quote Originally posted by phonedawgz: Damn - the easiest way to replace the throw out bearing is to drop the cradle. Just think about it for now. Maybe the noise will go away. Maybe you will find other things you want to correct if/when you drop the cradle. Dropping the cradle IS the easiest way to do it. Any other way ends up being much more work. As long as it's only making noise for now drive it and see what happens.

Indeed, Im just worried about getting the proper amount of travel from the slave right now.

So have you tried bleeding it again?

quote Originally posted by phonedawgz: So have you tried bleeding it again?

Have not been over there to bleed it again. I think we are going to borrow a vacuum bleeder and see if we can go that route.

You can try the vacuum however one of the problems with using the vacuum on the clutch is that the slave cylinder uses an unbrella seal. When you apply pressure, the seal pushes out more and seals to the outside better. Disk brakes use a square shaped seal that gets out of square when you push the pedal, and when the seal returns to its square shape it retracts the puck slightly. The problem with the unbrella seal in the slave of the Fiero is many times it will let air in when vacuum bleeding and other times it will let air IN when the pedal is returning to rest.

Vacuum and see what you get but be ready to do a little pump at the end to see if you can get the air out of it. It also helps to take the cylinder off of the bracket and tilt it so the bleeder is up. IF you do take the cylinder off of the bracket, and the slaves piston gets all the way to the end of the slave cylinder, you will encounter a hard pedal since the piston can't move any further. IF you force the pedal at this point, you will bend the pedal's master cylinder rod attachment bracket and MC's rod, so be careful not to force the pedal.

Something I've experienced with the vacuum bleeder is that it pulls air around the threads of the bleeder screw. The pump and bleed method can break up the air bubbles into much smaller bubbles that don't bleed away and they later collect back together to form a large air bubble. I've had the most success with the gravity bleeding method.

Jack the left front of the car up high enough that the master is higher than the slave. In doing this, you also raise the bleeder end of the slave higher than the pushrod end so air bubbles inside the slave will float upward toward the bleeder screw. Top off the master cylinder then go to the back and open the bleeder screw. You can watch the reservoir and top it off about 3 times. After filling it 3 times and the fluid level drops, approaching the full mark, go to the rear and close the bleeder valve. This is generally enough fluid passing through the system to remove all the air bubbles. It's an easy one man system. I've even driven the left front up on a curb in a parking lot when I've had trouble or at an angle in a steep driveway.

quote Originally posted by fierofool: Something I've experienced with the vacuum bleeder is that it pulls air around the threads of the bleeder screw. The pump and bleed method can break up the air bubbles into much smaller bubbles that don't bleed away and they later collect back together to form a large air bubble. I've had the most success with the gravity bleeding method. Jack the left front of the car up high enough that the master is higher than the slave. In doing this, you also raise the bleeder end of the slave higher than the pushrod end so air bubbles inside the slave will float upward toward the bleeder screw. Top off the master cylinder then go to the back and open the bleeder screw. You can watch the reservoir and top it off about 3 times. After filling it 3 times and the fluid level drops, approaching the full mark, go to the rear and close the bleeder valve. This is generally enough fluid passing through the system to remove all the air bubbles. It's an easy one man system. I've even driven the left front up on a curb in a parking lot when I've had trouble or at an angle in a steep driveway.

I will try this, seems like any easy thing to do, so just let fluid flow out the bleeder screw and make sure there is fluid in the master cylinder and i will be fine, correct?

Yes. It's a very simple process. You could take the handle of a wratchet and bump the bottom side of the slave to dislodge any bubbles that might be stuck to the bore of the slave. Just loosen the bleeder enough to let the fluid flow. The fluid doesn't flow all that quickly so it's easy to keep the reservoir topped off. I usually leave my boxed end wrench on the bleeder screw so it's just a simple quick twist to close it.

When you installed the new slave, I hope you reinstalled the heat shield otherwise you're eventually going to have this problem, again.

quote Originally posted by fierofool: Yes. It's a very simple process. You could take the handle of a wratchet and bump the bottom side of the slave to dislodge any bubbles that might be stuck to the bore of the slave. Just loosen the bleeder enough to let the fluid flow. The fluid doesn't flow all that quickly so it's easy to keep the reservoir topped off. I usually leave my boxed end wrench on the bleeder screw so it's just a simple quick twist to close it. When you installed the new slave, I hope you reinstalled the heat shield otherwise you're eventually going to have this problem, again.

Well there wasnt a heat shield there when i took it off before, but now that you mention it there was a weird piece of metal in the storage compartment, and i believe that it what it is. i will put it back. Ha

When you install it, be sure that it doesn't affect the positioning of the slave. If you mount it between the slave and bracket, it moves the slave away from the release fork. It should be installed with the ears between the bracket and the retainer nuts.

There's no need to quote unless there's something specific that you want to point out or question.

Made some progress today.

We did locate the heat shield in the bottom of the storage area in the rear.

After gravity bleeding the clutch system we have a much more firm pedal and getting better travel although we have not measured it.

The throwout bearing really needs to be changed, if not then ear muffs will be required while driving.

At first we thought the calipers were salvageable but it seems we cant get the pistons to compress...

We also replaced the emergency brake cables, but there is a problem with the handle inside the car because it is not releasing.


Have not fiddled with the engine anymore. The time we had it running it idled fine but there is a slight hesitation that will need to be diagnosed. The water temp gauge will need to be fixed or an aftermarket one installed. Oil pressure gauge seems to be working fine and have good steady pressure.

The check engine light was on so i pulled codes and got nothing... just 12 over and over and over. The haynes says after 3 cycles of 12 then it will flash the code but maybee someone can shed some light on that situation.

quote Originally posted by the300zxmaster: Made some progress today. ... At first we thought the calipers were salvageable but it seems we cant get the pistons to compress... ....

The calipers do not compress like most cars. You have to use a tool designed to rotate them. They "screw" in.

^ What topcat said. Remove the emergency brake arm from the back of the caliper and use the special tool to turn pistons back into the bore.
http://fierostore.com/Produ...px?s=58600&d=202&p=1

Also available at your local parts stores. The emergency brake cable generally seizes inside the body of the car and in the sleeve just before the calipers.

quote Originally posted by fierofool: ^ What topcat said. Remove the emergency brake arm from the back of the caliper and use the special tool to turn pistons back into the bore. http://fierostore.com/Produ...px?s=58600&d=202&p=1 Also available at your local parts stores. The emergency brake cable generally seizes inside the body of the car and in the sleeve just before the calipers.

This is what i was going to try next. I do know that some require the screw in method. My mazda6 have these type pistons as well.

Ok you have me giggleing here. The Fiero's brake handle is different from other car's brake handle. After setting, the brake handle will go back to the rest position even though the brake is still applied. That is so you can get out of the car with the brake on.

To release the brake, pull up on the handle and push the button. Once you have the pressure of the brakes "on the button" hold the button in and lower the handle.

If the parking brakes are not adjusted correctly and pull the inner cable back the brake light stays on. You can get the light to go off by having the cables adjusted correctly. As a temp fix just have someone pull the cable in back while someone inside releases the brake handle.

As an addendum to phonedawg's advice on the temp sending unit. Don't get one from Advance. They are made by Borg Warner, but they are junk. I am in the process of returning the 2nd one in 2 days that pegs the gauge shortly after start up of a cold engine. I went through the same thing several years ago and finally went to NAPA or AutoZone and got one that worked correctly.

If the plastic terminal is broken from your harness, the green with yellow tracer wire goes on the pin nearest the open side of the sensor. If they are reversed, the temp idiot light will come on. The gauge will peg at startup but will still work properly without swapping the wires in the instrument panel.

The reason I don't refer to the colors of the temp gauge sender/temp light is that if someone already did the fix listed, the function the wires changes. It's better just to check and see which one is hooked to the light/gauge.

Would this be the correct Throwout bearing that I would need? If so i'll go ahead and get it ordered and while Im waiting on it, I will get the caliper compression tool and see How she drives just up my road and back. (~.5 mile) must fix the temp guage. Also, the Fuel gauge didnt work, and the floater was definately fine when I had the tank dropped. And if anyone reading this has a stock air box they would like to get rid of please let me know. TIY

This is the throwout bearing I was referring too, I forgot to post the link. http://www.oreillyauto.com/...g&pt=1330P&ppt=C0015

Did you check the resistance of the gas gauge when you had the tank out?

Let us know the progress on the temp gauge and we will walk you through fixing it.

That appears to be the correct bearing. It should have flat spots on the sides where it slides into the release fork. Just tell them you want it for an 85 4-speed V6.

quote Originally posted by fierofool: ... Just tell them you want it for an 85 4-speed V6.

So i take it the 85 and 86 are the same? does it make it easier by saying 85 or something? and Phonedawgz u said you were giggling about the e-brake thing. I know how to engage and disengage the e-brake, it just doesnt release once it is pulled. I think it may be in the body or under the lever itself as fierofool said.

quote Originally posted by 86FIFI: So i take it the 85 and 86 are the same? does it make it easier by saying 85 or something? and Phonedawgz u said you were giggling about the e-brake thing. I know how to engage and disengage the e-brake, it just doesnt release once it is pulled. I think it may be in the body or under the lever itself as fierofool said.

There are two switches that can turn on the brake warning light. You don't really know which one is doing it without checking. One is the combo-proportioning valve right by the brake master cylinder. It is the thing that looks like it is cut from an aluminum block with very square corners. It has two brake lines comeing from the brake MC and three leaving the valve. It also has an electrical wire connected to it. That wire gets grounded and the brake warning light comes on. That is for if one of the two hydraulic braking systems (front or back) fail.

If you use the tool to turn the pivot back you use a 3/8th inch extension into the square in the center of the tool.

The other is the parking brake. The parking brake will turn on the light if the pivot of the cable isn't pulled all the way released. The thing that pulls the pivot all the way released is the tension on the parking brake cables. So if the parking brake cable is missing or mis-adjusted the brake warning light switch will stay on all the time. The way to turn off the parking brake warning light switch is to properly release the parking brake, and if the tension on the parking brake cables aren't enough, have someone pull on the parking brake cable that comes from the cab as you are releasing it. That should turn your light off assuming the parking brake switch is the one that is turning it on.

IF that doesn't seem to turn the light off then try this - unplug the wire from the proportioning valve. If that turns the light off then you know that the proportioning valve is the one that is turning it on.

If somehow both are turning it on, you can't actually tell easily. The wire to the parking brake can be reached but the best way is to take out the drivers seat. That wire is just like the one on the proprotioning valve, it's only one wire, and it gets grounded to turn on the light.

Don't as a long term solution leave the wire off the proprotioning valve. It is needed to tell you of a braking system failure.

[This message has been edited by phonedawgz (edited 09-13-2010).]

wheres the dip stick on this thing, and advance says they have a thing for like $55 i can rent and use to compress the brakes, should be a little easier.

The dip stick is in the engine compartment between the engine and the passenger seat

Ok, thanks, I was wondering where it was hiding, the car calls for 3 qts of oil, right?

NO

4.5 quarts if you are using the stock filter, and changing the filter with the oil.

The 4 speed was used in the 84, 85 V6 and early 86 V6. The 86 also had 2 5 speeds available. The Getrag in the late V6's and the Isuzu in the 4 speeds. There is often confusion in the auto parts stores listings because of the 3 manual transmissions available in 86.

In 85 there were only 2 manual transmissions. The 4 speed in the V6's and the 5 speed Isuzu in the 4 cylinder cars. It's safer to ask for the bearing for the 85 V6 to be sure you get the right one the first time. All 3 manuals use different release bearings.

Thanks Fierofool, i went to advance and got him to print out the part # and everything for the throughout bearing for an 85 2.8L 4-speed only listing they had its $35 and some change, didnt have a pic though. But it was one of those deals where you have to pay before you order it so they must not be too popular. 300zxmaster mentioned buyin a clutch kit that includes the throwout bearing. What is your opinion on that. And phone, thanks for the oil tip, I wasnt sure how much oil and havent thought about looking for the dipstick when I was working on the car earlier.

Same goes for the clutch package in your case. Ask for a complete clutch package for an 85 2.8. It will assure you get the correct assembly the first time. FIY, all Fiero V6 clutch and pressure plates are the same. Just the release bearing is different, depending upon the transmission. While you're in there, might as well replace the complete assembly.

Personally I like the Luk clutch assemblies from Pep Boys. A little pricier than the other chain stores, but they hold up well for me and I do a lot of hard drivings in the mountains relative to Run For The Hills scouting runs and events. I don't do drifting or burnouts. If you get the clutch assembly you'll want to return the bearing you've ordered because the package will have one included.

So would it be wise to get a performance clutch kit, or just change the the bearing? I got the temp gauge working, I replaced the thermostat, and coolant temp sensor and it started working. I'm in the process of flushing the coolant system now because there was solid gunk in the reservoir. I got a MSD ignition coil just to upgrade from stock. Are they any good in the Fiero? And would getting the MSD distributor help anything or hurt? I'm going for the red color so as long as it won't hurt anything It is fine. I got my caliper in today and got them all painted, and parking brake cables all squared away. Main problem now is throwout bearing. Thanks for everything guys.

It's a pain to drop the cradle. It would really suck to replace the throw out bearing and have the clutch go bad shortly.

Choice of clutch kits depends upon how you plan to drive the car. If you're going to beat on it every chance you get, then get a Spec 2 or another high performance clutch. For everyday driving with some occasional performance stuff, the over the counter varieties are sufficient.

Remember that the weakest link is what breaks. What do you prefer to replace more often; transmissions and drive axels or clutch assemblies?

To check the accuracy of the new temp sending unit, start the car and let it idle until the cooling fan comes on. Your gauge should be indicating somewhere around 200 degrees when it kicks in. If not, and assuming that the fan switch is accurate, your temp sending unit is faulty. Hope you didn't get a BWD brand from Advance.

[This message has been edited by fierofool (edited 09-15-2010).]

Ok, I will probably go ahead and go with a clutch kit just to be safe, and I will probably go with the spec 2 idk how I will drive, but if she's got some power I will most likely use it. Where is the best place to get it from, and neither of yall commented on the ignition coil or msd distributor.