So I understand the concept of using a 4x4 and a floor jack just forward of the cradle.



But where exactly should the 4x4 rest? It wasn't obvious when I looked underneath.

[This message has been edited by masospaghetti (edited 03-28-2013).]

When I used that method, I put the 4x4 between the two red points on the pic above.

You will see where the car jack normally fits. It's almost straight down from the door lock. There is an open space in the facia that the jack fits into. If you use a 4 x 4 you should have a small piece about 1 and a half inches high sitting on top of each end of the 4x4. to hit where the jack would. The risers keep the cooling lines from kinking and put the weight where GM meant it to be. Look at the red lines in the prevous reply. Not on the floor pan, gas tank, cooling lines or facia. I made a pretty easy and safe lift. Send me a PM and I'll forward pics and specs.

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woodys 427

Gall757, thanks for the diagram. Very helpful.

CowsPatoot: do you end the 4x4 short of the cooling lines? There doesn't seem to be enough clearance otherwise and the cooling pipes will get crushed.

woodyhere: I didn't realize risers were needed. That explains a lot.

The 4x4 with risers sounds like an excellent lift tool Woody! Can I get the dimensions?

quote Originally posted by masospaghetti: Gall757, thanks for the diagram. Very helpful. CowsPatoot: do you end the 4x4 short of the cooling lines? There doesn't seem to be enough clearance otherwise and the cooling pipes will get crushed. woodyhere: I didn't realize risers were needed. That explains a lot.

This has actually been a long term project and is still sitting on that 4x4 in my basement...so I decided to take a couple photos for you.

First was to show you that the 4x4 goes past the coolant tubes...


Then when I took the pic of it getting around the coolant tube, I was reminded that I DID use a spacer.

I just used my cherry picker and hoisted her up from the deck lid striker. It didn't bend at all

I would be glad to send pics and dimensions for anyone that wants to build a solid safe lift. I would hate to see anyone hurt while saving their Fiero. My stand is rock solid, cheap, stores in a small space and is so easy to use. Not made out of wood! I had planned to put the pics and specs in the forum but am having a lot of trouble with photobucket today.

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woodys 427

quote Originally posted by Mr.Goodwrench: I just used my cherry picker and hoisted her up from the deck lid striker. It didn't bend at all

Seriously now....would you want your son or daughter to climb under that car when it is lifted only by the trunk latch? I admit that I have done it too...but I do a LOT of things that I would never recommend to someone else.

The last time I dropped my cradle I used the trunk latch - but let's be honest - its NOT made for that kind of weight. I would never do it again.

I tried dropping my cradle today and found out my jack isn't "low profile" enough. It's about six inches at minimum travel. I have another jack to try which is a bit shorter. Will a "normal" floor jack work or will I need a high-lift jack?

That's hard to say. When I think of a "normal" floor jack, I think of the ones that only go up to about 16". That won't get you there without doing some creative blocking and such...which can get real sketchy with the angles you will be working at (especially if you leave the front wheels on the ground...note that mine are on the ramps so that we were never at so much of an angle).

The "normal" jack I have is only 3.75 inches at minimum travel and has 18 inch max lift. I guess all I can do is try and see.

When you use 2 x 4 inch 16 ga. tubing, tractor jacks fit in the end.of the tube. That means the car can be 4 inches off the floor. My 87 is lowered several inches and yet the 2 x 4 tubing easily slides underneath. You can jack the car up 3 feet or more if you want. I often do. The jacks are from Fleet Farm or Harbor Freight. Each jack is rated for 7000 pounds! Tubing from the scrap yard. The jacks are like giant bumper jacks. I have adjustable lift points that lets me use it on my wifes Honda too. Opp! did I say Honda?

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woodys 427

quote Originally posted by CowsPatoot: Seriously now....would you want your son or daughter to climb under that car when it is lifted only by the trunk latch? I admit that I have done it too...but I do a LOT of things that I would never recommend to someone else.

I didn't leave there. I lowered it onto jack stands

quote Originally posted by CowsPatoot: Seriously now....would you want your son or daughter to climb under that car when it is lifted only by the trunk latch? I admit that I have done it too...but I do a LOT of things that I would never recommend to someone else.

I do the trunk striker thing all the time. While I don't recommend crawling around under there while it's hanging I think I feel more secure than I would being under there while it's being held up by that 4x4 and floor jack arrangement.

CowsPatoot, how much lift does your jack have? Also, I notice you are lifting just inboard of the cooling tubes but the actual jack points are outboard of the cooling tubes. Did you do this on purpose?

When I jack the car up, the 4x4 is bending quite a bit in the middle, makes me nervous. Putting the lift points inboard would reduce this quite a bit.

See my Cave, Safe Jacking and Jacking to Clear Engine

Remove engine from bottom then ignore jack point map.
Why? removing engine can effect jack points and unbalance frame hoist.
removing engine etc from bottom cuts rear weight... ~500-700 pounds when engine, trans, cradle, suspension are gone from car.

Lifting w/ jack & 4x4 will not hurt the car to clear engine etc. 4x4 will spread the load to floor pans. You don't need 4x4 to reach cooling pipes etc. like pictures above.

Kind of jacking engine using oil pan for replacing motor mount. Any jack will work when also using scrape metal or wood to spread jack load.

quote Originally posted by Mr.Goodwrench: I just used my cherry picker and hoisted her up from the deck lid striker. It didn't bend at all

If true you got very lucky. Striker is not made as a lift point.

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Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)

The Ogre's Fiero Cave (It's also at the top and bottom of every forum page...)

quote Originally posted by masospaghetti: CowsPatoot, how much lift does your jack have? Also, I notice you are lifting just inboard of the cooling tubes but the actual jack points are outboard of the cooling tubes. Did you do this on purpose?

I have a jack that will lift from about 4" to about 35". Thing cost me $280, but was the best money I have ever spent. Unfortunately, I believe the model has been discontinued...I can't find one now that lifts beyond about 24". Using the "standard jack points" is difficult because you have such a narrow space between the coolant tubes and the rocker panels. I am comfortable using those inner points when the engine/cradle isn't in the car...but with the engine in, that is too close to the center of gravity for the car.

a pair of hockey pucks work great and only cost a couple bucks
and 2x6's work great for stability, the jack stands are just additional safety for peace of mind
yes, supporting at the ends of the 4x4 will bend the 4x4, move inboard and use your head how much, too much will compromise stability

Do you need help again?? I don't have a Fiero anymore still remember how to get the cradle out. Think my best time is a little over an hour.

If you have long enough chains there are 2 pilot holes in the frame of the car you can use to lift with a cherry picker. They are basically at the back of the rear fenders on the trunk side. By lifting with the cherry picker you can actually set the whole cradle on the legs. Then when the car is high enough to clear the drivers fender well you can put 2 - 24" jacks on the frame of the car. There are 2 grooves on each side that the jacks fit perfectly into. Then simply slide the cherry picker out. If you need to you can put a dolly in the middle of the cherry picker legs to make it glide better. Remember to put 2 stoppers on the front tires so the car doesn't roll forward.

I have also in the past used the truck latch, but before I ever did I made sure it was tight. Never had an issue with it bending, but would NEVER rely on it. By doing it this way I would go inch at a time and have jacks at the jack points so if it did fail it would only be an inch. Once I learned of these pilot holes in the frames it was much safer and easier.

It's been a while since I dropped a cradle, but its not too bad by yourself. Just remember to take your time and go slow, and never get under the car unless you know its 100% supported.

Ken~

I didn't know you were still around! All I have left is the four cradle bolts and physically removing the cradle. I might go the cherry picker route if my jack doesn't have enough range. Watching that 4x4 bend in the middle though...that's some scary stuff!!

Woody: I would build the tractor jack system, looks like it works way better -but I share a garage so I don't really have room to keep it around afterwards.

It all just stands in a corner when not in use. It all slips apart. You be careful and work slowly. Good idea to have someone around just in case!

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woodys 427