Does a Pontiac Fiero really fall into the "beast" category of automobiles ? I mean like a 440 'cuda would be a beast. The GTO would be a beast. The SS Camaro and 91 Chevy 454 SS truck would also fall into the "street beast" category.

But a 4cyl Fiero ? I don't think so.

Okay everybody, brothers and sisters and mother******'s.

This is the thread I have chosen for my new SIG TEST!!!!

BTW, for history's sake, the last time I actually posted on the Forum was in a response to a thread which was centered around the infamous Fiero 5. In his response, he referred to me as a "troll".

Something absolutely clicked, and I decided that it was time for a "fresh, new look".

Comin' right at ya' Steve!

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[This message has been edited by BigRed88 (edited 11-06-2003).]

What exactly is a "troll" anyway ? In reference to PFF that is.

I would not call Big Red a troll anyday. Gordo you are one lucky man to have a wife like her, one that likes cars that is.

quote Originally posted by 80's BOY: What exactly is a "troll" anyway ? In reference to PFF that is.

Someone who posts leading questions/statements/etc. as to lead others into starting a flamewar.

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86 GT -- All Options except Performance Sound

I went back to catch up with page two of this thing and I saw something disturbing. Nachtzehrer6 you really struck a low blow by calling Fiero5's family an f'ing family. It's one thing to insult the man himself, but to insult his family is a new low on this forum. I will let you know that I rated you negative for this, and you are the only negative I have out there now. That was really uncalled for and you owe Fiero5's family an apology. I hope others follow my example and rate you negative also unless you apologize for your rude behavior.

quote Originally posted by avengador1: Gordo you are one lucky man to have a wife like her, one that likes cars that is.

Yeah, I guess she's ok...

quote Originally posted by avengador1: Nachtzehrer6 you really struck a low blow by calling Fiero5's family an f'ing family. It's one thing to insult the man himself, but to insult his family is a new low on this forum. That was really uncalled for and you owe Fiero5's family an apology.

I, too, have given Nachtzehrer6 a negative rating.

This whole flame war has gotten way out of hand!

Steve is a "unique" personality, quite wordy in his posts, and not someone that I would choose to spend a lot of time with. However, I have never read him as the type that would shout "your Mama wears Army boots!". Maybe the three of us should sit down and have a couple of brews and sort this whole thing out.

Although Steve dubbed me as one, I know that I am not a troll.

I do maintain a bizarre sense of humor that is my survival tool, which is every bit as useful to me as my 13 mm wrench. My sig was an attempt to diffuse a thread that was caught up in a loop, and going nowhere.

Here's how I see it...it don't mean s*** to a tree if your Fiero pulls a 0-60 in six seconds or sixteen seconds. The Forum is a Utopia that Cliff has created for us to share and explore the Fiero in it's many forms (fish stories included).

Family comes before Fiero in the dictionary.

I agree with Avengador, you owe his Family an apology.

Remember, it's not whether you win or lose, it's who you pick to blame!

'nuff said.

[This message has been edited by BigRed88 (edited 11-06-2003).]

Time call back the dogs. He didn't insult the man's family.

"Oh, you brought out the whole f'n family" While not the most appropriate thing to say given that Cliff has asked people to not circumvent the censors, it was a statement of expression. If he said "thats a bad f'n family" then I'd understand. I don't think what he said can be interpreted as an insult.

Now, we were talking about fixing the fastest 4 cylinder Fiero...

Sig test.

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[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-07-2003).]

Speakin of "f'n"....I think a bunch of you guys are "f'n" pathetic for getting in some of the "f'n" arguments you do and turning simple posts in to "f'n" arguments.

That's m "f'n" opinion! :P

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'87GT Fully modded, 3" Drop on 17's 3800SC on the way....or a turbo
'92 LeBaron soft top, The Players car. :)

fieros only

quote Originally posted by SLAMMED87GT: Speakin of "f'n"....I think a bunch of you guys are "f'n" pathetic for getting in some of the "f'n" arguments you do and turning simple posts in to "f'n" arguments. That's m "f'n" opinion! :P

Well f'n said.

BTW, Gridlock was right about how I used the word..maybe it came off wrong....Still it's there and I WILL NOT edited it out, and pretend it doesn't exist. If ya catch my drift.

[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-07-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-07-2003).]

quote Originally posted by Nachtzehrer6: You can give me all the negs in the world, and it was happening in this thread before the f'n "f'n" thing. It was also "duke" guys giving me negs...

Do I detect a slight trace of paranoia? Oh no...The big bad Duke guys are after me!

Gee, I used to like you before you started bashing all us "Duke guys".

To clear up a few thing...

quote Originally posted by Nachtzehrer6: Does your duke do 0-60 in 6sec too?

No, that's not why I drive it. I had a couple Camaros years back. One was a Z28 (1982, the wife's Caravan could give it a good run for the money). The other was a sport coupe with a 350 small block. I would hardly call the performance "hair raising" from either. Even with dual exhaust, Holly 4-bbl, Edelbrock manifold, Cyclone headers & other bolt-ons into the night. (they sounded nice though )

Neither one of those would do 0-60 in six seconds but I still had a lot of fun with them.

Do I believe Steve's "Green Beast" will do 0-60 in six seconds? No, I never did but I can think for myself thankyou.

Am I a "Duke guy"? Probably, (see sig). I also have a six cyl winter project in the garage. (Right now my duke is faster that my six because my six doesn't run. )

My point...
I gave you a neg. for your sociopathic behavior. Not because I happen to drive a four cyl.

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[This message has been edited by Gordo (edited 11-07-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Gordo (edited 11-07-2003).]

...

[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-07-2003).]

Perhaps, but can't we give it a rest now?

quote Originally posted by Gordo: Perhaps, but can't we give it a rest now?

Ok, I can just for you.
But I am betting it won't rest.

Thanks, (I'm puttin ya back to neutral)

quote Originally posted by Gordo: Thanks, (I'm puttin ya back to neutral)

pm sent

pm back.

OK, I am going to try and make this the last word from me anyway on this whole 0-60 thing.
Why some of you picked this thread about needing help getting my sons Fiero running again to get into this waste of time arguments is beyond me.

I opologize for stating earlier that the Fiero could do a 0-60 in around 6 seconds by basing it on a very inaccurate watching of a wrist watch for time by a rider. I have admited that this was not a very good way of getting a 0-60 time many times after making that statement and even edited the thread that it was made in soon after.
I am sorry if any of the things I said about the green Fiero being "fast" upset any of you or kept anyone up at night
That's the best I can do people on all of this until, as I have said many times now, we can get this to a track or other reliable place and get actual numbers with slips.

Now, anyone with a stock V6 who would like to meet up and race with us sometime when we can nail down a place to do this at, is more than welcome. This will also give us something to race against which usually helps when trying to get quick times as well as just be good clean fun
So whatya say there Nachtzehrer6, are you interested in bringing your kick butt V6 Fiero over this way to a track sometime to try and take on the green Fiero? Your V6 Fiero and the green 4 banger side by side just waiting for the lights on the tree to go green?
Anyone who is interested in doing this and/or who can help secure a place to do all of this at which would be semi close to us is welcome. Please let us know.
If there is a place in NY close to many of us that should work too.
That is of course once we get this Fiero running well again as it should, though getting much of any help in that area on here lately as you have all seen here is pretty sad to say the least.

I would like to thank the few that actually have offered help so far, and hopefully either here or on Fiero.com my family can get enough possible ideas to look into to hopefully get this Fiero back up and running correctly again very soon.

I would also like to opolgize to bigred88 for calling her a troll. I don't remember why my exact reason I did so at the time, but I do remember that she did say something to me that I took as an insult that ticked me off at the time. Whatever it was it doesn't matter now as thats water under the bridge and she sounds pretty sincere to me on here.

Steve

Edited as I can't speel

[This message has been edited by Fiero5 (edited 11-07-2003).]

My 1984 SE 2.5 4:10 tranny ran at Maple grove in 2001 a 17.0 in the quarter mile.

When I bought my GT in 2002 (1986 GT Auto), I ran it at Lebanon valley dragstrip and my first pass was a 17.1. My BEST Pass of the day was a 16.9.

Now, on the highway, the GT would walk away from the 4cyl. But off the line, and up to 55-60, I think the GT would be catchin up. I think a lot has to do with motor condition. My GT had 100k on it, and perhaps seen better days. My 4cyl was all stock running mobil 1 oil, with only 50k miles on it. Now, for such a big difference between 4cyl and 6cyl, I don't see how arguing over .1 second is worth it. I'm confident that my 4cyl would have pulled away from some of those GTs we saw at the track for the 20th.

I don't think Jordans fiero is as fast as he says, but don't be surprised if it DOES keep up with some V6s.

Anyone else see the drag times at the 20th??

Nachtzehrer6, since you have retracted your statements, I will retract my negative and give you a neutral. If you had apologized to Fiero 5's family I would have given you a positive.

quote Originally posted by avengador1: Nachtzehrer6, since you have retracted your statements, I will retract my negative and give you a neutral. If you had apologized to Fiero 5's family I would have given you a positive.

No. I didn't retract my statements to win brownie points. I retracted my statement's to salvage some integerity. If it's any consolation you sure have put a smile on my face though.(where is that quote from )
Anyway, I am not going to let people hang ratings over my head like a Scoobie snack. I'll say it again RATINGS DON'T MATTER. Besides, no offense, but what does that say about you? I mean, if you can just change a rating on a whim like that, then your rating me postive for the wrong reason.(negs and neutral I can understand, but you can't just be sorry to get a postive) No sir, I don't want to be rated just cause I did what you wanted. That's an abuse of the system, for that you get a neg.

To put it simple: Don't try to threaten me(or whatever) with a "+". I wouldn't want it anyway. It wouldn't be earned or deserved, it would be caving in. Read gridlock's post he sum'd it up pretty well. Tactless yes, but harmless as well.
[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-08-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-08-2003).]
can't speel ..kant speal...cant spell...

[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-08-2003).]

The bunnies are stabbing eachother!!

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Keep thinking that the ratings don't matter and your red bar will keep getting bigger. I would have given you a positive for doing the right thing and apologizing to Fiero5 for calling his family an F'n family. We all know what you meant by f'n and it isn't a very nice or complimentary thing. Cliff gave us the rating system so we could police ourselves, if you tee off enough people you will be banned, just a bit of friendly advice. As for giving me a minus, more power to you. I would need a ton of minus to get my bar flashing like yours. If you don't mind being banned why are you here? Just because this is the internet, it doesn't give you the right to insult people and their families. That is pretty low. I wanted to let you and others know why I rated you the way I did. I could have just rated you and left you wondering why your red bar was growing. I wasn't offering my rating as a reward. I was offering it for you doing the right thing and trying to make peace with others on the forum. As I asked above, if you don't mind being banned and life will go on if you get banned, why are you here? Cliff you can put this one in the trash can now. I have said my piece.

[This message has been edited by avengador1 (edited 11-08-2003).]

quote Originally posted by avengador1: Keep thinking that the ratings don't matter and your red bar will keep getting bigger. I would have given you a positive for doing the right thing and apologizing to Fiero5 for calling his family an F'n family. We all know what you meant by f'n and it isn't a very nice or complimentary thing. Cliff gave us the rating system so we could police ourselves, if you tee off enough people you will be banned, just a bit of friendly advice. As for giving me a minus, more power to you. I would need a ton of minus to get my bar flashing like yours.

Even more simply. An apology should only be made if one is sorry or perhaps guilty. While I could be gulity in the sense I said "F'n family", but my conscience is not guilty, and I am not sorry. An apology would not be heartfelt or sincere just to "gain" somthing, such as a rating. Too bad you can't see that. I am going to assume you have/had relation problems with people due to your line of thinking.

I already did the thread "unjacking" thing remember? Why due you insist all the sudden to stire it up. Give me a neg, but don't waste your time telling me why you did it me why.
Oh, and when I get banned, guess what?

LIFE F"N GOES ON. Big deal.

[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-08-2003).]

Nachtzehrer6, do you realize that you have posted in this thread well over 20 times? In not one of your posts do you offer anything to help in us solving the engine not running properly. NONE. All you have done is come in here and hijack this thread and be argumentative, throw insults around and bad mouth me and my family.

Then amazingly you come along 20 plus idiotic posts later and say this:

quote I already did the thread "unjacking" thing remember? Why due you insist all the sudden to stire it up.

You haven't unjacked anything because your still posting in here and they still have absolutely nothing to do with the title of this thread.
And then you ask Avengador why he insists on wanting to stir it up? LOL
Your a real piece of work. Thanks for completely hijacking and messing up this thread for us and probably scaring off anyone else who might have actually posted anything helpfull.

Please! Give it a rest allready.

[This message has been edited by Fiero5 (edited 11-08-2003).]

quote Originally posted by Fiero5: Nachtzehrer6, do you realize that you have posted in this thread well over 20 times? In not one of your posts do you offer anything to help in us solving the engine not running properly. NONE. All you have done is come in here and hijack this thread and be argumentative, throw insults around and bad mouth me and my family. Give it a rest allready.

I said I would give it a rest, in repsonse to Gordo. All people have to do is click "-", and quit replying to me. I will speak when spoken too. As far as the insults go, I hope it's not going to "keep anyone up at night"
[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-08-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Nachtzehrer6 (edited 11-08-2003).]

Here we have an excellent example of the few times when I think the ratings system doesn't work. Yes, there is a very good chance that Nachtzehrer6 will eventually have enough members who will see enough of the kinds of posts he does to get irritated enough to slap him with a negative causing him to get banned.
However, In the mean time, he is able to hijack threads like this one, allowed to insult people, allowed to keep stirring up and causing trouble and do nothing other than be a pain in the butt.

I thought this forum was supposed to be a community for Fiero owners who wanted to chat, get technical advice, etc. Now it is becoming a forum where a growing vocal group is ruining it enough for many of us that we don't even want to post or ask anything on here anymore, as we know that there is a very good chance at some point we will get these types of comments in our threads which are not only non thread related but counterproductive to what this forum is here for IMO
I guess it is slowly being taken over by a small bunch of members who enjoy nothing more than contantly stirring up crap and then sitting back adding idiotic post after idiotic post while enjoying the aftermath of their work.
ls3mach started it off in here with questions and comments that were not appropriate for this thread, and then was joined in by 80's Boy, Cleardark, Gridlock, Nachtzehrer6 and a few others who also offered no help but instead joined in on the attack and insults helping to bury this thread from being what it was supposed to be about. Most of these members have more red than green, but seem to know when to stop just short of getting banned, and then slowly building up just enough green so they can once again go on the attack and do it all over again.

Cliff, some of us would really like to know what your feelings are on this latest trend in here? I know that there has always been a few problems here and there as well as a few isolated incidents, but lately it seems to have grown and spread becoming widespread and almost common place on a daily basis.
Is this what PFF is going to be allowed to become? Is this going to be almost the norm now on PFF in what used to be a great forum?

Cliff, what about a new feature that allows members to lock out other members from posting in their threads. The member could add or take away any member as they choose to help control having their thread completely hijacked like what happened here. I think that would go along way in possibly turning this latest trend around. What do you think?

Steve

I just want to point out Nachtzehrer6
really didn't insult Fiero5's family. If I read it right he said "great the entire phuck1ng family registerd"...

Thats really not much of an insult.

Fiero5 and Nachtzehrer6 already threw enough insults at themself, by getting caught up in this stupid thread.

I really don't see what your trying to prove Nachtzehrer6. We all know the "green beast" is nowhere close 6 secs. If someone wants to believe it does, let them.

Trash this thread already .

Yeah Cliff, trash the thread. That's the real reason why I started this thread in the first. It certainly wasn't to try and actually get help on our Fiero here on PFF, it was just to get it hijacked with insults and bashing on me and my family >smacks forehead<
Now it will probably get dumped in the trash. Why? Because quite a few members simply can't be adults and abide by the rules and act appropriately here. God forbid any of us should try and start a thread expecting to get real responses on the questions we actually asked

Just for the record, I would like to point out that I got nothing but helpfull advice on "anotherforum.com" after being forced to seek help elsewhere, and the green Fiero is now running much better. Not perfect but better and sadly it isn't from any thanks from anyone on here. Guess we made a mistake on posting a thread on PFF and expecting any real help. I went there because as you have seen on the last 3 pages in this thread we have gotten almost nothing but crap. We needed to get this Fiero running and nicely asked for help. Just look at what we got instead.
I hope you are all proud of yourselves.

Steve

[This message has been edited by Fiero5 (edited 11-10-2003).]

If you really wanted to get it fixed so badly you would have started a new thread by now!

Like someones seriously going to give you advice on fixing your car in this mess of a thread?

You really like to argue dont you?

The only reason I keep checking this thread is to see who gets the last work before it hits the can.

Nachtzehrer6, your forecast about 21 posts back seems to hit the mark...

quote Originally posted by Nachtzehrer6: Ok, I can just for you. But I am betting it won't rest.

[This message has been edited by Gordo (edited 11-08-2003).]

quote Originally posted by ManiMack: If you really wanted to get it fixed so badly you would have started a new thread by now!

Riiigght. Silly me.

quote Like someones seriously going to give you advice on fixing your car in this mess of a thread?

My point exactly. Again, thank you to those that came in here and just posted crap.

quote You really like to argue dont you?

Thanks ManiMack for also jumping in here and adding your useless two sense in and continuing to prove my point

Fiero5

Excellent summation of the thread but of course, it missed its mark a little bit.

First, I agree with everything you said about why the forum is here. However, this forum also exists on the basis of accurate and reliable information. I realize you apologized for mentioning the 0-60 time but I'm going to use it as an example. If someone joins the board and sees you talking about a duke that can do a 0-60 of 6 seconds and believes that to be true and he's wrong its going to cause trouble, In this case, car owners everywhere will laugh at him but what if the information is something different? What if you gave advice in tech that was just as wrong? The saving grace to forums all over the net is that people who give out incorrect information will get called on it. Its a self-correcting feature and it happens all the time in tech. Its the same as the false time slip. People had to keep that fake timeslip as being interpreted as real. Otherwise, I'm going to claim that my fiero was a 9 second car. No ones gonna stop me.

Now, Nachtzehrer said he was going to drop it and even edited posts. Whos the one still going? You. The key to dropping it is actually dropping it. Yes, your thread got hijacked. Welcome to the internet. It happens. Stop whining please.

And I guarantee that if you start going off about how great that f'n( )car is on Fiero.com and how it is the fastest duke ever without backing it up, you'll have the same problems as here. Consider it a friendly tip.