Ok as it says in the title learning to drive manual in this fiero and after stalling a few times it won't start....it will turn over and try but won't start back up. Any thoughts?

You killed the car?

No just after stalling a bit it stops starting. But after we let it sit for a while it starts right back up like nothing happened. We don't think its related to the stalling. Ya think it could be the starter going bad?

Does the starter crank the engine? Does the starter do anything?

If it turns the engine over at the normal starting speed it is not the starter.

If it turns the engine over real slowly it is probably not the starter, it is a low battery.

If it just clicks and does not turn the engine over it might be a bad starter or a low battery.

If it does nothing it might be the starter, a dead battery, a bad switch, or a bad electrical system.

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Jim Martin
White '86 GT
Monterey, California

ok sry i wasnt more descriptive >.< but no it turns over just fine at its normal speed just wont get going unless we let it sit

Wait a minute. I just re-read your post again (many times in an attempt to figure out what you are trying to say) and I realized that you are trying to learn how to drive a manual.

There is a safety switch on the clutch to stop you from starting it unless the clutch is in, so you won't start it in gear. Make sure the clutch is in.

There may also be a neutral safety switch (I'm not sure, mine does not have one) so make sure it is in neutral too.

yes i knew that lol i always make sure its in neutral and clutch is in but even then it starts up even if i dont have the clutch in. Only time i have a problem is after repeated starts.

Does it sound like it's trying to start? Any pops or sputtering?

nope just turns over normally like its trying to start normally no other sounds from what i can hear

[This message has been edited by spartan_chaz (edited 11-15-2011).]

That kind of sounds like its flooding, but that shouldn't happen with fuel injection.

By the way, is it a Duke or V-6?

2.8 V6

Watch the tach. If the tach isn't moving up to 200 rpm during cranking you have an ignition problem.

Does this car fire up right away, or does it normally take some cranking before it fires?

What I think your problem is, is that your fuel pump is running on the oil pressure switch only.

GM designed two ways for the fuel pump to be powered. The first is the fuel pump relay. The second is the oil pressure switch. Either will fully power the pump.

To hear what the fuel pump running sounds like, from cold start the car, and as soon as it starts, turn off the engine and listen for the fuel pump to run for a few seconds after. It will run for a bit after because you still have oil pressure.

Turn off the radio, turn the heater to off close the door so the dinger isn't dinging and turn off the cruise control.

Now turn the key back to on, but don't crank the engine. The fuel pump should run for two seconds and then shut off. There should be a click coming from the engine compartment when the fuel pump turns off. Perhaps you will not hear the fuel pump run, but you will hear the click two seconds after turning the key to on.

Next to double check, bump the starter. Just turn it to start long enough for the starter to engage but release the key right away. The fuel pump should again be turned on for two seconds by the relay. Again you should hear a click from the fuel pump relay when it turns off.

It sounds like it is not getting spark or fuel. Could be either one.

Your job, should you decide to accept it, is to determine which one is missing and why.

The fuel pump relay is located IN THE ENGINE COMPARTMENT, behind (actually in front of) the air filter can, on the firewall, located right behind the drivers seat. There is an AC relay located right there also. Swap the wires between the two relays and see if this fixes your problem.

ok so swap those two relays then? Only thing is i have to go out driving again >.< but if i switch those relays and say they were all ready in the right spots it wont hurt anything will it?

The relays are identical.....they were in the right spots...it's just an easy way to test for a bad relay.

lol oh ok i see >.< ill try and do it first thing tomorrow morning!

fyi - the fuel pump relay is the one with the Dk Green/White, Tan/White, Orange/Black, and Black wires on it/

The AC relay is the one with the Dk Blue, Lt Blue, Dk Green and Black wires on it.

It might disable your AC, that is if your AC is still working and assuming you find the fuel pump relay itself is bad.

If your AC was working, and swapping the relays fixes it, then replace the bad relay after testing to determine it is bad.

Also if the relay was off of it's hanger and hanging upside down, and the relay base filled with water, expect the contacts in the relay base to be bad and need cleaning and/or replacing. And yes hang up your relays when you are done with them.

Oh - one more thing. Yeah there are two clips that hold the relay base to the relay itself. And the easiest way to get to swapping the relays is to first unscrew the hanger from the firewall. Don't bother swapping the relays on the hanger, just swap the wires to the relays. They will reach swapped.

The size of the hex head screws that hold the hanger to the firewall - 9/32 in english.(I think)

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If this fixes it - the reason it does - With the fuel pump running on just the oil pressure switch you can't build up enough oil pressure on a warmed up, but worn engine at cranking speeds to turn the pump on. But with the engine running it's no problem. Also with the engine/oil cold it is no problem.

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Fuel pump noise


Also - The ECM won't always run the two second prime when you turn the key on. It WILL if the key was off for at least 30 seconds. But don't be surprised if it won't if you cycle the key off then back on fast like the guy in the video is doing. The ECM will however always run the fuel pump if you bump the starter (assuming the relay is working correctly)

[This message has been edited by phonedawgz (edited 11-16-2011).]

ok have an update for ya i now can drive manual fine and sometimes the car still wont start. The realays are fine and when i crank it the rpm just stays at 0 doesnt go up to 200 like you said. So, we thought ignition so it wouldnt start today and my friend just said go give the ditributor some "love" like you would an old computer lol and it worked! Then, it wouldnt start again so poped the hood and bumped it again it once again started right up. So how do i got about checking if its the distibutor or the cap? Always had a car that used coil packs lol

Sounds like you have a fussy connector on the ICM....

It also may be a bad pick-up coil in the distributor or a bad ICM....but first thing, un-plug the connectors and clean them up a bit...make sure you don't pinch the wires when you put the cap back on....

Are you listening for the fuel pump?

Unlike a carb engine, a fuel injected engine won't even try to start without the fuel pump running

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Test the pick up coil with this procedure. Note - you don't need to remove the distributor to test it. You do need to remove it to replace the pick up coil however.

Also take the ICM to your parts store for testing. ALWAYS use thermal paste under the ICM when re-installing it.



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Procedure for replacing the pick up coil IF IF it tests bad.
Removing the distributor


Replacing the pick up coil




Replacing the distributor



Timing the engine after replacing the distributor into the block

[This message has been edited by phonedawgz (edited 11-18-2011).]