Wow! I don't know how I missed this post. (Must spend too much time in the Tech forum). Great job Jonathan. I'd give you more +'s if I could.

quote There are about 50 1/4 " rivets that have to be drilled out. That sounds harder than it really is. You just need a good drill. None of that cordless stuff.

BTW, What's wrong with cordless? I love my 18V Dewalt. I use it for everything.

[This message has been edited by RCR (edited 12-11-2003).]

I missed this one also. I'm very impressed. I'm glad this topic resurfaced since I'm getting ready to install the C&C T-tops that I bought from FieroMonkey.

Thanks JScott for the post and the manual link.

Earl R.

Jonathon.. When are you and your tools coming to CA? Hopefully by Monday or Tuesday I can pick up the T-top that I found in the junkyard a few weeks ago. They are still waiting for the paperwork to clear but it is mine when it does... Looking at your thread, I have serious doubts that I can actually do this!

Songman...I would love to go back to Cali...I don't think so

Seriously, if you have the top from the donor car it becomes obvious where to cut. And it's not that critical where you make the cut. You can make up for at least 1/4" in either direction. The worst that can happen if you completely bugger it up is you have to make it into a convertible. In California it might be worth it to have the convertible

Jonathan

Ps - I'll take advantage of the bump in this thread to show some never before posted pictures...

To make the cut I just made a rough cut

Then did a lot of grinding until it fit right...praying helped too

[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 12-12-2003).]

I've started my own T-Top install.... I'll continue in JScott's thread... Here are some pics...

I had no idea what I was going to use as "spreaders", but I came across these Patio Bar Locks (at an Orchard Supply Hardware) that provide adjustable support and can screwed into the window frames...

Here's the T-Top frame...

[This message has been edited by Kelvin Vivian (edited 01-25-2004).]

Here's a pic of the frame yet again, with the rear portion free of the donor body...

[This message has been edited by Kelvin Vivian (edited 01-25-2004).]

Kevin - I'd get an opinion from Jon B4 you cut the roof and let the patio door bars hold the load. R U sure they won't collapse; r they strong enough to support the load ?

quote Originally posted by PaulJK: Kevin - I'd get an opinion from Jon B4 you cut the roof and let the patio door bars hold the load. R U sure they won't collapse; r they strong enough to support the load ?

85% chance they'll hold - they are adjustable bars are made of aluminum, and are solidly fixed in place with no play - I set the length just slightly larger than what was needed and then jammed the free end into its clip.

Here's another pic of the setup...

I think the spreader bars Jon used were like long screws; essentially solid steel rods. If they don't cost too much, maybe you wanna double-up on your aluminum ones. Man, what would you do if they don't hold and the windshield folds back - big time trouble .

So when you make the cut in the roof, what's do you use to hide the cut..?
Are the fiberglass cuts hidden by the T-top frame or by rubber molding..?

And in the back, does the Ttops actually touch the rear upper fascia of the car..?
and what does it look like with the tops removed, do you see the black metal frame,
or is there some thing to cover it..?

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Good luck Kelvin, ...we are rooting for ya !

Sorry I can't seam to get the pics to work. In your 3rd post you are cutting thru the roof with a saw , are you cutting thru the fiberglass and the metal under it ? I just bought a t-top set up and downloaded the manual for it. You where right it can be a bit confusing. At least a freind of mine has t-top car we can use to take any measurements we may need.

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88 Formula

Truely impressive, I did not realize you could just rivet it in, that is awesome. Beautiful car, awsome work.

quote Originally posted by Kelvin Vivian: I've started my own T-Top install.... I'll continue in JScott's thread... Here are some pics... I had no idea what I was going to use as "spreaders", but I came across these Patio Bar Locks (at an Orchard Supply Hardware) that provide adjustable support and can screwed into the window frames...

Good Job Kelvin!!

I feel a sort of psychic connection between our cars anyway since you are the owner of my original interior. Now we can share T-top install stories.

Your aluminum spreaders should be strong enough. I don't know how adjustable they are, that would be my only concern. I went with the turnbuckles and steel rods so that I could adjust the pre-load as I was cutting. That actually helped to keep the gap open as I was cutting and not to bind up on the saw.

There is enough play in the way the frame installs that you really don't have to "spread" the roof to get the frame in, although that helps. Talking to Ed Parks he told me that he used to install T-tops with no spreaders at all, and he would put blocks under the center of the car and have people sit on the front and rear bumper to spread the car if necessary.

Regarding the cut, yes you cut through the SMC roof and the space frame all in one big cut. The only tricky part there is keeping the saw perpendicular. I had my brother as a spotter and he would warn me when I was off center. It's not too big a deal because like I said I cut on the inside of the line and had to grind off a little anyway.

Kelvin, don't hestiate to ask if you have any questions, I am more than hapy to help.

- Jonathan

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If you find my advice useful, then please give me a positive rating, thanks...

1988 GT (Firebird Interior),1988 Coupe (Daily Driver), 1985 SE (Project Car), 1985 Coupe (parts car), Firebird Interior Installation Website

I have some good news for you people that need weatherstripping for the T-tops! I have a friend that bought an 86 Ford Mustang with T-tops. The T-tops are made from the same company that made ours. He let me use one of his new weatherstrips to see if it would fit my T-tops and it does. The only differents is it does not have the metal parts that go down the A and B pillars and the corners are shaped a little different too. They are also a complete glue on weatherstrip too.

Don
Pix Coming soon!

quote Originally posted by 3.8 SC: The only differents is it does not have the metal parts that go down the A and B pillars and the corners are shaped a little different too. They are also a complete glue on weatherstrip too. Don Pix Coming soon!

I'm not sure what metal part you are referring to, and are the Ford Mustang weatherstips any easier to find?

Those aluminum stays should be more than adequate. The car is very stiff but not so much so that the pillars will spring out when the roof is cut. Still, you should put some support blocks under frame rails in the center of the door so when you are climbing in and out of the car it is less likely to flex.

quote Originally posted by Toddster: Those aluminum stays should be more than adequate. The car is very stiff but not so much so that the pillars will spring out when the roof is cut. Still, you should put some support blocks under frame rails in the center of the door so when you are climbing in and out of the car it is less likely to flex.

Good point Todd... Since I don't have wood blocks, I'll use Fiero jackstands as support on both sides...

Here's a pic of the frame now - free of it's donor...

Now onto measuring and then cutting the roof off...

[This message has been edited by Kelvin Vivian (edited 01-25-2004).]

Kelvin,

I know I don't have to tell you to be careful with those weatherseals. They are worth 10 times their weight in gold. Just remember to be conservative with your cut. You can always take off more material. But if you cut too much then you are kind of stuck. Good luck.

- Jonathan

jscott ,

I just had a great, great laugh looking back at those latest pictures you put up. Was the back of your T-shirt a coincidence or did you wear that shirt specifically, as a sign of what you were thinking as you were cutting into the roof ??

At any rate it makes a humours picture.

quote Originally posted by exoticse: Was the back of your T-shirt a coincidence or did you wear that shirt specifically, as a sign of what you were thinking as you were cutting into the roof ??

I was looking for all the help I could get.

Past the point of no return... Car is targa right now...

Before cutting, I removed the spreaders, removed the weather strip guide in the front (left the rear ones in place), and then re-installed the spreaders...

The aluminum patio door security bars work as spreaders... Here's the door jam, unchanged on both sides...

This is as far as I got this weekend... I just need to grind the front and rear edges till the frame pops in...

Hey JScott, how did you finally place the frame into place? I've tried a few test fits, so far I've first placed the rear of the frame into place, and then tried to pull the front up into place - it's almost there.

I'll probably finish next weekend. - k

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88 GT T-Top 5-spd #338 of 1252
87 SE 4-cyl 5-spd sunroof, spoiler, performance sound
85 2M4 base coupe 5-spd, hardtop, rackless decklid, 15-in 88 GT rims, aero-conversion

[This message has been edited by Kelvin Vivian (edited 01-26-2004).]

quote Originally posted by Kelvin Vivian: Hey JScott, how did you finally place the frame into place? I've tried a few test fits, so far I've first placed the rear of the frame into place, and then tried to pull the front up into place - it's almost there.

That's how I put the frame in, back first then when you have ground off enough in the front it will drop right into place. Then you slide it forward. The measurements will tell you how far to slide it and make sure it is perpendicular.

Did you get any pics of the actual cutting. That's the fun part isn't it?

quote Originally posted by jscott1: That's how I put the frame in, back first then when you have ground off enough in the front it will drop right into place. Then you slide it forward. The measurements will tell you how far to slide it and make sure it is perpendicular. Did you get any pics of the actual cutting. That's the fun part isn't it?

Cutting is the crazy part, never tried it before today, but it wasn't bad at all.. I used an emergency/rescue blade (with my saws-all) to cut the roof - almost like butter. No pics though, as I was the only one working on the car. My cousin who was over managed to find other things to do... I wouldn't have attempted something like this were it not for your install. Now, I'm more than half-way there... Your interior is in good hands, I'll eventually use it to restore the interior of my 88 to new condition.

[This message has been edited by Kelvin Vivian (edited 01-26-2004).]

Kelvin, you are doing great

...especially on the "B" pillar cut. That's one area I found the C&C manual to be very confusing. After looking at my donor roof I finally decided that the cut in that area was not all that critical. I made a conservative cut and had to go back several times to remove more material. Eventually all the metal in that area gets hammered down and hidden under the frame anyway.

I'm going to be following the do-it-yourself chop top thread closely, maybe I'll give that a try next?

Lookin Good !

Jon - a t-top Chop top ?

[This message has been edited by PaulJK (edited 01-26-2004).]

Hey KV you are now a member of the radical fiero pioneers joining jscott1 (cutting your car in half) .

quote Originally posted by PaulJK: Jon - a t-top Chop top ?

I Wish, I'm thinking of chopping my Coupe

Waste'n no time I see Kelvin!

Keep up the good work.

Amazing work...I could never bring myself to do that to mine though...I'll just settle for a sunroof conversion for now. + for you both.

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Caleb Sarty

Life is a road filled with twisting turns and dead ends. Who better to travel this road with than my Fiero.

Great thread on t-top installs.

I too have recently ventured down this road. Unfortunately, I can't post pics from work so if I can send my pics to someone to post for me I'd appreciate it.

I wanted to have Loyde (FastFieros), Pat (T-Top Fiero) and Steve (forgot his screen name) help me put in my set prior to the first Red River Ruckus but ran out of time. So, I packed around my t-tops from state to state, sold them, bought another set, sold them bought another set, let them sit around forever and said yeah, I'll eventually get to this. Well, this last December I finally did. They're complete except for the headliner since I am still waiting to install my new directional/temp mirror and other goodies that I need to wire under the headliner.

Ok, forgot I could host from my webspace...oops...

Ok, just a little grinding to clean up those rough edges. And of course the sparks make for a cool effect.

Well, my supports aren't quite as nicely done as jscotts but the worked very well. The tie downs were just for and added safety measure. The 2x2 boards were anchored and drilled into the metal with self-tapping screws.

Just another pic showing the roof gone, the targa look is cool, just wish I had the cross-bracing underneath to support the cool look.

I will post more pics later, they're on the digi-cam at home

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AIM - SWags2933

84 Fiero SE, Custom Hybrid (Updated to 88 wiring throughout, V6, 5spd, Fastback, Formula bumpers and Held Suspension) New wheels and paint are the next step.
84 Fiero IMSA Widebody (Centerlines, 3800SC & T-tops being added) slow work-in-progress

[This message has been edited by IwannaIRM (edited 01-26-2004).]

quote Originally posted by IwannaIRM: Unfortunately, I can't post pics from work so if I can send my pics to someone to post for me I'd appreciate it.

Send your pics to me and I'll post them...my email link is above. Glad to hear someone else did their own T-tops.

- Jonathan

Had some time today to do a little grinding... Here's a test fit.

The frame will be scooched forward a little when going in for final placement. All I need to do now, is a little more measuring to make sure that the frame is centered when riveted in place. And then there's the drilling and riveting...

[This message has been edited by Kelvin Vivian (edited 01-29-2004).]

Hey KV, you are almost done.

Once you have the frame in the right position it's all downhill from there. I noticed that you didn't have anything covering your interior. Between the cutting and the grinding I had a lot of crap in there. How are you keeping it clean? Good luck with the riveting. My arms were wiped out after doing the 50th one or so. If I ever do another one I will get a pneumatic riveter. Keep us updated!

- Jonathan

Installing T-Tops is not that bad at all, anyone who is handy with tools can do this job.
All you need are:
a) 1/8 and 1/4 in rivets - available online, or at an ACE Hardware
b) Patio Bar Locks used as spreaders - available at Orchard Supply Hardware
c) a 1/4 in riveter - available online, or a good hardware/tool shop
d) a saws-all
e) a grinder
f) the guts to cut the roof off

Here's the frame riveted in place from above with the 1/8 in rivets...

All that's left to do is the 40 or so 1/4 in rivets from below, then the car is finished... I'll do those tomorrow night...

Good job KV, almost time to update your sig!