Bring your car to the next level of performance with our intercooler. For use with all L67 M90 powered cars. Use 3.0 pulleys or smaller with 0 KR. 300+ HP at the wheels is easily within reach with the addition of our IC. Over a year in the making, add some serious performance to your GP
What do you guys think? Is this 300 HP easily attainable with it? What do you think has to be done to attain this power?
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Red 88 GT T-Top 3800 Supercharged White 88 GT Stock Please give me a rating if you appreciate my contribution. History of Skitimes Car
300HP at the wheels is equal to 375 to 400hp at the crank. It is attainable but I think it will need a little more massaging than that, like a cam or Intense rocker kit. Check out the "FieroX fact or rumor" thread for my formula for 750hp.
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10:25 AM
skitime Member
Posts: 5765 From: Akron, PA, USA Registered: Aug 2000
300HP at the wheels is equal to 375 to 400hp at the crank. It is attainable but I think it will need a little more massaging than that, like a cam or Intense rocker kit. Check out the "FieroX fact or rumor" thread for my formula for 750hp.
Purple Reign I did check out your post their and all I can say is Holy Crap!
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10:30 AM
PURPLE REIGN Member
Posts: 4080 From: Minnesnowta ------------------ Land of White Gold Registered: Sep 2002
I don't mean to hijack your thread but did I read on one of you posts that your using a Series I harness and computer on a Series II motor? Of course, I have may reasons for asking...
I don't mean to hijack your thread but did I read on one of you posts that your using a Series I harness and computer on a Series II motor? Of course, I have may reasons for asking...
Almost right. I have a SeriesII harness with a SeriesI ECM and custom burnt chip on a SeriesII engine.
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10:37 AM
mrfixit58 Member
Posts: 3330 From: Seffner, Fl, USA Registered: Jul 99
While I don't have any direct experience with their intercooler, I have to say that I have dealt with ZZPerformance before since they deal a lot with the W-bodies (bought some stuff for my Intrigue) and their delivery times and customer service is great.
Some people that I have talked to highly recommend the porting and polishing job that they can do on the supercharger. It makes the charger run a lot more efficient and it doesn't get as hot.
Also, Intense has a car that uses a combination of ZZP and Intense parts (both companies seem to endorse each other) and it is putting down a streetable 450 hp at the wheels (albeit the front ones). The 3800SC really is becoming the SBC of the modern generation.
Ken S.
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11:20 AM
Sherlock Member
Posts: 135 From: Shelby Twp., MI Registered: Nov 2002
Hey Guys. If anyone is interested in an intercooler for their 3800 supercharged fiero. I am making a kit designed for the 3800 fiero. The kit is still in the design stage, but should be on a 3800 fiero shortly like a week. The kit will include everything needed and i mean everything, for about $1000 or less. If anyone is interested let me know. lholmes54@comcast.net Thanks Justin
------------------ 85 Fiero GT soon to be Blown... L67 1996 Culass Supreme w/3800 Supercharged Series II
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12:18 PM
PURPLE REIGN Member
Posts: 4080 From: Minnesnowta ------------------ Land of White Gold Registered: Sep 2002
I am interested in the intercooler. POst some more info on that. 300 wheel HP is no problem for the SC 3800. But I believe you will have to take your motor apart though. Port and polishing the heads, intake, and blower. Bigger throttle body. Smaller pulley( 3.0)and the intercooler and you should be very close. Of course then you will need to worry about a the clutch holding up.
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07:03 PM
FastFieros Member
Posts: 2698 From: Dallas Texas USA Registered: Nov 2000
Hey Guys. If anyone is interested in an intercooler for their 3800 supercharged fiero. I am making a kit designed for the 3800 fiero. The kit is still in the design stage, but should be on a 3800 fiero shortly like a week. The kit will include everything needed and i mean everything, for about $1000 or less. If anyone is interested let me know. lholmes54@comcast.net Thanks Justin
One of my biggest issues with the OBDI (95) and earlier ECM's is you have to tune those based on your own dyno tuning, or rely on someone to have "working" knowledge to program enough safty margin in the ECM to keep a 400HP engine alive. DHP has been working with ZZP and Intense long enough to get this PCM in the hunt. I have personally seen DHP's software package for hacking the PCM, you can trust me, its nice.
DHP and ZZP hooking up together have come out with a OBDII PCM that will allow timing, and MAF adjustments on the fly. This will enable a WB O2 with logging to really get the fuel curves right.
OBDII hacking is suppose to come to a better control measure by this July. Some guy that hacks BMW PCM's will be releasing a software package to program any 96+ PCM from GM.
Back to this tread topic.... I have installed this ZZP IC on Grand Prixs, and I even have one in my shop today getting one. Part of my service to this guy is dyno time in 2 weeks tweaking the engine. He is also getting ICCU/DHP combo, VS cam from ZZP, Intense head gaskets, SLP headers, stage 4 blower porting to fit the IC, and a cherry on top when done. He is shooting for 400HP crank, and 325HP at the wheels.
Loyde
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07:28 PM
May 24th, 2003
Zooomer Junior Member
Posts: 8 From: grand rapids, MI Registered: May 2003
I dyno'd 358WHP and 416 ft lbs with the ZZP intercooler. My other mods are:
2.6" SC pulley with 8 rib belt P&P heads Headers/full exhaust LS1 TB ICCU with 28 deg timing UD pulleys ZZP Stage 4 M90 Comp Cam
Awesome stuff. Hey Zooomer, I am glad you are on Pennocks now. Welcome! I want to be your poster boy here for your stuff. Course you know I already started. I sent you a PM which you can find on the main page.
This engine is definitely the small block of the decade. Pics?
Hey check out my new sig thanks to KameoKid
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Red 88 GT T-Top 3800 Supercharged White 88 GT Stock Please give me a rating if you appreciate my contribution. History of Skitimes Car
[This message has been edited by skitime (edited 05-24-2003).]
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10:02 AM
FastFieros Member
Posts: 2698 From: Dallas Texas USA Registered: Nov 2000
Do not expect a return email from him every day you send one. I have been working with ZZP for several months now, and each person there is very helpful, but they are extremely business. The L67 market is exploding, so the SBC is on notice.
sweet jesus! i was a few days away from purchasing an LS1 for a V8 conversion.
This thread has halted that, likely indefinately. I had no idea the 3800/SC II not only had so much hp potential, but had so many aftermarket mods. it really is as vercitle as the SBC.
The horse power you guys are sqeezing out of these little 6cyls is rediculas! I sure hope i get to see your cars at the 20th.
P.S. while i am here, anyone have a suggestion on what year/modle car is the best for pulling a series II 3800SC.
------------------ -Monkey
[This message has been edited by FieroMonkey (edited 05-24-2003).]
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12:02 PM
skitime Member
Posts: 5765 From: Akron, PA, USA Registered: Aug 2000
P.S. while i am here, anyone have a suggestion on what year/modle car is the best for pulling a series II SC.
The Series II was found in the 97 and newer Grand Prix GTP and Bonnivilles and the large Buicks.
The thing that about these engines that I find most amazing is that I have all this power and get even better gas mileage than my old 2.8.... 30+ on the highway. It seems almost naughty to have so much fun with an economical engine.
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12:08 PM
FastFieros Member
Posts: 2698 From: Dallas Texas USA Registered: Nov 2000
Originally posted by FieroMonkey: P.S. while i am here, anyone have a suggestion on what year/modle car is the best for pulling a series II 3800SC.
Since you used the word "BEST", there is 2 things to consider.
MAF and air flow. 97 and 98 have the same MAF and throttle bodies. The 99+ have a better MAF and air flow in the throttle body. Engines are all the same for the most part, however with the experience of the Club Grand Prix forum, it has come to light that the 99+ heads are also better around the valve seats. Seems several heads on the 98 and below have shown intermitent miss fires on the AutoTaps and TECH 2's indicating lost in balance of the cylinder caused by the valve leaking.
The PCM's come to mind next - OBDII gets you all the cool bells and whistles that Intense and ZZP make for the L67 market. If you go with the 95 ECM you are on your own in tuning with TunerCat. I have the TECH 2 and AutoTap, so I can give the reports to DHP and they can custom tune the PCM to that. One day in the near future, OBDII tuning of the L67 PCM is coming. LS1Edit and LT1Edit are here today, so it wont be long. The ICCU/DHP combo however gives you enough engine tuning on the fly that custom tunes should not be necessary.
...30+ on the highway. It seems almost naughty to have so much fun with an economical engine.
i laughed over this one for a few minutes. thats priceless!
Thanks for all the info guys. I will be engine hunting after the holiday next week. Anyone have a price range for one of these engines? dont want to pay too much.
Also, i assume i should snag the wiring harness and ECM as well, should i grab any of the exaust?
P.S. sorry for semi-hyjacking Skitime i know this has all been asked probably a million times. Thanks for the info inspite of it!
[This message has been edited by FieroMonkey (edited 05-25-2003).]
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02:42 AM
skitime Member
Posts: 5765 From: Akron, PA, USA Registered: Aug 2000
if you bye a new crated engine can you also bye a new ecm and harness,or do you have to find them used?
Sure you can purchase a complete GM harness and PCM. The harness is $500 and the PCM is $182.12(note core charge)....This PCM is not programmed either. GM PART # 16236757 CATEGORY: Emission Control System Hardware PACK QTY: 1 CORE CHARGE: $100.00 GM LIST: $164.25 OUR PRICE: $82.12 DESCRIPTION: PCM REM
I have a brand new harness that was intergated to the Fiero harness today. I have never offered it for sale. It is for my manual trans setup.
You want crate engine, PCM, wiring harness, 4T65eHD transmission, axles, and AC lines? How about $3400 total plus shipping (Pennocks price) for a 2002 engine with 1243 miles. See it here > http://www.fastfieros.com/enginesavailable/enginesforsale.htm
Originally posted by FastFieros: You want crate engine, PCM, wiring harness, 4T65eHD transmission, axles, and AC lines? How about $3400 total plus shipping (Pennocks price) for a 2002 engine with 1243 miles.
Loyde,
What about an installed price? 88, presently with an automatic and A/C.
------------------ Raydar
88 3.4 coupe. 17s, cut springs 'n all.
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01:04 PM
FastFieros Member
Posts: 2698 From: Dallas Texas USA Registered: Nov 2000
You wanting this 1243 mile engine and trans is considered an upgrade. Based on mile different and quality of parts, price reflects add $1800 to the $8500 total outlined on the above page. 30k motors are great, so far I have had several every nice maintained engines and all have made excellent installs. Some people just like the word "new" "crate" or "1243 miles new". I am one of those people too however.
I have the nice blue engine that is zero miles. I added all the parts up 4 days ago for this project and the total was $13,000 in electronics and engine hardware.
He is shooting for 400HP crank, and 325HP at the wheels.
