?

282:


F23:

quote Originally posted by schmoken: The input splines are about a 1/4" shorter than the 282. Is this gonna be a problem?

The flywheel/clutch face will be about .83" from the bellhousing face, so as long as your clutch disk hub doesn't protrude much more than 1/4" to the flywheel side you should still have 100% spline engagement. You will probably find that the splines go further into the transmission as well, since the HTOB does not need the protruding sleeve for the throwout bearing to ride on.

Great news thanks!

Here's what I came up with for the select cable. I used the stock bracket off of the 282 and just cut the legs off. I found some scrap and came up with this:

Bracket update. This is a meld of the brackets from both the 282 and the F23:



I'm waiting on another select cable from Rodney Dickman, so here's my one select cable in each position.

select:


shift:

quote Originally posted by schmoken: Bracket update. This is a meld of the brackets from both the 282 and the F23:

You'll need to gusset that a LOT more or you'll tear it apart trying to shift quickly.

Very interesting solution, though. I'm curious to hear about how well it works.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 05-13-2011).]

Today I put 70 miles on my 500-mile 2000 Cav F23 behind my 2.8... to work and back, no problems yet.

65mph is right at 2500rpm w 225/50/16s.
Don't remember what it was before.

[This message has been edited by schmoken (edited 06-05-2011).]

Just need some info to make sure what I read on this swap is correct.. So the f23 is like are old getrags, but stronger. I might want to mount it up to a 3800sc. To do the swap, all i need is the 3800sc flywheel, 2.8 clutch and pressure plate. Rodney D's fwd getrag conversion kit, and custom cables. Is this true? Please help me to make sure that I got the correct information on this. I want to get the car running with a strong 5 speed. The f40 is just a little pricey to complete. I want this car to run so I can move on to something else. Thanks for your time and help.

my understanding is that the F23 is nothing like the old getrags, being that it is a 3 shaft trans, and has no external slave cylinder.

Oh, so its more like the f40 trans but a 5 speed? Im lost now.

Between this thread and this one, all of your questions should be answered.