We also need to know what sensors and systems you are using with your swap. Do you have any EVAP equipment? The most basic vacuum lines that you need would be MAP and brake booster. Is that all you have or is there more?
Fuel pressure regulator, MAP, and one side of the boost bypass need to see vacuum and boost. Get the source from the port in the LIM. Brake booster line uses the large port from the throttle body.
Not to nitpic, but the bypass valve will not work if you hook it up like that. Also that brake booster location is usually much harder to pull off than using the port on the TB.
IP: Logged
12:54 PM
L67 Member
Posts: 1792 From: Winston Salem, NC Registered: Jun 2010
Originally posted by darkhorizon: Not to nitpic, but the bypass valve will not work if you hook it up like that
It's no problem. But tell me, why wouldn't it work like this? I had my BBV hooked up this way for years and it worked. What would be the benefit of using another port?
IP: Logged
04:13 PM
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
Not to nitpic, but the bypass valve will not work if you hook it up like that. Also that brake booster location is usually much harder to pull off than using the port on the TB.
Whats that line going to the fuel vapor canister? Whats it attached to, the FPR?
IP: Logged
09:17 PM
PFF
System Bot
L67 Member
Posts: 1792 From: Winston Salem, NC Registered: Jun 2010
ALJR, that's the EVAP purge valve, and it connects to the charcoal canister to scavenge fuel vapors away from the fuel tank. If this was left unhooked, the canister would fill and soak with fuel vapors. If the canister was unhooked, the vapors would vent to atmosphere. The best option it so have the engine burn them via a vacuum line.
Hobbs, the second diagram would also work fine. You would plug the throttle body nipple in the first diagram if it wasn't being used. You should consider using the purge valve to control the charcoal canister, otherwise it will cease to function correctly.
IP: Logged
09:30 PM
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
ALJR, that's the EVAP purge valve, and it connects to the charcoal canister to scavenge fuel vapors away from the fuel tank. If this was left unhooked, the canister would fill and soak with fuel vapors. If the canister was unhooked, the vapors would vent to atmosphere. The best option it so have the engine burn them via a vacuum line.
Hobbs, the second diagram would also work fine. You would plug the throttle body nipple in the first diagram if it wasn't being used. You should consider using the purge valve to control the charcoal canister, otherwise it will cease to function correctly.
Thanks and the charcoal canister is the one on the fiero originally?
IP: Logged
09:46 PM
L67 Member
Posts: 1792 From: Winston Salem, NC Registered: Jun 2010
You can use the original, yes. But the original requires a vacuum source at the top of the canister to open the flow, so you would need to run an additional vacuum source to open the can when the car is running. Or you could run the other source to the feed, and use the purge valve source to open the canister, it makes no difference. The later model canisters like that which can be found on the 3800 series II cars are always open, because the purge valve allowed the computer to control when the engine would pull the vapor fumes out of the canister. These can be used also, but are much larger than the original Fiero canister. Entirely up to you. Just remember that the older canister requires an addition vacuum source to use it.
IP: Logged
09:52 PM
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
The Fiero canister is a cylinder of course. The later model canisters come in both varieties, dependent on the source. The later year cylinders are for the most part shorter and have a wider diameter.
IP: Logged
12:14 AM
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
Justin, when/if you talk to Scott again, tell him I'd like to know what he was talking about above.
I removed the solenoid and electrical bits from the system when I was supercharged. It just needs a vacuum/boost line on the bottom of the bbv actuator. When there is vacuum the valve will open and allow air to bypass the supercharger, as vacuum goes into boost the valve will close. A lot more consistent this way.
Originally posted by darkhorizon: The boost control solenoid needs to be removed so that the BBV can close.... If not the pressure in the solenoid will keep it open.
My valve opened and closed correctly as long as I had it hooked up like that. I used to be able to play with the throttle and watch the arm move.
IP: Logged
03:56 PM
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
Originally posted by darkhorizon: You probably had it hooked up wrong then.
No, correctly using the '97 vacuum tree and connected as I illustrated first post. The BBV worked correctly. I also know of another person that used this method for maybe 3 years before going turbo. That's why I ask what you're basing this on. The lower half of the valve was connected to an inoperative controller which vented to atmosphere. I could look through the rear window while driving and see it opening and closing, depending on throttle. Here's a picture:
IP: Logged
09:32 PM
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
What's pictured is a 1997 supercharger which had a vacuum tree on the side. Your supercharger won't have a vacuum tree, there will be a little hump where it used to be - this is normal. I had my boost bypass valve connected to that tree. You're saying you don't have the boost bypass valve, and that's why I said before:
quote
Originally posted by L67: Deleting the BBV is only going to mess with your idle quality, and reduce fuel economy.
That valve opens when the engine see's vacuum to circulate boost so that it doesn't stack in the intake when you're at idle. If it stacks your fuel will compensate and result in poor fuel economy, while you're not even moving. It also will lead to a rough/poor idle quality. You should put it back on. The other end of the boost bypass valve connects to a solenoid that's controlled by the computer. The computer can open the valve when you're in reverse or cruising. Having this solenoid is pointless when using an manual transmission, and so most people don't connect it to the computer (as can be seen in my photo).
Long and the short, you need to put the valve back on the supercharger. It's not going to sound any more aggressive and its going to hurt your economy and idle. You can hook the top port of the valve to any vacuum source on the engine behind the throttle body. What Darkhorizon (Scott) is saying is that leaving the bottom port hooked to the solenoid will prevent the diaphragm inside the valve from moving the way it was intended. I can't say I agree, mine worked absolutely fine for an extended period of time.
[This message has been edited by L67 (edited 02-01-2011).]
IP: Logged
11:04 PM
PFF
System Bot
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
Any vacuum source other than the one going to the fuel canister "output". You said you were planning to use the Fiero canister, so it would be alright to use the same vacuum source as the line going to the top of the canister to open the valve. Just don't put it on the same line that the vapors are being sucked down. For that matter it's worth stating, the vapor line should be on its own, don't put anything else on it (fuel pressure regulator, MAP, BBV, et cetera). Make sense?
IP: Logged
12:55 AM
dhobbs84sc Member
Posts: 407 From: Connersville, Indiana Registered: Jun 2009
and the charcoal canister is the one on the fiero originally?
