If you actually read the comments I believe you will find that the motor is not from a Fiero but is a tranplanted, it's a "flat-plane 2.8L V6 from the Vauxhall Vectra VXR." Sure sounds nice though.
[This message has been edited by infinitewill (edited 06-18-2010).]
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06:06 PM
RUNDLC Member
Posts: 802 From: Elk Grove, California Registered: Jul 2005
LOL, LOL, LOL Speed your crazy! That is too funny-good one.
Too bad CA. smog nazi's wouldn't let that happen here. I did a little research and it looks like the car with that engine will be in the states in late 2010.
What the heck is a flat plane motor/cam anyway? IS THERE A MOTOR LIKE THIS IN A U.S. CAR NOW??
[This message has been edited by RUNDLC (edited 06-18-2010).]
Originally posted by infinitewill: If you actually read the comments I believe you will find that the motor is not from a Fiero but is a tranplanted, it's a "flat-plane 2.8L V6 from the Vauxhall Vectra VXR." Sure sounds nice though.
I'm not sure that's true. From the other thread in General Chat, from the guy from Taiwan, it seems this is his buddy's car, and it is a stock 2.8, but with a custom exhaust, rather than the stock. I think it just has pretty long exhaust runners at or near 120 degrees. I'm not sure exactly where that exhaust would go in the Fiero bay, but perhaps you could ask for some pictures of the engine.
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07:29 PM
infinitewill Member
Posts: 2336 From: Overland Park, KS U.S.A. Registered: Mar 2009
I lecture with a guy from Taipei. I will be seeing him on Sunday and I will have him translate for me. Isn't the Vauxhall Vectra VXR a Subaru Rally car? A flat 6 ( like the Porsche boxer) uses opposing banks of 3 cylinders but how the heck could you possibly fit that in a Fiero? Something is getting lost in translation
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[This message has been edited by infinitewill (edited 06-18-2010).]
Originally posted by infinitewill: I lecture with a guy from Taipei. I will be seeing him on Sunday and I will have him translate for me. Isn't the Vauxhall Vectra VXR a Subaru Rally car? A flat 6 ( like the Porsche boxer) uses opposing banks of 3 cylinders but how the heck could you possibly fit that in a Fiero? Something is getting lost in translation
I don't think the comment on the youtube video suggesting it is a Vauxhall engine is not from the owner of the car. It's from a random commenter suggesting that it is that based on the sound of the exhaust.
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08:37 PM
RUNDLC Member
Posts: 802 From: Elk Grove, California Registered: Jul 2005
Good points, I have a lambo replica with ALL kinds of room in the engine bay! I am licking my chops to see how this was done. With that sound I may just opt to leave the engine in as long as I can have that sound.
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08:50 PM
Blacktree Member
Posts: 20770 From: Central Florida Registered: Dec 2001
A flat-plane crankshaft will not work in a V6. A flat-plane crankshaft has the crank pins 180 degrees apart. But a 6-cylinder engine's firing sequence is every 240 degrees of crankshaft rotation.
The cool sounds coming from that V6 are probably from a custom exhaust and / or intake setup.
[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 06-18-2010).]
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10:55 PM
Jun 19th, 2010
Erik Member
Posts: 5625 From: Des Moines, Iowa Registered: Jul 2002
A flat-plane crankshaft will not work in a V6. A flat-plane crankshaft has the crank pins 180 degrees apart. But a 6-cylinder engine's firing sequence is every 240 degrees of crankshaft rotation.
The cool sounds coming from that V6 are probably from a custom exhaust and / or intake setup.
120 degree firing pulses which are the same as a lambo just half of the cylinders ..its all a matter of intake and exhaust tubing size, exhaust gas velocities, rpms and of course firing intervals ..oh and some expensive black magic ..
[This message has been edited by Erik (edited 06-19-2010).]
Dude I wish I could make a 60degree engine sound like that. I would spend the money on the f355 kit n run round like I actually owned a ferrari. That's the only reason I refuse to buy the body setup because yes you may make it look like one but you will never get it to sound like a real one.
Originally posted by kikinz24: Dude I wish I could make a 60degree engine sound like that. I would spend the money on the f355 kit n run round like I actually owned a ferrari. That's the only reason I refuse to buy the body setup because yes you may make it look like one but you will never get it to sound like a real one.
You can make any engine sound however you want, if you've got the room to do it in the exhaust routing. It's purely a matter of physics, available space, and $$$.
And even if you have a 2.8 unfer a F355 body, sounding exactly like a Ferrari does, it still won't perform like one. Sound is easy. Performance is a lot harder.
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09:55 AM
Blacktree Member
Posts: 20770 From: Central Florida Registered: Dec 2001
Yeah, I had headers on the brain when I made my last post. (each bank gets an exhaust pulse every 240 degrees of crankshaft rotation)
Speaking of headers, the guy who made the video seems to be saying that he had a custom exhaust made with long-tube headers.
Yeah I noticed that too
To get that sound from a 2.8 I would personally fabricate headers with a 1.25 to 1.5 inch diameter header primary in the 26 to 30 inch length with 2 inch diameter 3 into 1 merge collectors. I would use straight through 2 inch diameter mufflers in a true dual exhaust with small diameter ansa resonated tips. Keep the exhaust routing short and equal length. route the front header collector over the trans rather than the stock exhaust routing to keep the system short. Short, small diameter, high velocity all will help raise the pitch and make it sound like its high rpm which with a 2.8 is not too hard since it will rev to 7 k
edit You will also want to think about the intake side since it plays a big role in the sound too ..i would try a small diameter CAI and play with the length to find a sweet spot where it resonates with the exhaust
[This message has been edited by Erik (edited 06-19-2010).]
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03:16 PM
Erik Member
Posts: 5625 From: Des Moines, Iowa Registered: Jul 2002
You can make any engine sound however you want, if you've got the room to do it in the exhaust routing. It's purely a matter of physics, available space, and $$$.
And even if you have a 2.8 unfer a F355 body, sounding exactly like a Ferrari does, it still won't perform like one. Sound is easy. Performance is a lot harder.
I disagree getting a certain sound is just as hard if not harder to achieve.
To get that sound from a 2.8 I would personally fabricate headers with a 1.25 to 1.5 inch diameter header primary in the 26 to 30 inch length with 2 inch diameter 3 into 1 merge collectors. I would use straight through 2 inch diameter mufflers in a true dual exhaust with small diameter ansa resonated tips. Keep the exhaust routing short and equal length. route the front header collector over the trans rather than the stock exhaust routing to keep the system short. Short, small diameter, high velocity all will help raise the pitch and make it sound like its high rpm which with a 2.8 is not too hard since it will rev to 7 k
Well, almost, but..... I will be revealling the following in July or August latest
1.5" headers, 32" primaries, into 3" collector necked down to 2.5" true duals with Car Chemistry inserts to dampen the sound. Stay tuned.
Arn
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03:24 PM
Erik Member
Posts: 5625 From: Des Moines, Iowa Registered: Jul 2002
Looking at the pics, it is a stock motor but that exhaust is strange. In one of the pics, it looks like the 2 outside cylinders are going to one exhaust and he split the middle cylinder to another. Then looking at the underside pictures, I don't know where the right side disappears to.
Edit.....you beat me by a few minutes about the header split
[This message has been edited by IMSA GT (edited 06-28-2010).]
it seems like the pirmaries are grouped 1+5, 2+6, and then 3 and 4 are on their own. if you organized this in the right order in the collector youd get the scavenging effect that 180* headers provide.
thing is stock even fire 60* v6 configurations already provide an even every other pulse scavenge. this looks/sounds like every exhaust pulse will scavenge the previous.
[This message has been edited by notsonic (edited 07-05-2010).]
it seems like the primaries are grouped 1+5, 2+6, and then 3 and 4 are on their own. if you organized this in the right order in the collector youd get the scavenging effect that 180* headers provide.
thing is stock even fire 60* v6 configurations already provide an even every other pulse scavenge. this looks/sounds like every exhaust pulse will scavenge the previous.
A 1/5, 2/6, 3/4 header configuration like you describe (and I agree, it looks like he has) would provide HORRIBLE scavenging. The exhaust pulses are not evenly spaced in any of those pairs. You are seeing pulses every 2 and 4 firing events in the first two pairs and 1 and 5 firing events in the collector connected to 3/4.
A 6 into 3 configuration for good scavenging would go 1/4, 2/5, 3/6 so that each collector sees an exhaust pulse every three firing events.
Perhaps this just makes good sound, not hp?
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08:51 AM
Francis T Member
Posts: 6620 From: spotsylvania va. usa Registered: Oct 2003
One oter factor should be considered if you want it to sound more like a race or h pro engine, and that's the RPMs, reving it higher makes a big dif, especailly with headers. Add a carb or replace the stock intake and add good headers and it won't sound like a Fiero.
BTW: for guy that wants to build custom headers with 1.5" runners @ 30 or so inches, the 1.5" runners area good dia size -we use it on ours- however I doubt very much you'll find anywhere near the room for runners that long. Just look at ours or a set of the old FOCA headers which are simular -equal lenght- and you'll see what I mean. The front side of the engine is quite tight.
...Use the mufflers from an 98/01 Ford Contour SVT,use as much of the exhaust system as you can adapt to your V6 Fiero,,you will have to run dual exhaust ,,the SVT has an awsome sound ..It will not replicate overpriced exotic I tal e ann Iron..But the sound is as near to "Boss Nascar" as you will get.. ..The problem ?? finding one in the boneyard..or the price from Ford performance,, if still available ..I imagine one of the mufflers on a V6 single exhaust would sound good .. ..The system is dyno tuned for the contour V6 .along with intake manifold porting by hi speed flopping metalic enbedded clay ..The sound is the only one I ever heard better than a glasspack
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11:44 AM
Jul 12th, 2010
americasfuture2k Member
Posts: 7131 From: Edmond, Oklahoma Registered: Jan 2006
For comparison, someone on the 60degreeV6 forums recently finished a set of headers like these for his Monte Carlo on a 3400. He had a video but I found it hard to hear very well, though he claims it sounds just like the that Fiero. I'll find the build thread when I return from class.
Here is Bob's build thread http://60degreev6.com/forum...e-Build-Thread/page7 I listened to the video again and the idle sounded like any other 60degreeV6 and he didn't really rev it up high enough to get the right sound I think.
[This message has been edited by KaijuSenso (edited 10-05-2011).]
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09:44 AM
JSzpotek Member
Posts: 227 From: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Registered: Jun 2010
The reason why it sounds different is because its not a stock GM 2.8L, instead its the 2.8L from a Vauxhall Vectra VXR. The exhaust system is probably either stock or just with the cat removed.
quote
Originally posted by RUNDLC:
I don't know if this is a re-post or not but I want to know if any of you guys know how this guy achieved this sound with a 2.8
Originally posted by JSzpotek: The reason why it sounds different is because its not a stock GM 2.8L, instead its the 2.8L from a Vauxhall Vectra VXR. The exhaust system is probably either stock or just with the cat removed.
We wish people would stop spreading this misinformation. The engine in that Taiwanese Fiero is a stock 2.8L engine. The exhaust system is nowhere near stock, and has the cat and mufflers removed, with the only piece of sound dampening equipment in the exhaust being a resonator.
[This message has been edited by dobey (edited 10-05-2011).]
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01:04 PM
DMendez7 Member
Posts: 118 From: El Paso, Texas Registered: Apr 2010
It's very easy to do. More to the point, I think most of the people capable of doing it, aren't really interested in keeping the 2.8.
Yeah, true. Now that i have my engine out i would want to make this exhaust mod happen but i really can't figure out the specific steps that were done on that custom exhaust. So many people are saying different stuff/ideas, for example that Vauxhall 2.8L engine myth, took me a while to figure it out that that wasn't the case.
Originally posted by DMendez7: Yeah, true. Now that i have my engine out i would want to make this exhaust mod happen but i really can't figure out the specific steps that were done on that custom exhaust. So many people are saying different stuff/ideas, for example that Vauxhall 2.8L engine myth, took me a while to figure it out that that wasn't the case.
It is actually done quite similar to how We will be doing Our LS4 exhaust.
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03:06 PM
Rick 88 Member
Posts: 3914 From: El Paso, TX. Registered: Aug 2001
We wish people would stop spreading this misinformation. The engine in that Taiwanese Fiero is a stock 2.8L engine. The exhaust system is nowhere near stock, and has the cat and mufflers removed, with the only piece of sound dampening equipment in the exhaust being a resonator.
The car in the video has a stock 2.8. The exhaust system was fabricated there in Taiwan by a guy that knew exhaust tuning. It uses a small diesel resonator, with not cat, or muffler. I actually was in contact with one of the guys there that knew this car. The car has been sitting for a number of years but still has the system on it. Another member here on the forum was trying to duplicate this exhaust, but I am not sure if he ever finished it. Even it did not improve the performance of the engine, I would purchase it for the great sound it makes.
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07:16 PM
nitroheadz28 Member
Posts: 4774 From: Brooklyn, NY Registered: Mar 2010
Someone needs to get on this already, so much interest surrounding a system like this and no one has really attempted and completed one yet? Lets do it!
The car in the video has a stock 2.8. The exhaust system was fabricated there in Taiwan by a guy that knew exhaust tuning. It uses a small diesel resonator, with not cat, or muffler. I actually was in contact with one of the guys there that knew this car. The car has been sitting for a number of years but still has the system on it. Another member here on the forum was trying to duplicate this exhaust, but I am not sure if he ever finished it. Even it did not improve the performance of the engine, I would purchase it for the great sound it makes.
